No apology necessary, Ian. I was not offended by your OP. The BF Jackals are another story but their predictable OT baying is just mindless electronic static to me. Thanks for providing a sensible clarification of your intent.

[Howling at the moon]OOOOWWWWWOOOOOOOOOHHHH!!![/Howling at the moon]

I once had a guy ask for money that was on a old bike with a flat front tire. I said "hey I know a place that will put you up and give you some food." He goes "naw I am not that bad off." :eek: OK I look back at it now ... He defined himself as higher standards of another guy that would not ask for a hand out from a stranger and go where the help is really at. Don't be a buzz kill people define themselves.
V

I once thought it was my place to impose my view of the "right way" to ride a bike. Seems to me there are plenty of people who ride because they have no other way of getting around efficiently. I wish they'd obey the rules of the road. Most don't.

I ride because I like to. So, I guess I'm lucky. I've got a choice. Tough to place yourself in the shoes of the guy you see who is forced to ride as his means of getting around. I think, though, that everybody has the right to ride a bike.

I think there could be something that could be offered to the DUI cyclist or the poor cyclist to help them get off to a good start. Maybe the local non-for-profits could help out with the assistance of private donations, grant dollars, and money generated from the fines and costs imposed in DUI cases.

I guess the guy who chose to drink and drive had a choice too. I've not got anything against those who have to ride a bike because they can't afford a car just those who drink and drive. When they drink then drive they are making a choice, a choice that could cost someone else their life, this is when they are only thinking of themselves.

I know this has nothing to do with nothing but anyways......



A guy in my city wants to start a "homeless" soccer team. Yea thats right. You have to be homeless to play on it, and apparently the do it all over the US and have National Homeless Soccer Championships....



What if I was to start a Homeless Cycling Team? Maybe they would learn some "cycling etiquette" and all that. Maybe we could have a Tour de Ghetto race every June or whatever.



What does everyone think?

How on earth would you know?

Judges shouldn't be making a point by handing out bike locks and lights, but there should be some kind of resource or list of resources available to them what just lost their license. How 'bout along with all the other mandatory programming, a driver's education refresher course that includes alternatives to driving, like public transport and bicycling.

Nice to see people dumping on DUI drivers like second class citizens. How 'bout we round them up and put them in camps, have done with them? MADD has it's own detractors, including the actual Mom who started it up in the first place, and who has been quoted as calling the current organization "neoprohibitionnist."

*wipes tears from eyes* That is hillarious. Thanks for a good laugh :lol:

I like seeing anybody on a bike. Wrong way cyclists and stoplight blowing cyclists don't bother me at all. We all have our reasons for being on a bike. It's not like a club and we vote to admit worthy people. It's just a way to get around and is a valid choice for anyone with enough physical health to turn the pedals.

Teaching some "cycling etiquette" and all that to the homeless and other lesser beings.:eek: Perfect project to be run by suburban Roadies when they are not on "training" rides, or underemployed but also anxious to serve a noble cause, Certified Cycling Educators.

so go up and ask the unshaven guy in dirty blue jeans and riding the pink little girls bike with flat tires where he bought that "awesome piece of equipment" Then ask what he would take for it. 5 dollars later Problem solved hes got his colt 45 and you don't have to identify any longer with everyone that rides two wheels :D Don't forget to donate that bike:)
V

Don't forget to wear your helmet when you are on your high horse. Someday you may not be sitting so pretty, Jack.

You know this guy probably stole that little girls bike. But then I am not going to worry about it because it is the obvious helpful learning experience that the school of hard knocks gave this little girl about taking care of her possessions. Maybe I should go up and shake his hand and thank him for teach values to our children.
If I am jack... your off.
V

Having class (my definition thereof) has very little to do with having wealth. I have known many wealthy people with no class, and many poor people who would give you the shirt off their backs. My personal hope is to be the kind of person who will always care about others no matter what life hands me.

But some of these comments are pretty funny. ILTB, you do know some of these guys are joking; pushing your buttons, right?

Choccy: I agree with you.

Lil brown bat: I only know what I observe.

