I like dogs. I've always had dogs. Until two years ago when I was walking mine and we were attacked by a German shepherd left outside her fence by some irresponsible owners. We both sustained bites, I was pretty shaken, and my dog died a month later from the wounds.

I know it is owners who are the problem, not the dogs, but that doesn't keep me from being concerned. Fortunately, do not seem to have any dog problems during my seven-mile commute every day. However, my wife and I plan to ride a portion of the Katy Trail (in Missour) in the near future but I don't want to do it without some protection from problem dogs.

I would appreciate any info from those who carry something "just in case". Is there a product out there that is an effective defense against a problem dog? Can you point me to a website? Thanks.

Yell "NO!!!!" really loud when they are getting close. You must hold your ground and repeat "NO!!"

Usually it does the trick. Squirt from the water bottle if that does not work. Next step is A1 sauce .... it's that important.

Ive heard the water bottle trick works pretty well sometimes. You could always carry pepper spray too?

First, I am a dog lover. My Lab is the greatest.

For pit bulls, dobermans off-the-leash, and the like, see www.smith&wesson.com I can personally attest that their model 60 (caliber .357) will discourage such "dogs."

I try to act as if the dog is not there, and keep doing what I am doing so they do not sense my fear.

A few weeks ago riding in the country I saw a bull-mastiff ahead of me so I decided to charge straight for it. It quickly got out of my way and then decided to run beside me.

I was doing near 40km/h. When the dog realized it could not keep up it decided to try to cut in front of me. The problem was that, he it looked to the side that he was going to cut to, and this slowed him down; just as well I anticipated his move so I tried to hammer it even more. As this happened it must have brushed it's nose ever so lightly against my spokes, for I did not feel it, but the dog let out a loud whimper, put it's tail between it's legs and ran as fast as it could away from me.

First, understand that your high probability risk occurs on the dog's home turf. Darned few will attack outside that ring. [There're accounts about pit-bulls and their spawn tearing the neighbor's face off down the street. . .dunno' what that's about and 'fraid I can't help you there.]

Escalation:

1. Keep your ears open for that tell-tale jungle of a dog's tags accelerating on an intercept and down-shift and bolt out of there. Old timers get quite adept at this. Remember that Bingo isn't likely to go past his perceived turf. You gotta' be alert for this to help, no mind wandering.

2. As huhenio says, give 'em the voice. . ."Go Home", "No", or my favorite "I ***** Bigger'n You". It's gotta' be at a deep and powerful tembre like you mean business. Limit eye contact, but make sure your body language doesn't telegraph fear. 99% of your problem is solved with 1 and 2.

3. For repeat offenders 'cause you gotta' set this one up; household ammonia in a water bottle. [See, pepper spray takes some moments to react with the mucous membranes plus a dog [or a human] can get so aggressive it's overcome.] Ammonia on the other hand poses a fundamental choice. . .continued aggression or continued breathing. . .taps into brain stem issues, Maslow's Hierarchy if you like.

4. OK, you can go on the attack!!! We've taught these d@mned dogs [and their so-called masters] that there's no penalty for chasing us. Chase 'em back! I series of rebel yells is a nice touch if you know how.

BTW, don't pick a fight with Bingo's owner. He's probably got deadly force just out of sight.

My credentials? The canine relationship implicit in my "handle" should say it all. "On the Internet, nobody knows you're a coyote!"

A water bottle squirt in the face is often good - it usually freaks the dog out, like "what the h*ll was that?"

If an attack is imminent and you are going slow enough, getting your bike between you and the dog is a good idea, though it can lead to a stalemate. DON'T act scared or turn you back on it, try to be the alpha dog as said above.

I've never tried it, but judging by the number of postal carriers who have a can strapped to their belt, I think pepper spray is probably a good last resort if you are pretty serious about this.

Get an Air Zound horn. Works for dogs and pedestrians

If a dog is coming after me, I normally get off the bike, absolute livid in anger. I will probably kill the dog if I get a hold of it. It can "sense" that I am going to kill it. All I do is stop the bike, jump off and head straight at the dog - not a one hasn't ran behind the house with it's tail between it's legs.

The other thing that I have taken to doing (because I want to somehow make the stupid dog suffer for making me break cadence) is grabbing a handful of rock, gravel or something by the side of the road and seeing if I can connect. A rock that is about 1 to 2 inches whipped side arm into the ribs of a dog is a good deterant. It takes the fight right out of them. If the previous day a dog had escaped my wrath, I will often have a couple of stones in my hand, ready. It is a nice game to see if I can connect without getting off the bike. Any dog in the road who acts aggressive is considered fair game. Two points for a direct hit.

By the way, I actually love dogs - but a dog came out and knocked my daughter off a bike many years ago while we were riding together - and she never did get the courage to ride with me again. I wanted to kill the dog AND the owner.

