Bikecentric

Yeah I really don't think you should attempt to feed the dog or make friends with the dog - that would just encourage him to approach more cyclists. Let's face it, not everyone is a dog lover and a lot of people are afraid of dogs. I've been around dogs all my life and like them a lot, but I still think it's a bad idea to stop and try to feed or pet a dog that's protecting his territory - you never know how they are going to react.

Bikecentric

Don't blame the victim - the OP is just riding by and accelerating to get away from the dog that's not on a leash. What's he suppossed to do, slow down and maybe let it bite him?

devildogmech

Since when has that ever been found to be a good idea**********

mojomuskrat

Well, if you're resorting to mace as a fast, simple, lazy way, then you're either ignorant, or you have a questionable character and you may be hurting the image of cyclists in much the same way the folks weaving around on the wrong side of the road are. It isn't the image I'd want other cyclists to project.

If there are several dogs, you need to call animal control. If you don't want to "train the dog", pepper spray isn't the answer because it is training as well, and may/may not work the first round, just like the treats. I'm willing to bet the pepper sprayers haven't even tried that route, even though they're convinced their way is better. I'd take a week of 30 seconds of treat tossing over a week of 30 seconds of pepper spraying if I had to pass the same dog every day.

If you don't want to train it, either live with the chasing, talk to the owner (maybe you should mace them), or call animal control. Animal control is the non-confrontational way to do it while expending the least effort. Or, you could take a diff. route through the neighborhood.

mojomuskrat

google search on "what to do if a dog chases bike" results in many sites, from government web sites, cyclist sites, dog sites, and general interest sites. Almost all of the entries place mace at the bottom as a last resort or explicitly state not to use it.

https://bicycling.about.com/od/howtor..._and_bikes.htm

https://www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/traffic/dogs.htm

Fourth, there are many effective methods of repelling an attack, and I haven't used all of them. I have never used a spray, but I have ridden with people who routinely sprayed all dogs, innocent and guilty alike, which bothered me. My defenses are as varied as the dogs' behavior: 1) First, I ignore them. This method works with most dogs, and I use it on all dogs that are far enough from the bike. 2) Second, if the dog is close when I encounter it, I talk to the animal. Sometimes, I am friendly, and sometimes I am barking commands; it depends on the dog. This method is also usually successful. 3) I speed up. This worked better when I was younger. Now that I'm an old dog myself, most dogs can catch me. 4) While riding, I kick a biting dog in the mouth. Warning! This can be dangerous to the bike rider a) if your bike handling skills are not good or b) if your shoes are soft. However, I taught at least one dog to never bother me again that way. 5) I stop. Doing so stops many dogs. However, it is what I least want to do. When I stop, I always keep the bike between me and the dog(s) to avoid attacks, even though that behavior tends to keep the dogs riled up. Unfortunately, some dogs will pair and circle. 6) I pick up, or pretend to pick up, a stone or stick. Once they think I have a weapon, most dogs will back off. Some people prefer to use their pump as a pretend weapon. 7) I scream at the dog; many times if I can make more noise than the dog, he will back off. 8) I chase the dog back onto his property. Dogs will eventually ignore me, if they learn that I am bad news.
The most effective method does not involve the dog: 9) I have a talk with the owner. In these talks, I explain exactly what the dog is doing and why his behavior is dangerous to me, the dog, and to other people using the road. I avoid getting angry or offensive, even if the owner does so. Losing temper in an argument usually loses the argument. I also avoid apologizing: I firmly state that it is my right to ride on the road and that it is the owner's duty to train or restrain his dog. I make no threats and imply no follow-up (otherwise he might wait to see what I do). Most owners deny that their dog was causing any problems, that they have any control over the animal, or that they need to control the animal. But very few dogs ever bother me again after such a discussion. Basically, if the owner punishes the dog for getting onto the road or for chasing cyclists, the dog will quickly give up such behavior.
If all other methods fail, there is still one last remedy -- contact your local Animal Control.


https://www.naturepark.com/dogs/tips.htm

notable quote: Avoid using aversive training to stop your dog from chasing. Do not allow anyone to throw or spray things at your dog. All this does is makes the dog fearful of the bike or aggressive towards it and he will be more reactive when the next cyclist comes along.

https://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...&Number=676946


https://en.allexperts.com/q/Canine-Be...dog-attack.htm
A dog chasing a bike is practically all the time NOT after the rider, but after the tires on the bike. Simply STOP if your on a bike, and I believe he will stop his charge. Don't abuse him in any way. He will lose interest. Then walk the bike away until it's safe to get back on.

https://www.runningfit.net/index.php?...=159&Itemid=85

jduvall

Im confused is this dog coming at you as if to harm you or is he maybe just pacing you? Its been my experience if a dog wants to take something down it normally does so pretty effectively..

