Brian T

I thought some of you might find this helpful in your tire selection.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKCSGbWbPyE

Jeffbeerman2

Nice piece. I wish I knew which other tires they tested (were the popular bontrager Hardcase or Schwalbe Martian whatchamacallit weave included?)

I tried googling it. That Wang guy has lots of hits on bicycle testing, but I couldn't find this test anywhere (I tried google and google scholar)

Brian T

[QUOTE=Jeffbeerman2;5616284]Nice piece. I wish I knew which other tires they tested (were the popular bontrager Hardcase or Schwalbe Martian whatchamacallit weave included?)


Yeah, I thought the same thing, overall results would have been better. Then everyone could pick their tires based on their riding conditions.

feethanddooth

i rode the specialized armadillo tires a few years ago. they add a little weight but i didnt get any flats. id purchase them again.

DickyJ

Flak jacket slicks are pretty good in my experience. No flats in 6 1/2 months.

Probably just cursed myself... Ah well, I want some hemispheres anyway

chrism32205

Ive been using them on 2 bikes for about 6 months, and after about 2000 miles of riding, no flats.. They are great

deathdriver

Armadillos work great against glass but not so much with the long, sharp pointy things. Last week they let a 2" long staple through. Still better than normal tires though.

Port

After receiving my third flat in a month of owning my bike on Friday, I am starting to look at better commuting tires. Two of the flats were tiny, slow-leaking punctures caused by glass. The one on Friday was a blowout caused by a pinch flat after running over a medium-sized rock with the side of the tire (700x25) on a MUP.

I'm not sure these tires would help in the case of the pinch flat, but they seem pretty good against glass. I guess the third flat was just a freak occurrence since I keep my tires inflated to the 100 PSI stated on the sides of my tires.

orange leader

I've always wondered how the kevlar is used to prevent flats since I've heard (not tested) that it is used in bullet proof jackets, and helmet for the military, BUT if you stab those items with a sharp object like a knife, they will fail. So... if that is true (perhaps it's not),... how would it stop a sharp object like glass or a nail?

apparently it works for Specialized.

derath

I have done exactly that on a set of 700x25c armadillos. Went over a half broken glass bottle, no flat.

-D

BarracksSi

I can vouch for that -- I've seen it done. It ain't easy, but a knife can get through Kevlar. The reason why it stops bullets is that it acts like a net and the fibers are strong enough to not get torn. But, like any fabric, a pointy object can work its way through (think of the personal shields in Dune... ).

Specialized's selling point is that its Kevlar layer is extra-dense. I'll guess that as long as it stops the first strike, and the offending object falls away, it'll be fine.

I don't have Armadillos, but... oh, I can't say anything, I'm afraid that I'll jinx myself..

hankbrandenburg

I'll go for the jinx here ... I got a new Specialized Sirrus as a commuter bike about two months ago. It came with the armadillos on it.

On the previous bike with conventional tires and tubes I got about one flat a week. I have yet to get a flat on the new bike; I am becoming somewhat complacent and less vigilant about sharp debris in the road.

I think Specialized is onto something with these tires.

jcm

The best anaology to Kevlar fabric would be a comparison to ancient chain mail armor - a type of sheet armor made up of tiny iron rings looped together. very effective against blows - even from a sharp edged weapon like an axe, but a bit more vulnerable to sharp penetration from an arrow.

Objects like sheet rock screws, nails,etc., which get upset at just the right angle can penetrate an Armadillo, or other quality Kevlar belted tire by pushing aside the small holes between the fabric overlays - just like an arrow spreading the rings apart in the chain mail vest. Very often, the arrow didn't even actually stick in the armor, unlike the Hollywood versions of porcupined infantry - but entered just enough to cause a casualty - then bounced back out.

Armadillos are by far, the best tire I've ever used - if you don't care about weight and some added rolling resistance. But then, an English footman wasn't exactly concerned about how fast he could run - just about how long he could live without a deflated lung.

