I am looking for a winter commuting bike. I was almost made my mind on a Crossrip 3.

But then I started exploring the idea of a Dutch Bike with a more relaxed geometry, completely covered drivetrain, a gear hub and integrated dynamo lights. My new commute is short and flat (about 5-7 miles depending on the route I choose). So I don't really need a very light or fast bike.

I found this Vanmoof model which I really like, and it costs approximately the same as the cheapest Crossrip build (less if you consider that it already comes with lights and fenders)

https://www.vanmoof.com/en_us/bikes/smart-straight

The only thing holding me back now is that is is very different from the bicycles I'm used to.

Any thoughts?

Your favorite bike shop sell them? or you just saw it in the internet?

I saw them on the internet.

I think they mostly only do direct sales. In the US their only store is in NYC but they have free nationwide shipping.

I understand how everyone, not bike mechanics, wants someone else to buy things and tell posters how they like them, so you feel more secure in getting one..

I expect the 'Nation wide' is the USA... what is the Tax you add to a $2000 bike coming from outside Canada?



its just the frame that's different, tail & headlight built in it , no other choice.

lock in the frame tube is clever, but it does not save the wheels , just lock the bike to something..

I have a Dutch Koga, Bought Used, no North American sellers left, someone brought it back from across the pond.

It has a ring lock that secures the rear wheel and I added a chain to secure the front wheel and the bike to the bike rack.







.....

I guess you are right. It is just that the concept of dutch bikes is new to me. Everyone I know rides road bikes, mountain bikes, or hybrids. I've heard of hub gears before, but I've never seen one. And I don't know which brands or manufacturers are reliable.

Also, these guys seem to be a relatively recent company with a kickstarter-like business model. They do have a 30-day return policy so I guess I could try it and return it if I don't like it.

"Dutch bikes " are typically the upright 50 pound ones that are built so reliably they last through several generations ..

Oma and Opa, are indicating grandparents..

But there are all types of bikes made in The NL from those , to long wheel base cargo bikes and of course carbon race bikes..

But most US/CDN brands would be sourcing from Pac Rim countries, cost advantageous , then trucked or CN rail from west coast ports..



Even My Koga was built around a frame sourced thru the collaboration with Miyata , in a TW factory , then shipped to Rotterdam.



...

One sees them locked up around New York. They're probably heavy for what they are?

Unless you really like the design, I like the concept of this commuter bike better:
https://www.prioritybicycles.com/products/continuumonyx

i dont like the head and tail light positions. if you have front and rear racks you could block them, if you can work around that it might be ok. does the dealer where you saw the crossrip have a citybike you can ride?

VanMoof isn't very Dutch actually, as a concept. The geometry is not lazy enough, it's not upright enough and it's not as durable as a classic Dutch bike. And it's not heavy enough of course.

It's sturdy and clean though, cables and derailleurs are too vulnerable for Dutch bike parking, hub gears are weather proof and almost maintenance free. And they take bike theft seriously. I quite like the design. Personally I would never consider one because of the geometry and I love extreme durability, but also wouldn't like to be dependent on the company for the specialized parts and on it's apps and gadgets. The price seems a bit high, but that appears to be the case with all Dutch bikes in the US.

Not a traditional Dutch bike, but an attempted re-imagining of what a transportation bike could be.

Good -- Fenders, chainguard, hub gears, built-in lighting, disk brakes. Accessories section lists may things that seem useful, including a poncho. There's an overall systems approach to the layout.

Bad -- Geometry and riding position approximate those of a mountain bike, not a Dutch bike (but accessories might fix this). No rack or carrier (ditto). Site has lots of slick marketing poof. Lots of electronic thingies that might die in a cold rain. Some of the parts appear specialized, maybe it would be hard to get replacements. Stylists were allowed to do some of the design work and probably even run the company.

Overall -- My first impression was very negative, but a glance at the Accessories section showed it could be optioned into something I might actually want.

It's branded "Smart". Lol.

Dynamo lights are good - but you can get those on practically any frame - just the front wheel, some wires and two lights.

Gear hub - I don't like them, even less the fully enclosed chain - for those occasions I do get a flat in freezing weather. Apart from that - all good. If your winters are extremely cold with lots of snow and ice, probably a good idea - though a regular RD with friction shifters has worked just fine for me (small can of WD 40 does help sometimes).

Mudguards - definite yes for urban winter cycling.

Frame that acts as a lock - plain stupid IMO - just get a decent lock and be done with it.

Disk brakes - if you have hills and ice/snow, they make sense. If not all of the mentioned, rim brakes will do just fine.

VanMoof is perhaps a good example of fashion over function.

Workcycles and Gazelle are the most available Dutch bikes in the US. Here's a bit more on them:

City Bikes | LocalMile

A friend had a Velorbis Dannebrog that she really liked. Not quite as interesting design as VanMoof but still very nice looking. When it comes to daily riding there's nothing that beats a good traditional Opafiets or Omafiets though. Well, except perhaps a Gr8 which have become extremely popular with women.

My shop used to carry them and they had a lot of problems. We do not carry them anymore. Also, why would anyone buy a bike online when there's no option to actually ride the bike and see how it feels?

I have actually driven a Van Moof Q which I liked! They have a nice quality feel to them. The model you like looks amazing in person too.

While the company is certainly "dutch" they are newbies on the bike scene and very little history, knowledge about them that I could find on the internet.

I'm not even sure - I are they even Made in Holland???

Not sure where you are in Ontario but there is a Vanmoof dealer in montreal that does Test drives Might be worth the trip. If you are super keen on buying PM me - maybe we can do a '2 for 1' special price deal lol I may treat myself for Christmas

But is the feel real?

I read a piece from a railroad worker in the paper the other day, and they use VanMoofs, Taiwanese bicycle innovation with Dutch design he called them, for transport of the maintenance workers since 3 months. He claims half of them had broken seat post levers, 20 pedals are waiting on repair, wheels wobble, hubs rattle and most of them are audible from a distance.

This is a tough job for bikes of course, not really the best 'roads' and the workers used to heavy steel Dutch bikes aren't going to be easy on them either. But it confirms my impression of the older VanMoofs I see around here: They are not as tough as they look.

oh wow interesting to hear! they are definitely really light compared to "traditional" dutch bikes

[MENTION=474750]Zajebisty[/MENTION]: Yes, but a lot of modern Dutch city bikes are about the same weight because the frame is aluminium. But a lot of Dutch don't care about the weight, so they buy a 'heavy duty' aluminium bike with a fat tubed frame, double top tube and racks that can hold an adult front and rear, and then it gets above 20 kilos again instead of the 'normal' modern 15-17 kilo city bike. Most of them won't be as indestructable as the classic Dutch bikes from before the 90's, but they would probalby have been a better choice for the railway men than VanMoof.