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No longer commuting with drop bars

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Old 06-11-15 | 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by spare_wheel
If you are going to get all lecturey you should at least get your facts right. Linux is a kernel not an operating system.
Linux is an OS built on the Linux kernel. Linux - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Last edited by gregf83; 06-12-15 at 07:45 AM.
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Old 06-11-15 | 11:29 PM
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Originally Posted by tigerteeuwen
let me clarify actually, a drop bar is better on a bike with geometery that takes advantage of it. i would never ride a dutch bike or a flat bar commuter because of the limited body positions availible and the efficency of pedaling.

if that makes sense....
I'll agree certain types of bars favor certain types of geometry to a point.
Roadsters (dutch) bikes are actually very efficient if ones parameters go beyond ultimate speed under ideal conditions, which is why they were the predominant type of bike for nearly a century throughout most of the world, and still enjoy popularity in traditional and contemporary forms where bicycles are considered legitimate transportation. On the same token, the same can be said for contemporary flat bar bikes.
As to limited body positions, if one can enjoy real world comfort and efficiency in one position there really isn't a need for more.

Perhaps your perspective is of someone who racers, rides all out, or in an aggressive radical manner, which is fine if that's what you enjoy, I sometime enjoy a brisk ride too, which is why I have a drop bar road bike and a path racer, but in the bigger picture I find their limitations more of a liability than their advantages can make up for.
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Old 06-12-15 | 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by spare_wheel
If you are going to get all lecturey you should at least get your facts right. Linux is a kernel not an operating system. OSX and iOS run on a completely different kernel (with an inferior open source license).

PS: RTFM!
Re-read the post, skippy. Operating architecture is not synonymous with operating system herein. Besides, your use of the term kernel is dubious - it depends on the context. If we're talking about an embedded system with a specific set of operating principles then the kernel is itself an OS. What you really mean to say is that the kernel differs from the graphical desktop environment, or what many know of as Ubuntu/Matte/Cinnamon/Mint/etc. iOS/OSX is built on a proprietary Unix variant...what is Linux? A modular Unix copy.

To quote you, RTFM.

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Old 06-12-15 | 10:48 AM
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[MENTION=175367]jfowler85[/MENTION], Linux looks and feels like UNIX, but it is a different code base. iOS and MacOS are based on UNIX, not Linux.
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Old 06-12-15 | 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by gregf83
Linux is an OS built on the Linux kernel. Linux - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
That wikipedia article is wrong. There is no distribution or OS called linux and any such distribution would get its posterior kicked hard in court.

FAQ | The Linux Foundation
Linux and GNU - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation

Last edited by spare_wheel; 06-12-15 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 06-12-15 | 12:03 PM
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I'm glad that we side-stepped the potential flamewar that might have resulted over one poster stating his handlebar preference...
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Old 06-12-15 | 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by jfowler85
iOS/OSX is built on a proprietary Unix variant...what is Linux? A modular Unix copy.
i honestly have no idea what you mean by operating architecture.

i used unix long before linux existed. the use of the term "unix-like" to describe linux resulted in legal battles and even today use of this term is discouraged by the custodian of the unix trademark.

some linux-based distributions don't have a posix-like environment so do not resemble unix at all. for example, the single most popular linux distribution is called android and is designed to be incompatible with a posix environment from libc on up.

Linux and Android, together at last - CNET
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Old 06-12-15 | 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by spare_wheel
That wikipedia article is wrong. There is no distribution or OS called linux and any such distribution would get its posterior kicked hard in court.

FAQ | The Linux Foundation
Linux and GNU - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation
Yawn. Re-write the wikipedia page if you don't like it.
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Old 06-12-15 | 07:24 PM
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I started this thread an am currently replying on a laptop running Xubuntu 14.04

This is a communist thread afterall!
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Old 06-12-15 | 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Johnny Mullet
I started this thread an am currently replying on a laptop running Xubuntu 14.04

