I really want this thread to die a respectable death, but you're just a persistent itch that needs to be scratched aren't you.
You are trying so desperately to be a superior "know-it-all" on this subject and failing miserably.
I have never claimed to be an expert, but as you insist on being so pedantic, a "clip" is used in a "magazine." Don't be so smug. The M1 Garand has an 8 round magazine held in place by a clip. Satisfied?

Frankly, your posts are becoming more rabid. Keep stomping your feet telling us how "skilled and trained" you are. I really don't care. I'm done here. If you want to notch this down as a "win" on your side, so be it. There's really nothing left here to discuss, other than to correct your over generalized, racist statements. It's getting boring.

If you want specifics:
"The bicycling community is filled with idealists and middle-class white people who live safely in suburbs or gentrified urban areas"
Is the reason you are now on my ignore list. Nothing of any value can come from a discussion with someone holding that viewpoint. Have a nice life.

There are several thousand cyclists on BikeForums. Since it's "filled" with these happy delusionals, naming ten who aren't currently arguing with you shouldn't be hard. Go!

Yeah, damn squirt guns ain't got no safety worth a damn, especially them older models.

I unsubscribed from this thread a few hundred posts ago, I shoulda stuck around. Funny stuff in this thread. Kinda like putting MSNBC and Fox News on your remote and rapidly switching back and forth between them.

Apparently you're the one that's ill-informed because you've repeatedly gotten that facts of that story wrong. You only looked far enough to satisfy your world view and then you stopped. Do you know for a fact that a gun would have helped him? I strongly suspect not. More than likely he was on the ground before he knew what hit him.

Yes, there are bad people out there who will hurt you with little or no provocation. The question is, how likely are you to get into a confrontation with one and how much protection would a gun provide you if you do? The answer is different for everybody and every situation. The fact is that I ride through some sketchy parts of town from time to time and I am FAR more worried about getting hit by a car than I am of finding myself in a life threatening confrontation with another person.

As for the "Murderapolis" moniker you're so fond of, -that title was bestowed in the middle 90's. That was a decade ago. Last year 39 people were killed in Minneapolis. A tragic number. But that is less than half of what we were seeing in the 90's. Still, we could do better. New York, for example, is very safe place for a big city. They also happen to have very strict gun laws.

It's my view that people in big cities shouldn't be telling people in rural areas that they can't have guns. By the same token, people that live in small towns shouldn't interfere when people in big cities want to highly regulate gun ownership. Neither should the NRA.

Wait, I thought San Francisco was the Minneapolis of the West? But I know what you mean. Take away the big bridge, a couple of hills and they're practically the same place.

You're also right about Minneapolis cops being a bunch of liberal pansies. I mean look at these guys trying to defend us from the rough and tumble conservatives that came to town last fall:

http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/r...0pic-thumb.jpg

Shin guards? Even the horse had to hide behind a visor. Bunch of wimps. They look like storm troopers. A few Ewoks would take them out no-prob.

Oh wait. I think those might be St. Paul cops. Ah. Same diff. St Paul has bigger hills and bridges anyway.

But if only they were on Segways, they would be much more mobile, and intimidating!

(As debated in the Segway thread in the Commuting forum)

Funny you should mention that. The local police sometimes can be seen on "T3s" which are sort of Seqwayish, but don't call them Seqways when the police are around.

IMHO, horses are way better. The public likes them and they're very effective. Crap a lot though.

Somone also mentioned those in the "Segway Hate" thread.

Oh, and the picture on the first page [ http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=507024] of the SWAT guys on Segways is pure gold, see post #24 if interested.

Most of your "facts" are estimated figures and a poll.

Just a couple of observations:

-The USA will never be a gun free utopia or what ever anti-gun people envision (no matter what laws are passed)
-Violence is an inherent trait of life that some have learned to repress
-The internet is a breeding ground for I'm smarter than you arguments
-mjw16 posts a lot in this thread

Personally
- I don't care if the OP carries a gun
- I don't carry a gun, although I do own several
- I have been trained and understand the state/federal laws pertaining to firearms
- I have drawn a pistol twice with the mentality of using it (both times to defend my family); I never fired a round (in fact the perpetrator never saw the gun and retreated). It is not an experience I wish to repeat, but I understand how I (body and psyche) will react.

I own guns, but do not take them with me while riding my bike. Why? Because it's a really stupid idea. Drivers sometimes piss me off, usually due to normal human shortcomings, but every once in a while it's malicious. Once, a driver intentionally knocked me off my bike with his car. Even though I'm normally a peaceful person, I was immediately overcome by a blind, almost mindless rage, and, once I caught up at the next traffic light, I actually threatened to beat the driver to death with my U-lock. I was so mad it never even occurred to me to look at his license plate and call the police. In the state of mind I was in then, had I had a gun, I simply would have shot him, which would have ended very badly for me as well as for him.

And, for the record, in my lifetime, I have been robbed twice at gunpoint, but no money ever changed hands. It's not because I chose to emulate Clint Eastwood. It's because I ran like a rabbit both times.

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/e...k/page4647.jpg[/IMG]

well, if you are going to carry, do it in style.

Holy Crap! I need some of these! I have been taking my car to the trap shooting range because I couldn't figure out a way to comfortably carry my shotgun on my bike. They still in business?

I am not buying that argument. You had a weapon, and you didn't use it. Probably becuase you aren't a murderer. Why would a different, more leathal weapon make you more likely to act?

I would believe the converse more easily. If a law abiding person has a less lethal weapon they might use it, convincing themselves that they really weren't going to commit murder. Then if that less lethal weapon causes irreparable harm or death, they would feel terrible.

I think pepper spray is way too dangerous to be allowed. Had you had some pepper spray, you would be more likely to use it becasue of its non-lethality. Then the driver, now blind, would still attempt to drive away from the painful spray, running over countless innocent bystanders. See how a gun would prevent this senseless tragedy? And if it would save just ONE life.......

I must be terribly bored, getting sucked into this thread.

Full disclosure: This is a writing question, not a real-life one.

Any reason something like those Brooks clips couldn't be used to carry an M14-K?

yeah, they're still in business...they just don't make those products anymore.

http://www.brooksengland.com/

Guess I will have to keep my eyes open at the estate sales. :)

A take-down shotgun in a compact take-down case might fit in larger panniers or grocery baskets as well. That would also protect the shotgun from damage a lot better. So those bike clips really aren't all that practical, especially with the costs of today's sporting arms. But interestingly , I am pretty darn sure that putting a gun sock or leather scabbard over the shotgun and then mounting it to the bike in the way the photo shows would actually be compliant with Illinois firearm transportation laws.

My bike is blue and white and sometimes I wear black shorts and a white dri-fit with my mp3 player control on my backpack strap and have mistaken for a bike cop about 10 times.

You suppose they make mounts for AR style or Kalashnikov rifles? People would really think I'm a bit psychosocial.

Schwinnrider: My point is that I'm just not as scared of people as you seem to be. I mean, really scared, scared enough to carry a gun in a fanny pack while riding a bicycle. Imagine that, practicing practical, defensive shooting postures from a bike. You must look like a completely normal guy, straddling your bike at the range....please tell me how many times that ridiculous meneuver has come in handy. That's what I thought.... That's funny, ha ha ha. If this is the level of stupidity here, I'm bailing...

if you have a concealed carry permit, carry a gun. don't ask for permission or approval from people who are against gun ownership. being comfortable with a gun is a process that takes a while. most people have never even held a gun and it scares them. do whats right for you.

Amen Brother!

So, uh .... what tires are best for commuting?

:)

bullet-proof tires, of course. :D