meanwhile

...But possibly not better than if you had just learned to pedal properly without clipless. Because, really, keeping your feet on the pedals while moving them reasonably fast is not a terribly hard skill to master - I'm sure that you could have done it.

meanwhile

I am awed by some people's belief in their own physical incapacity.

As for losing the pedal on the upstroke, strain gauge tests show that people simply can't get their feet out of the way that fast - if they could, then they would be able to pull up on the pedals and exert force. Which you have already said they can't.

meanwhile

It makes sense depending on the cause. Reading "out of breath" as "high heart rate and blood pressure" anyway. When you push a muscle for too much force output then pushing blood through it becomes more difficult - this is why weightlifters can go read faced. So dropping to a gear where power output is the same and force per cycle is less can reduce this.

chasm54

meanwhile, I have often admired your scientific expertise, especially in the helmet thread. But in this discussion we are not just talking about physics. Confidence is not a matter of physics, and using clipless does increase one's confidence and therefore one's preparedness to "go for it" while out of the saddle.

No doubt this level of efficiency can be achieved through training, with platforms. But there may be a reason why professionals have felt it useful to go with some form of retention, whetehr clips and straps or clipless, for over 100 years.

spdracr39

Except that I have learned to pull on the upstroke and it does add to my overall power output. Might be a small amount but it counts. When I first got them I could mash for a while then pull for a while and it gave me added endurance on long steep hills. Now I just push and pull around. You don't have the pull up option on flat pedals so those alternate, added muscles go unused. Because people that ride flats don't use these muscles they try clipless and nothing happens. Like any other muscle group it takes time to develop it then they can and will work for you. As someone else stated earlier if the clipless didn't work the pros wouldn't use them. Are they necessary to be a lean mean biking machine ? Absolutely not. Will they make a lean mean biking machine better ? 100% Absolutely Yes !!

Sullalto

I can't maintain as high a cadence on platform pedals, personally.

Not particularly climbing relevant, but still helpful.

superslomo

One point that's less mathematical than all of the above, but I find myself coming back to on longer trips up longer hills: focus on keeping your face, arms and shoulders relaxed. If your face is loose, not grimacing, you will tire yourself out less. I can't explain it exactly, but it's something I was told by a pretty quick roadie years ago, and it works for me. When I find myself clenching excessively on the bar tops, I make a conscious effort to relax my face, jaw and upper body, and I find I'm less tired out by the activity. Also, when in direst of straits, try and look around you and take in the scenery, or just zone out, stop looking up hill in front of you and just watch the blur of pavement in front of your front wheel. These things help me mentally as well as physically, and I'm not a strong climber, though I am having to get into the habit of it nowadays, having moved to a hillier place and gotten back on the bike after years in NYC.

LGHT

Wow this is exactly what I've done the last few rides and it did help quit a bit mentally. Instead at focusing on the peak I just started staring just in front of my tire to focus on not hitting debris in the road. I did this on a long hill and a few minutes later I was almost to the top and didn't even realize it. I tried it on the next hill and had the same this helps feeling. I haven't tried to relax anything, but I will defiantly give it a go on the next hill ride.

superslomo

I think the concept is that when your face is tight, you're actually using energy and core strength to squeeze all your muscles into knots out of the stress. When you loosen your face up, you automatically loosen up your shoulders, and if you do so while relaxing your death grip on the bars, you'll waste less energy and get more fluidity in your motion. It works for me, but YMMV.

Jack Lorington

In the past I had Marin but now I want to take electric bike