We can BS about commuters that are hill friendly and the need for disc brakes, because it sounds like the other folks see commuters as flat land bikes.

yes, east of 167. So, painful elevation changes for this older dude.

You can use a trigger shifter with any Nexus hub, the cable pull is the same. I've interchanged grip shifters and trigger shifters on several of my Nexus 7 and 8 bikes.

I've never used a 7 shifter on an 8 hub or vice versa, but my understanding is that will work too, you just won't be able to access all the gears or one of your shift detents won't do anything.

Hmmm. The thing about roller brakes is they suck out loud in all conditions. Not sure about conventional drum brakes, but my experiences with roller brakes in particular are not that positive. Personally I've been happy enough with rim brakes even in winter. If it gets really snowy, I'm going so slow at that point that it hardly matters that the performance suffers. Still. Of the available hub brakes, discs are what I personally would choose.

What roller brakes are you basing that opinion on? If it's what you get on bike share bikes, then I agree, but Shimano sells several models and the bigger ones with heat dissipation fins perform better (but they're heavier too). What I had initially was a disc brake on the front and a roller brake on the rear and that may be a nice combo. It doesn't take much to skid a rear wheel. Even a wimpy roller brake can usually do that.

Agreed,
My Gazelles OE rear brake was the smallest IM-30 that Shimano makes that is also typically used on share bikes and they are underwhelming at best. My Robin Hood has a mid size IM-45 on the back and its much better. The one now on my Gazelle is the IM-80 and its yet another step up. There is also the IM-81 that has additional fins on the cooling disc for tandems and cycle trucks.

If you can let go of the IGH, Volagi makes your bike.

http://www.volagi.com/shop/viaje-shimano-105-hydro/

And they do make a dynamo version of their "bulletproof" wheelset.

Nice bike but costs over twice what he wanted to spend. Unless you meant the 1 X 10 which is about $1,400

I don't know how much BSing I may do, it seems my preferences can be a direct challenge to some folks, as if speed and weight are all that defines the quality of ones riding experience.

Yeah, basically the bike share versions. If there are models out there that work better, that's great, but I don't see much reason to bother with any hub brake system that isn't a disc brake. That's just my opinion, of course. I ride rim brakes in the winter, personally, and I just don't get why anyone insists disc or other hub brakes are essential equipment on a commuter bike. Nice to have, sure, but when the road conditions get bad enough that a decent set of rim brakes really starts to become non-functional, I'm traveling too slowly for it to matter much. YMMV.

Basically exactly what I said above. :)

Apparently one of the other workers at the shop has an alfine 8, so I'll see if I can ride his bike for a bit or simply ask him about it. Honestly the nexus is cheap enough (you can buy an entire wheel for 200 on amazon.) that I'm not really worried if I don't like it. (The advantages of being a single male without many financial obligations are many.)

We'll see, I'll keep you guys updated.

For me, choosing roller brakes has been for simple economics. They're much cheaper and easier to retrofit than discs, and don't use pads or shoes. If or when I wear them out I can simply replace them for the cost of a few sets of brake pads. Besides that, it eliminates the need to replace worn rims.
Keep in mind I'm in the PNW, and deal with 9 months a year of wet weather riding which eats up wear components. I have nothing against discs other than pad replacement, and seriously considered a couple of bikes that have them.

Not essential, but cheaper and easier.


Oh yeah, one more thing, it keeps me out of the doghouse, because I bring my bikes in the house, and with hub brakes I no longer get that nasty black brake smut on the floors or carpet.

I have a big problem with rim brakes when the temperature is around freezing.
Several times I have had water freeze onto the rims, leaving me with no braking effect at all.

I now have a disc braked winter commuter, but before that I used to get through a set of wheels every 2 years.

[MENTION=365305]kickstart[/MENTION], those are some good reasons to try drum brakes.

I rode Citibike today and paid attention to the brakes. Citibike is the NYC bike share, a very big program. Most of the bikes have Shimano roller brakes. They can stop very well but you have to squeeze very hard. I have large and strong hands, so it's not a problem for me, but it could be for people with small or weak hands.

For the most part I tend not to be traveling that fast in bad winter conditions and when I was using rim brakes they almost always worked well enough. I did have a couple of occasions one year where I hit the brakes at an intersection and they did absolutely nothing. I don't know if it was just that particular rim and pad combination or just the right set of conditions.

For many years I was changing winter bikes and equipment frequently, - trying to figure out what worked best. One particular wheel has moved from bike to bike and is now getting worn out from using rim brakes in bad weather.

So based on experience I do have a preference for discs but I'm not terrified of using rim brakes in the winter either. If I lived in climate with less extreme cold, my preference might be for rollers instead.