This is a communist thread afterall!
Heh. I'm posting using a $150 chromebook running chromeos and ubuntu mate (crouton chroot).
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Old 06-12-15 | 10:18 PM
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I have had drop bars on my road bike. Since I bought in 2003. I wouldn't have it any other way.
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Old 06-12-15 | 10:47 PM
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Originally Posted by spare_wheel
Heh. I'm posting using a $150 chromebook running chromeos and ubuntu mate (crouton chroot).
LOL, what's with bike commuters and Linux? In my field, making high tech equipment, the world is waking up to Linux (including Android) very quickly, for machines that have built-in computers. As a result, I've been learning about developing software for Linux.
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Old 06-13-15 | 06:09 AM
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Has anyone replaced flat bars with something like the Soma Sparrow? For relaxed rides, it seems those might be more comfy. There would be an Android phone in the trunk bag.
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Old 06-13-15 | 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by downwinded
Has anyone replaced flat bars with something like the Soma Sparrow? For relaxed rides, it seems those might be more comfy. There would be an Android phone in the trunk bag.
I did this on my winter bike.

I had bought a swept bar for my wife's bike, and she hated it. So I put the swept bar on my winter-adapted mountain bike and gave her the flat bar, which she likes. The flat bars hurt my wrists. Just rotating my hands, and moving them back a bit, is much more comfortable for me.

A slight drawback is that you might have to get longer cables.
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Old 06-13-15 | 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by spare_wheel
heh. I'm posting using a $150 chromebook running chromeos and ubuntu mate (crouton chroot).
bfd! Nuthin' but OT BS'ing.
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Old 06-13-15 | 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by gregf83
Linux is an OS built on the Linux kernel. Linux - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Originally Posted by jfowler85
Re-read the post, skippy. Operating architecture is not synonymous with operating system herein. Besides, your use of the term kernel is dubious - it depends on the context. If we're talking about an embedded system with a specific set of operating principles then the kernel is itself an OS. What you really mean to say is that the kernel differs from the graphical desktop environment, or what many know of as Ubuntu/Matte/Cinnamon/Mint/etc. iOS/OSX is built on a proprietary Unix variant...what is Linux? A modular Unix copy.

To quote you, RTFM.
Thank goodness I decided to check on this thread so that I can straighten you all out. The correct name for most desktop variations of Linux is actually GNU/Linux.

OP: Glad you found happiness in your handlebar choice.
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Old 06-13-15 | 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott
I'm glad that we side-stepped the potential flamewar that might have resulted over one poster stating his handlebar preference...
Yeah that's right, and we end up with a bunch of people arguing about computer software and IT operating systems. I would much rather prefer to have a flame war about cycling specific stuff.
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Old 06-14-15 | 08:32 AM
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I commute on a 48cm Nitto Noodle. Being able to get into the drops on big hills and windy days is why I chose them. If my commute was shorter and flatter I'd have probably chosen a more upright position, but I've been commuting like this for so long that I'll probably stick with what I'm used to.
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Old 06-14-15 | 08:51 AM
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Ummm oh yeah well I'm currently posting this on Windows 7, take that linux boys.
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Old 06-14-15 | 09:55 AM
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Why haven't you just installed Gentoo and called it a life?
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Old 06-14-15 | 10:27 AM
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This is an interesting discussion. Where I live, most bikes that you can see around have flat bars. Most new bikes are MTB's, so it makes sense for them to have flat bars. There are a few road bikes with drop bars here and there, but most of them go back to the 80's. Generally, I'd expect at least 4 out of 5 cyclists here to use flat bars. Part of the reasoning behind this probably lies with cost, since you can get a decent MTB or city bike for at least 50% less than you would need for a half-decent road bike. Another part of my theory is that most people around here don't believe you can actually achieve any meaningful speed when riding a bicycle, because it's also not customary to use bikes for commuting.

As for me, I tend to use my MTB which I've gradually converted into a commuter bike with a bit skinnier tyres, mudguards, a rack and some panniers. The bars are flat and I usually don't have a problem with hand numbness when on my commute, since it's only about 16 km round trip. However, I do use gloves now because I used to have problems with that in the past.