Here in Costa Rica - the dog is just dead - no questions asked. The average Costa Rican is 5'4" (males), I am 6'2" and look like Herman Munster to them. No dog owner is going to try to argue with me about poochie.

Always remember you are a lot tougher than the dog - unless you act like a prey animal. When you act like the predator that you are (check your teeth in the mirror sometime) the dog does the smart thing and runs - after all, you are a lot bigger.

Still hoping for a dog that is dumb enough to get close... Maybe they aren't that stupid! By the way, I have killed 3 dogs in the USA who were dumb enough to come at me. I don't care if they are just following their instincts - I am just following mine. Destroy a threat. One time an owner was there - the dog didn't respond - and I killed it. The owner was understandably upset - I guess I wasn't very sensitive to them, I suggested that if they didn't want to lose their next dog, they spend a little training it - and themselves. It was a purebred.

My route tends to be swept clean of bad dogs pretty quickly. The dogs learn quick! I have seen dogs see me coming, run behing their house, and then after I pass - bother the next person.

Normally, I am actually pretty mellow - but I HATE DOGS WHO CHASE CYCLIST - AND I ESPECIALLY HATE THEIR OWNERS!

By the way, if the owner is present in the USA - the following words tend to ellict their complete assistance. IF YOUR DOG BITES ME, I WILL KILL IT AND THEN SUE YOU FOR EVERYTHING YOU HAVE. Works wonders.

Sorry for ranting - but man this subject riles me up. We shouldn't have to deal with dogs while riding because some idiot doesn't know to keep them off the street.

I have found that a lot of the time when I do have an encounter with a dog, which is often, they just want to run with you. I have had many dogs run along with me just because they wanted to run. I did not mind at all. Around here there is lot's of countryside and dogs are a part of life. Of the hundreds of dogs I have encountered over the years while biking I have never had one attack me or knock me off my bike.

I have learned though when approaching a hedge row out in the country to be aware of hidden driveways, dogs seem to appear out of no where, scaring the wits out of me. A lot of the time I enjoy trying to out run the dog, I have got in some really awesome sprints. If you approach the situation right you can get a great benefit out of it.

One or two dogs is usually not a problem, but if you have a pack of them it does not matter how tough you are you will get torn apart if you confront them.

I have to agree from results with the word "No!". Of course you have to say it fearlessly; but the word "No!" has one powerful difference from the other expressions. Virtually every dog understands "No!" and understands it the way you mean it.

The others may or may not be in the dog's vocabulary. For example, your last exclaimation. Our dogs would pick up on the "S" word which to them is associated with the "***** Kit" we use to pick up their remains when on a walk, and thus when they hear the "S" word, they assume that they are about to go on a walk.

!!Comatoa$ted spake. . .

>>> they just want to run with you

That's a great point. A dog that's interested in loping along with you will telegraph their intent to play by doggie body language. . .loping along in see-saw fashion and that doggie mouth-open-tongue-to-one-side "smile" thing. 'Course the danger here is some air-head with a phone up the ear will swerve to miss the dog and bag one of us. . .best not to encourage dogs running beside us.

The places where I like to ride are places where I will see 1 or 2 cars an hour, and if I do see a car there is a lot of room to go around us. Of course this is the commuting forum, and on my commute if a dog were to decide to chase me it would probably end up getting hit by a car. In this case I would not want to see the dog get hit so I would do what I could to avoid any sort of accident. But during a ride out in the country where cars are almost non-existent, in my area anyways, I do not mind a dog running with me. Sometimes when it is hot and a dog has ran beside me for a while I will stop and offer it some water.

One case I remember is when on tour and in the middle of no where. I had a medium size dog run beside me for what seemed to be about 10 minutes. I tired myself out trying to outrun it. When I stopped and rested in the shade I shared some food and drink with the dog as it relaxed with me. When I got back on the bike after resting the dog turned around and headed back home.

All the dog wanted was a bit of company, and since I was alone I did not mind having the company. The best part was the dog did not complain about anything and was happy to go at any speed I wanted, and was willing to rest when I wanted to rest. I have toured with people who were a lot less friendly and complained about everything.

It is always nice to make friends on the road no matter what species they are.

Two of the dogs I have killed were part of a pack. If a pack is after you, do you think you don't fight? Kill the leader, and the rest will leave. I speak from experience. If you run from it, it will run you down. You are acting just like a deer then. Even if it didn't start off aggressive, nothing seems to stimulate an attack like your backside.

I used to do a lot of hiking in Western New York along the Bristol Finger Lakes Trail. I used to always walk with a very strong oak staff (like 6 feet, almost two inches thick). It would be an amazing dog that will survive that - and they didn't. I did have a pack attack me once. They all had collars too. Someone's dog never came home.