Baloney! The contempt posted for other cyclists who don't meet the BF profile is as serious as heart attack.The smug M.F's are all about feeling superior to the cyclists who do not meet or attempt to achieve the "Serious Cyclist Approved" profile of technique, equipment, and most importantly, social status.

I'm responding to what is written, not the secret "joking" code that you seem to think is being passed in between the lines by the "wise Men" in the know.

Oh, by the way, I'll wave at DUI cyclists, but only if they're using clipless pedals/shoes ;)

In other words, you don't know. You observe people riding bikes and judge who among them is "forced onto the bike"; you judge whether they're doing stupid things on the bike; and you come to the conclusion that most "forced onto the bike"s do stupid things when riding. False premise + flawed logic = bad "observation", no?

That's discrimination. :lol:

Why so much anger? Been hanging out in the roadie forums again?

Eh? I only have a few hundred dollars left in savings, reserved for next semesters books. I'm a klutz (pretty scary to watch me in a ''cross race) and my equipment is mostly Tiagra level...except of course for my bridgestone, which is the equivelent of Sora/Tiagra... 15 years ago :roflmao:

So technique? No...

Equipment? I know people that think I spend a lot, but I would never, ever, encourage people to make the kinds of sacrifices I do in order to get bike stuff. I openly admit that I am a fool, and those riding older bicycles without any fancy junk are thhe ones who know what's really up.

Social status? I'm a dirty college freshman. So nope, not the bottom, but hardly elite status.

Wrong way cyclists still piss me off though. Most of these seem to be college students, so I guess DUI is certainly not out of the question. Anywyas, it's a fairly harmless pet peeve on my part.

Disclaimer: the following is not a scientifically valid social experiment, it is merely an application of scientific principles to real-world observations.

Science is really based on observation, no? Then conclusions are reached through inferences or logic, unless you want to get all postmodern about it.

Lets revisit logic for a moment.

From my own experience: I have observed several people riding bikes in economically depressed (statistically lower than median income) areas of my city. Additionally, these people are often dressed in clothing which suggests low economic class: either clothes that do not fit well or signify their occupation, for example auto mechanic (or other "blue collar") uniforms.

They (the economically depressed riders) ride inexpensive or old bikes that appear to be poorly maintained or damaged/altered. They often ride on sidewalks crossing side streets without looking or ride contraflow. I also observe many of them cross the street without regard for traffic or weave needlessly.

The number of these riders has grown as gas prices have risen.

This leads me to the inference that many poor bike riders put themselves and others in danger through their riding style.

I could cite sociological abstracts to back up the inferences above, but in the interest of time I'll skip it for now.

I realize that I skipped a few steps that may be contended but the point is, the original statement is not unreasonable. There will be anamolies and outliers in any situation.

Oh, wait, I forgot that logic has no place in these debates:(
--for those of you not in the know-the previous statement was an example of bike forum humor;)

That response is exactly why people enjoy pushing your buttons.

I think it is possible to see some sad situations as humorous without having contempt for those affected. Take medical humor, for instance. My sister died of cancer and I can tell some pretty funny cancer jokes. That joke about the Tour De Ghetto would probably make most poor people laugh.

Seriously, though, this angry, provocative response to anyone who might smell like they think they are better than others is a running theme for you. You, yourself seem to espouse the vitue of letting others be who they are or desire to be....why can't you just accept the fact that some cyclists are elitists and you will probably never change that on this internet forum? Moreover, studies show that folks who are chronically as angry as you seem to be tend to die earlier. So what is the payoff?

I, for one, enjoy the variety...heck, I usually even enjoy your grumpy old self :). You remind me of a grumpy friend I have at work. I don't know why, but I find some comfort in the fact that he is going to react to almost every situation in the same old grumpy way. And, like you, he occaisionally makes me think of ideas I would not have on my own. Lastly, as I supsect you are, underneath all that crumudgery is a very kind person who is tired of taking on the world, but sees it as his moral duty. Yes, that's how I would describe it; a more fully developed sense of moral obligation that plays such a salient role in his character that it sometimes blocks out basic implulses that might make someone else think "being this grumpy about this is probably not necessary".

Realy? I for one enjoy homogeny. I'd say I respet that we like different things, but...y'know...I only listen to people that agree with me.