It seems like the OP would be fine with a 3spd IGH, Sturmey Archer of course. I have A SA XL-FDD dyno drum and SA-RD5w. I also have a Rohloff 14 that I got for my Tour bike. Both have 8000 miles. Before that I wasted 38 years with 4 POS derailler bikes, what total junk. Faster starting and faster to the landfill.

The fastest and most efficient hub is the Sturmey Archer. NO doubt, in any gear. Mostly because the middle gear is direct drive. Just using the middle 3 spds I can go from 7% hills to 31 mph with just 2 clicks of the shifter. Stop to 13 mph, 2nd up to 20, then 3rd to 31+ mph, I usually am in 5th gear before that so I don't know. I do gear it higher than 99% of wussie users probably. 45, 54, 72, 92, 116 GI. Fastest ever at 45.8 mph and longest day was 126 miles. Sheldon's uphill advice for 3 spds is STUPID. I have little problem going high teens. My shifting can be finicky to 1st. The reason they last forever is the direct middlegear, which ought to be used 80% of the time.

How many clicks/ kerchunks for [MENTION=212987]spare_wheel[/MENTION] going 0-30 mph ??? 9 or 11? Lets see his bike carry a sack of potatoes.
Great bikes there @kickstart !!!

My Tour with Herr Rohloff and SA dynohub was 4200 miles, half city, 22 to 120 GI. Bike was like 130 lbs and did lots of hill repeat days of 75/ 85 miles. This hub is definately slower than SA, but still as good as deraillers, but NO kerchunk shifts. Unlike defaillers it Works thru ANY mud slime roads. Only been up to 41.6 mph, same hill. The direct gear is in a dumb spot at 11th gear. Mine is also high at 83 GI, so only good when chasing tri-geeks at 24 mph with a tail wind. ha 7th gear is a slug tho. ... Oh yah, 130 lbs = 8 TdF bikes, a WHOLE team is 9 bikes. Inefficient my eye. Totally dropped any loaded MTB guys I saw. Actually in the big crowded cities in Asia I didn't even bother using more than 2 gears.

Rim brakes with mud slime also gets you useless 20% performance and/or rim grinding. Why would anybody choose roller brakes over Zero maintenance drum brakes ??

I only went around the block with an Alfine8. They seem OK. I never see them being geared more than wussie either.

That is the down side to roller brakes, they require more effort and hand strength to stop hard. The SA drum brakes offer more power with less effort, but require a little more maintenance, and in theory the brake shoes don't last as long. That said, the 80 year old drum brakes on my Raleigh still have lots of life left in them.

They just brought in a new model bike on Citibike. I heard but haven't confirmed that the original maker is now out of business. The new model has Sturmey Archer hubs. The whole bike is much improved in my view, and the S-A equipment is part of that. The brakes require less effort. The gearing is taller. The rear hub ticks in that old familiar way. The whole bike feels lighter, and I can't explain why. Geometry? There aren't many new models on the streets yet.

There was a long thread somewhere here by a guy in eastern Canada and the original commuter bike he built with [MENTION=19437]Dan Burkhart[/MENTION]'s help. Dan, do you know where that thread is?

Hi Tom.
I have not had time to read through this entire thread, but here is the thread you asked about. The bike is still performing well. I'm in the midst of building another one for him with a Alfine 8.
http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...ike-build.html

IF Sturmey Archer ever decides to do an 8 speed that can be used with wheels bigger than 20", I would prefer SA drum hubs over Shimanos roller brake hubs. I really like the dyno-drum front hub on my path racer.

for the moment i'm sticking to 10 on all the bikes i commute on (3). and not only can i carry a sack of potatoes but also 12 bottles of heavy glass wine.

i agree that kickstart's stable is quite pretty.


hydros!


i have always coveted a bike with a 2-3 speed disc SA hub...

Thanks for the thread. The "heel shifting" was really cool!

I've looked at the frames available to me currently. The only one really worth looking at is an old Trek 750. However, I'm not sure it'll have the bosses/clearance that I'm looking for in a commuter. I haven't even looked at dropout spacing.

The other option is to buy a new frame. I was looking at some surly frames. They're basically classic frame geometries with modern amenities, in steel, of course. I was looking at the cross check and straggler. (They're identical except the straggler has disk brake mounts.) Do I want to spend the extra money just to have a disk brake up front... does it matter that much... I'm not sure. This is all preliminary of course. I'm still not sure if I even want to bother! The N+1 itch has caught me...

Surly frames are good in many ways, but they are heavy.

I have a Sturmey Archer 8 speed in a 700c wheel bike. With a 30/25 chainring/cog ratio, it gives me about a 32.5 inch low gear. Not too bad if the hills are not real serious.

Kickstart and I live in the same area. He mentioned a hill that few could ride up, most folks take an alternate route. The two routes I use as "leg keepers" for my commute route both have 1500 feet of gain in just 3 miles of the route, more or less. I cannot imagine some of the noted options for our area. Plus, with the rain and long descents, disc brakes are awesome to have!