Dogs are very afraid of our ability to hit them without committing tender flesh. Thrown rocks, spray, a club - all are very effective. After all, they have to lead with their nose. A wonderful target.

When I was young, I had a paper route - and there were aggressive dogs. You learn to deal, or you stop the paper route. I lost a few clients from the drubbing I gave their dogs - but I didn't lose any flesh.

I would never let a dog get close enough to run with me, unless it is my dog. Something that is fleeing signals "prey" to a dogs mind. Fooling with a dogs instincts is bad - and I am sorry, someone who lets their poochie run loose is asking for a dead dog.

I like to walk, I like to bike - and that means that I have to know how to deal with dogs. The only good dog in a road is one that is running away from me. I have yet to experience the friendly dog syndrome - they come out barking and growling - and I sure am not going to give them the idea that I am easy meat.

just my dos colones

I get chased by dogs and packs of dogs. I have been bitten by a dog. In Kentucky there is an old saying; "You can mess around with a man's wife but you better not mess with his dog."

Anybody ever watch "The Dog Whisperer" on National Geographic? It really helps you understand the mentality of dogs.

Anyway, just as you go by, don't make eye contact. Also stay confident and make yourself be in charge of the situation. Even if you're in their territory, they won't attack unless they sense you are weak. If they're coming and you can't get away, stand firm, stick your chest out and shout. You can say "NO." It doesn't really matter so long as you say it in a assertive tone. You have to try and get the dog's mind startled. Which is why spraying them with water works, too. It knocks their brain out of that mode. Kinda like when walking and correcting with a leash.

If it's a dog you can over-power, try and grab them by the neck and slam them to the ground. It's what their pack leader would do to them. And if dogs are trying to jump on you, don't let them. Ignore them. They are trying to dominate you.

Just tell yourself in you mind that you have it under control, and you can probably deter them.

Once while riding in a rundown
section of San Bernardino, CA I
attacked, more or less by a pack
of feral dogs... a couple of mangy
but NOT LEAN GSDs, a Rottweiller
and a couple of mongrels and went
right out and bought one of these:
https://www.securityprousa.com/50vostba.html

I have never ridden with it, and I haven't had
trouble with dogs since, but that one occurance
was enough to fear I was DOG MEAT! :O)

I now keep the unit in a bottom drawer
w/o the batteries in it and would hate
to use it on most humans.

Have a can of HALT! pepper spray. Have it on a strap on my bike bag and it's easy to grab when a dog is charging. Used it just the other day on a blue healer that was making a bee line for my ankle and it stopped him in his tracks. The dogs remember you after the fact too!

Peper spray might work good, its got some range too.

for big dogs that are strong and aggresive It hink they might just ignore it... for that I recomend a very strong tazer. Instead of a gun as we talked about on some other threads, I think I will have one of these since I can use it if needed and not have to kill who/what ever is after me... that just looks bad on your paper work and I would hate to deal with the cops.

Wow. Ever think of going into the Create Safe Routes for Cyclists business?

Just remember that whole be mean and dont act affriad jig might work with the nehborhood dogs, but wont do so well on trained dogs, or fighting dogs and the like.

The incredibly vicious nature of those things makes them pretty much fearless.

... till they meet with the SPD cleat of justice, size 13!

One of the dogs I have killed was trained. Still stupid dog. The owner was pretty upset that it was so easy to kill his "killer" dog. Trained dogs are over rated normally - makes for good TV though. Usually criminals just feed them poison, or use a club. About the only thing a guard dog does worth anything is bark. They are really good at getting you sued too if someone ends up on your property trying to retrieve a ball or something.

They may be fearless - but so what? It is much easier to deal with a dog straight at you than one that will sneak up behind you and nail you without warning because it is a coward. By the way - they are not fearless - they just act like it. Fearless when facing the dominate predator of the world that outweighs you two to one would be insane. Unless that predator starts to run.

One thing that concerns me when people talk about dogs is that think "pet" not "predator". If a dog is being aggressive, you had better know when it is being a predator - and you don't want to act like a prey. You also don't want to act like you are a beta male - good way to get bitten.

If someone has a trained dog out loose - the cops need to be called.

Most dogs are fine and friendly - but I really watch out for the purebreds. Many of them are inbred and have genetic problems, especially in the hips. Makes them very bad tempered - and scared. Germain Shepherds are in this category. I prefer mutts for dogs - good natured and healthy.

Had a dog bark and snarl at me today but it was my fault. He was sleeping in the road (bad idea) and I thought he saw me - nope, not until I was nearly on him. I scared him pretty good I am afraid. It was my fault. I say this to point out that many dogs are not an issue - most of them are not, and I really am a sucker for dogs. I really like them. However, not enough to let one bite me.

"that eddie's a real son of a *****." -american flyers.

Create Safe Routes for Cyclist business, hmmm, it has possibilities... But, wouldn't this be a protection racket.