I do agree talk to the owner, explain your concerns for not only your self but his dog (explain that the dog could get injured in traffic no matter how lite should net decent results)

Aggression sometimes leads to further aggression so be wary with that, if the dog thinks you are threatening it things could go from a friendly game of chase the strangle smelling object to kill the threat really fast.

Be sure to document the time you make contact with the owner, if nothing changes call police/animal control explain to the situation and they will generally fine the owner (hopefully not take and put the dog down though)

YoKev

No sympathy for dogs that have *******/ignorant owners. I've had three incidents, walking and cycling, where the owner says "She/He's friendly, don't worry". I've been bitten once, and my dog has been on two occasions. Currently, I have a new player in the game of bike commuting. About once a week, it stalks me at the end of it's driveway and makes a leap into traffic. That situation will work itself out unfortunately.

I've kicked dogs in the head and dumped water on them. Afterwards, I drive by, get the address, and call animal control. That's my stance based on experience, and I'm sticking to it.

ok_commuter

+infinity

edit: social commentary removed

nashcommguy

+1 As stated before I've a four tier approach and assess each potential threat and respond accordingly. I carry an airhorn, spray repellent, bb pistol and a small buck knife. I live in rural Tn, but I would carry this and a Beretta Tomcat .32 Cal were I cycling urban, anymore. Not for dogs, though. Have used the airhorn in most circumstances, the spray once and the bb pistol 3 times. Have had one heated conversation w/an irrate owner after shooting one w/t co2 pistol and when he threatened to call the Sherriff, I offered him my cell phone. THAT calmed him down. Tn law states when a persuing dog reaches the pavement the victim is allowed to do whatever is necsessary to eliminate the threat. The dogs in question only give me a passing glance now as the sting of 3 bbs in rapid succession has a tendency to remain in one's sense memory for a while. If this seems reactive,well TS, I'm the one in the situation making the snap decision to be a victim or not. I choose not.

CCrew

I think you're being mean. You should instead write it a polite letter and ask it to stop

I have to ask though.. Is the dog coming into the road or just to the very edge of it? reason I ask is that I have a very territorial German Shepherd, but he's also well trained. He knows the property boundaries and he'll run right up to the edge of the road, but I've never seen him cross into it. Sure, riding by on the right side he's intimidating as heck (he's a *big* GSD) but i'm wondering if it's a similar situation with you. As an owner, I'd be pissed as heck if you maced mine while still on my property, and you'd hear about it. If he was in the street, fair game and it serves him right. You sure won't outrun him.

And we have leash laws too, but they don't apply on owner owned property so that may not be an avenue you can pursue.

banerjek

I'm not blaming the victim. He makes it clear that he enjoys racing a dog that is not hostile -- which is probably why he didn't bother to contact the owner before. In such cases, the way to keep from engaging the dog is to slow down and try not to provoke it.

In my view, the OP was playing the cycling equivalent of "I've got your nose" with the dog. Lots of people do this because it is fun. However, they shouldn't whine if the dog does better than expected in the game.

If you really think a dog represents a threat, you should contact animal control whether or not you can outsprint it -- the next cyclist that finds it might be a kid or old lady who's not as fast as you.

cooker

It's a dog that was bred to fight. It's a dog that angry people like to sic on other people. The fact that some pitbulls are even tempered or well trained, and some pitbull owners are responsible doesn't change the fact that there are a lot of pitbulls out there which are simply a mauling waiting to happen.

And of course when it happens the owner will say "He's usually so gentle. He's never done anything like that before!"

cooker

Your #1 is a bit strong. Spraying the dog with a noxious substance is not harming or injuring it. It may protect it from harm, injury or death.

cooker

lol, he wants us to wait until we're bitten.

cooker

So you expect strangers to magically know and trust that your "intimidating as heck"...*big* GSD" won't cross some invisible line as he charges them?