Since I got my tourer, I've also done a few commutes on it. I've seen how much faster I can go with it whenever I'm in the drops. It also provides me with a much smoother ride since the steel frame absorbs any road irregularities a lot better than my aluminum MTB. However, I still believe I can achieve better control and better situation awareness when I'm in a more upright position. Therefore I'll continue using my flat bar MTB for most commuting purposes. This lets me reserve myself the pleasure of using the drops for the more relaxed weekend rides, and for outside the city in particular.
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Old 06-14-15 | 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by vatdim
This is an interesting discussion. Where I live, most bikes that you can see around have flat bars. Most new bikes are MTB's, so it makes sense for them to have flat bars. There are a few road bikes with drop bars here and there, but most of them go back to the 80's. Generally, I'd expect at least 4 out of 5 cyclists here to use flat bars. Part of the reasoning behind this probably lies with cost, since you can get a decent MTB or city bike for at least 50% less than you would need for a half-decent road bike. Another part of my theory is that most people around here don't believe you can actually achieve any meaningful speed when riding a bicycle, because it's also not customary to use bikes for commuting.

As for me, I tend to use my MTB which I've gradually converted into a commuter bike with a bit skinnier tyres, mudguards, a rack and some panniers. The bars are flat and I usually don't have a problem with hand numbness when on my commute, since it's only about 16 km round trip. However, I do use gloves now because I used to have problems with that in the past.

Since I got my tourer, I've also done a few commutes on it. I've seen how much faster I can go with it whenever I'm in the drops. It also provides me with a much smoother ride since the steel frame absorbs any road irregularities a lot better than my aluminum MTB. However, I still believe I can achieve better control and better situation awareness when I'm in a more upright position. Therefore I'll continue using my flat bar MTB for most commuting purposes. This lets me reserve myself the pleasure of using the drops for the more relaxed weekend rides, and for outside the city in particular.
Whats the cycling infrastructure like in sofia?
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Old 06-14-15 | 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by spare_wheel
Whats the cycling infrastructure like in sofia?
About 10 years ago it was practically non-existent. It started with a few wider sidewalks in the city center getting painted over and dubbed "bike paths". Just for example, you can look at these pics here for some of the most prolific cases. Most of these have already been abandoned by the town council.

About 5 years ago the council stated they wanted more people to start cycling so they spent some actual money and built up a few new bike paths. Most are still on the sidewalks (with a few notable exceptions), but some have a concrete surface. The problem is that they face the very serious problem of being disconnected from each other, as well as each of them being interrupted by other infrastructure. For example, you are riding along the bike path and are finally getting to put in some speed. Then you notice a bigger intersection ahead of you where the bike path leads you directly to the underpass, where you are supposed to dismount for about 50 meters. Then you have to climb up to street level and start up again, until the next junction comes up.

There are also other weird cases, such as having a two-way bike lane on one side of the road. As soon as you get to the end of it, you find yourself in the wrong way of street traffic with all your options at that point being to go on wrong way cycling, cross the six-lane road to reach your proper lane, or, step on the sidewalk and push your bike till the next intersection.

Since a lot of these bike paths are quite rough, it's probably not strange that many people would prefer a solid MTB in order to commute here.
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Old 06-14-15 | 07:02 PM
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Originally Posted by vatdim
About 10 years ago it was practically non-existent. It started with a few wider sidewalks in the city center getting painted over and dubbed "bike paths". Just for example, you can look at these pics here for some of the most prolific cases. Most of these have already been abandoned by the town council.

About 5 years ago the council stated they wanted more people to start cycling so they spent some actual money and built up a few new bike paths. Most are still on the sidewalks (with a few notable exceptions), but some have a concrete surface. The problem is that they face the very serious problem of being disconnected from each other, as well as each of them being interrupted by other infrastructure. For example, you are riding along the bike path and are finally getting to put in some speed. Then you notice a bigger intersection ahead of you where the bike path leads you directly to the underpass, where you are supposed to dismount for about 50 meters. Then you have to climb up to street level and start up again, until the next junction comes up.

There are also other weird cases, such as having a two-way bike lane on one side of the road. As soon as you get to the end of it, you find yourself in the wrong way of street traffic with all your options at that point being to go on wrong way cycling, cross the six-lane road to reach your proper lane, or, step on the sidewalk and push your bike till the next intersection.

Since a lot of these bike paths are quite rough, it's probably not strange that many people would prefer a solid MTB in order to commute here.
Those bike "lanes" you linked to are hilarious...but glad to hear that things are improving.
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Old 06-15-15 | 12:31 AM
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Originally Posted by vatdim
you can look at these pics here for some of the most prolific cases.
Holy cow those are ridiculous!
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