Brian T

I can say that I've seen first hand the kevlar works in our vests. I think that there are some major differences between the two types used. Tire vs Vest.

banerjek

Marketing hype -- calling them "the most flat resistant tires in the world" is simply BS. I rode Armadillos for years for a combined total of easily over 30K miles. They are significantly more flat resistant than most other tires. I think they are a decent commuting tire, but they have a brutal ride and terrible wet weather grip.

When I rode Armadillos, I could consistently count on getting at least 2 dozen flats a year (this number would have been far worse on most other tires).

A couple years ago I discovered the Schwalbe Marathon Plus -- the Armadillos aren't even close in terms of flat resistance. In addition, the MP have a nice ride and the wet weather grip is much better. The only advantages the Armadillo has over the MP is lower weight and they're easier to mount. I've only had 2 flats ever on my MP tires.

jcm

The little I understand about Kevlar is that the differences have to do mostly with layers, not weave or actual structure. It's all weaved fabric. Obviously, no tire maker can fabricate a tire with body armor thickness. Might as well make it from concrete.

With body armor, the more layers, the less likelyhood of penetration between fabric cross over points, i.e., those holes in the weave that were referred to in the vid. Extra insurance is provided by some of the layers being laid on diagonally, thus creating a "cross-hatch" pattern which is more likely to cover the holes.

CAVEAT: I got this info from a tape series I ordered from The History Channel on weapons and armor - so it must be true...

jcm

I agree that Army's are not the only decent flat resistant tire out there, and the claim that they are the "most" anything should be considered marketing hype. But, they're damn good and riding them here in the wet Pacific Northwest has caused no problems as far as slipping is concerned. I don't agree that they are signifigantly less flat resistant than Marathons. My buds that ride those do as well as me when it comes to flats, with no discernable difference.

The ride is largely a matter of pressure. With all the structure in Armadillos (and probably with MP's, too) there is no need to inflate to maximum, although I typically do in back.

Brian T

Must be true...

I dont know what the real differences are, but we did shoot a vest in the field 3 times with a 7.26 round and it stopped it. I am glad that my tires don't pop and my vest works.

AEO

I actually had glass penetrate through my 700x25c armadillo tires, but no leaking.

The piece of glass that went through the tire casing actually left a pretty big hole in the armadillo. I removed that glass, and later when I went to change the tire for some knobby CX tyres I found a piece of glass inside, wedged on the inner side of where that big hole was.

For sharp knives they have a perforated steel with polycarbonate plastic vest that can go under the kevlar vest so that even if the knife goes through the kevlar, the perforated steel will stop it.

Think of midevil armor... chainmail, full plate, etc etc.

CB HI

Similar to my experience. I only bought one set of Armadillos because they handled so poorly on a fast downhill section of my commute. And they did flat on glass.

BarracksSi

Did you try cutting the vest with a ka-bar, though? That's what we did, and the ka-bar got through.

The kid wearing it was like, "Yeah, I believe it's knife-proof, go ahead!" The instructor told him he was crazy and made him take it off before cutting through.

BTW, this was a simple, older flak jacket with just Kevlar and padding and no rigid cut-proof layer.

nmanhipot

The ROI on the Armadillos just isn't there. I've owned at least four of them and only one survived until old age because it was on my track bike. Save your cash. Run newer tires with more rubber.

stringbreaker

got em on my commuter for over 2 years and not a flat yet.

atombob

I just mounted up a set of 700x23 armadillos and while they do feel pretty tough I have to agree that the wet weather traction is horrible. I almost ate it on a manhole cover and some brickwork at a crosswalk. IF they keep me mostly flat free, I'll say it's an even trade off. Ride slower and a little more cautious for not having to fix a flat in the pouring rain.
my .02.

BarracksSi

Hmmmmmm....

So, there are a lot of other tires out there that also have Kevlar layers and other goodies in the casing.

What if the better flat resistance of the Armadillos is due (at least partially) to a harder tread compound that doesn't pick up junk -- bits of glass, etc -- that would otherwise work their way through the tire?

I'm saying this because I keep hearing users say that wet weather traction sucks; a harder compound would indeed be worse in the wet & cold.