I don't think so.

Banzai

Many breeds of dogs have gone through this unfortunate fear and hype cycle as a result of scumbag breeders and dog-fighters. Once upon a time my German Shepherd would have been prohibited in many communities, because it's a "mauling waiting to happen". Now everyone says how wonderful GSDs are.

Pits, however, have spent an unfortunately long time on this cycle recently...so long the breed may never recover.

I personally believe Chow Chows are more dangerous than a Pitbull could ever dream of being.

YULitle

I'll only spray a dog that is within biting distance (or, looks as though it will be shortly) and in the road.

SSP

+1. As with riding in pacelines, "protect your wheel" is the order of the day. Any dog that gets close enough to spray is close enough to lunge for your leg and/or run into your wheel.

That said, I always try and assess the dog's intention - many are just being "playful". For those, a stern voice, or a "Good Dog!" will often defuse the situation.

But I've had pits come at me full tilt with head down, ears back, and no barking at all...their intent was very clear. Thankfully, full strength pepper spray seems to instantly divert their attention and they lose all interest in chasing me. It seems to work equally well when there's more than one dog - just aim for the leader of the pack.

And, unlike those who continue to insist that it's somehow "abusive" or "harmful" to the dog - in my experience they do not seem to be in any undue pain after getting sprayed. They just stop chasing, and typically head for high grass in which to rub their muzzles...but, there's no whimpering or whining, etc.

FWIW, I once had to kick a dog in the head with my carbon fiber soled shoe - that dog definitely was hurting (I struck straight down as it came snapping at my left foot). I felt kind of bad about it, but the dog left me no alternative (I didn't have time to deploy the pepper spray on that occasion).

jim6b

The idea that cyclists can train dogs to give chase is an interesting one. Often people, especially those most fearful of dogs, do not realize that making eye contact with a dog is understood by the dog (especially an alpha) to be an invitation to engage in social interaction. For example, dominance. So when a cyclist rides past a dog making eye contact, he is likely to provoke interest in the dog that makes a chase more likely. First rule, should be don't make eye contact. If is very easy to observe a dog in your field of vision without making eye contact.

While on the subject of training, you might also consider discouraging the offending dog from giving chase. Most owners discipline there dogs with the command "no". When being chased, I have shouted "no" and/or "bad dog" with positive results. While it does not invariably work, it has often enough to encourage (train) me to continuing giving it a go. When it does work, it is an easy answer.

If it fails, a contact with the owner would be advisable. But I would do it by an annonymous letter pointing out the laws and animial control's role. This method eliminates time spent tracking down the owner for what could be an unpleasant encounter that I would prefer to avoid.

happy trails

Machka 

Usually if you stop, get off your bicycle, and talk to the dog, the dog will realize you're a human not some fascinating wild animal, and will stop chasing you and wander off.

Unfortunately, for some cyclists, the very idea of stopping and getting off their bicycle mid-ride is unthinkable ... so they've got to resort to more violent techniques.

If you're determined to stay on the bicycle, I've found that "GO HOME" in a loud voice can work, or if that doesn't work, pretending to throw something is often quite effective. The dog thinks the whole thing is a game, so if it looks like you're throwing a ball or stick for him/her to fetch, he/she will dash off in the direction of your throw ..... and meanwhile, you make your escape.

Mr. Underbridge

I agree in principle - only problem is that 3 may put you at risk (dogs, crazy owner), and 4 might end up being a whole lot worse for the dog than 1. As in, death sentence. I've never been in the situation, but I can imagine #1 being effective in teaching the dog not to chase bikes while not risking a confrontation with the owner or risking the dog's life. Provided you can mace it without its owner seeing you, of course.

A workable alternative might be to take the owner's address and doing a reverse lookup to get his phone number and just call him.

SSP

That can sometimes work....if there's only ONE dog. Even with aggressive dogs, you can use your bicycle as a shield.

But, as soon as another dog (or dogs) shows up, you're screwed - they'll work together to outflank you.

Without some form of self-defense (e.g., pepper spray), I would not recommend the "stop and talk" technique (though perhaps the dogs in Canada are "kinder and gentler" and more open to reason than their southern brethren ).

SSP

Reporting a dog to the authorities won't result in a "death sentence", unless the dog has a documented history of aggression and biting.

I've reported plenty of loose dogs to Animal Control, and none have ever been put down as a result. Typically, the owners get a stern talking-to, and if they have half a brain they take steps to secure their dogs.

orange leader

Hey Thechemist,

I was bitten while riding a while back. Here's the link to my post. https://www.bikeforums.net/commuting/402064-dog-bite.html

I would not recommend going onto the dogs property to try to talk to it's owner. That's an invitation to be bitten because you're on the person's property. If you want to go the "talk" route, then call the cops, and have them give a warning, or even better a ticket for an uncontrolled agressive animal.

I have purchased the pepper spray mentioned in that discussion. It works well. I have since "trained" two different dogs from different houses to not chase me, or other cyclists. I've since seen them start to run out, but they get about halfway across the yard, and then stop. I've heard from several people about these same dogs before I sprayed them, and replied with "huh, they never came after me"... I have now trained them, and they no longer bother me or the others who commute via my route, I've gotten some thanks from the other bike commuters. Ironically I haven't used my pepper spray on any of the dogs from the home where I was bitten.

Even if a dog just chases you, an inexperienced rider, or child might get scared into crashing into a curb, or some other object. Or someone else may permanently harm the dog that is chasing it. heck before the pepper spray arrived, I was carrying my u-lock in my hand. Tried to use the u-lock too, but that dang dog kept backing off every time I swung. But if I had connected, that dog would have been in the hospital. Since I couldn't reach the dog, the next day I carried my polo mallet. The dog was in the house that day, so no problem. The next day the pepper spray came, and problem solved, no more chasey chasey.

Good luck with solving your problem. I greatly recommend the pepper spray. It conveneintly mounts to your frame, or handlebar or stem, and is very easy to pull off in an emergency situation. I wish I had it before I was bitten.

mojomuskrat

Some people will not be convinced, no matter how many government web sites, experts on the science of animal learning and behavior (my own PhD included), dog training experts, or very experienced cyclists I point them to. They're sticking to their "shoot first, ask questions later" mentality, and considering the reasons for the problem (irresponsible owners) is ethically questionable and isn't going to help the image of cyclists.

A dog chasing you thinks it is a game... it is less related to predatory behaviors, but rather "chase-proneness seems to be influenced by the dog's interest in playing with objects" and curiosity [1]. Chase-proneness is not significantly correlated with aggressiveness, nor fear of strangers. Instead, it is highly correlated with human-directed play. Chase proneness is negatively correlated with conditioned fears, which is why some of them stop chasing you if you spray them.

To those who think it doesn't hurt the dogs to spray them, research from the WWII era has shown that dogs have very similar pain threshholds and tolerances to humans, share analogous anatomy, and are affected by opioid drugs (like morphine) with similar dose curves. This means behaviorally, anatomically, and chemically the dog feels that pain the same way you would, to the point that dogs have been used as animal models of the human pain system[2,3].

From a learning standpoint, punishment is less effective than reward systems at maintaining long term intrinsic motivations that consistently support high rates of learning and behaviors (in this case, "not chasing" behavior). There is a wealth of literature along these lines, seek and ye shall find.

The bottom line is that unless you're encased in steel, you're going to encounter dogs whether you're cycling or not, a minority of which will pose an actual threat (ask your mailman or the guy you see out running all the time). Since you are moving fast, you are going to attract more dogs chasing you than a slow moving person would, but that doesn't mean these dogs want to attack you, in fact research indicates the opposite. Some dogs are aggressive and will bite you, but you're only going to encourage them if you keep running, especially if you strike/are aggressive to them (if the dog was playing with you and you "attacked" it). You are more likely to get chased, but you're no more likely to get bitten than anyone else who is walking/running by (those dogs are a serious problem for everyone, not just you).

Blame the irresponsible owners, don't penalize the dogs.

a few references, but there is a wealth of literature on these topics, because they are very practical things to know about!
[1]Svartberg, Tapper, Temrin, Radesater, and Thorman (2005). Consistency of Personality Traits in Dogs.
[2]Andrews and Workman (1941). Pain Threshold Measurements in the Dog.
[3]Short (1998). Fundamentals of Pain Perception in Animals.