I don't know, that would be a question for the founders of BD.com, but maybe, and i'm speculating here, it had something to do with them feeling that establishing their own brand in the market place would take too much time and the easier and faster route to recognition was simply to buy a defunct entity's name.

now that BD.com has established its own reputation with the "motobecane" name for over a decade now, it seems to me like deception is probably not a big factor in the equation, but if it still raises a red flag for you, by all means, don't buy any of their bikes. i can only say to others who are curious about BD.com bikes that my experience with BD.com has thus far been wonderful. i don't feel that i have been deceived by BD.com in the slightest bit. i got a great bike at a great price and couldn't be happier with my purchase. though i do freely admit that i got a bit lucky with the sizing. that is one area where a traditional brick and mortar bike dealer will ALWAYS beat an online dealer, and with BD.com you do have to be willing to roll the dice a bit on the sizing issue.

I don't think it is shady at all. I haven't seen anywhere that they are promoting themselves as the original companies. Kestrel is not making their carbon frames in the same plant they were 15 years ago. Now they are built in a Chinese factory & in my second hand experience, the frames have gone from being the most durable carbon frames made to some of the least durable. That's not shady either, but just a business decision regarding how to reduce costs.

At least Bikes Direct builds their bikes in Taiwanese factories with good reputations. My wife has 2, a Le Champion Titanium & a Fantom DS Comp. Both have been great. We purchased the Fanton at Cycle Spectrum which sells Bikes Direct bikes. That was one of the best buying experiences I've had. The owner of the shop did not try to oversell & was extremely helpful. The Le Champion was ordered online. One of the Mavic Aksium wheels had a spoke that came loose from the hub. Easy fix & nothing broken. Everything was packed very good. I wouldn't hesitate to purchase from Bikes Direct or Cycle Spectrum again.

Look, I don't have anything against bikesdirect. In fact, if my bike were crashed or stolen, I'd probably buy another one from them. However, what you are saying is simply not true.

Take this Bicycling Magazine review of the Motobecane Le Champion SL Ti:

https://www.bicycling.com/gear/detail...2733-0,00.html

No where does it mention bikesdirect. It says Motobecane with a MSRP of $4495. Go to the "Motobecane USA" website:

https://www.motobecane.com/rdti/slti.html

Sure enough, "Motobecane USA" lists the MSRP of $4495, but bikesdirect.com offers the same bike at $1999.99:

https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...mp_slti_xi.htm

What a great deal!! However, there is no "Motobecane USA" manufacturer, and there is no place to buy one except bikesdirect.com or perhaps Cycle Spectrum stores that are also owned by the same people.

A little detective work: The IP address of motobecane.com is 198.171.203.128. The IP address of bikesdirect.com is 198.173.103.8. Both appear to be running on a web server located outside of Denver Colorado:

https://www.websitetrafficspy.com/bikesdirect.com

https://www.websitetrafficspy.com/motobecane.com

It is very likely the same web server, owned by the same people. However, bikesdirect.com doesn't state that clearly. They do, in fact, mislead people. They mislead Bicycling Magazine and customers by making it appear as though there is a "Motobecane USA" manufacturer, and that bikesdirect is offering bikes at a steep discount from a MSRP that doesn't exist. The real MSRP is $1999.99 because bikesdirect is the manufacturer of the Le Champion SL Ti.

Same here except I didn't change out the saddle. 500.00 for a bike I've put over 12,000 miles on in 2 years. Changed out the tires to some 28mm Schwalbe Marathon Plus and have been good to go ever since.

Take a look at the Motobecane website. Yes, there is one. If you click on the "Contact Us" link you'll be brought to a page where one of the headings is "Vintage Bikes"

Here's what it says: "There are so many beautiful vintage bicycles throughout the years. We love hearing about your cycling treasures but do not provide appraisals or vintage replacement parts. One may have have good luck searching ebay or craigslist."

Sounds like they get some people contacting them about parts for old Motobecanes. They certainly don't come out and say: "Sorry, we have no real association with the original Motobecane". They're content to let people go on believing.

Another Gem on that page is the dealer locater. Kind of makes it feel like you could just go out and buy one from an LBS doesn't it? I put in my city, state, and zip. Apparently living in one of the top cycling cities in the US doesn't warrant an actual Motobecane dealership. I received an email telling me I could get one from BikesDirect or sportymamabikes.com (run by the the BD guy's sister or something).

Of course they're promoting themselves as the original company. They do that by simply using the name.

was there ever a Motobecane USA? I thought they were strictly an Italian company......so maybe "Motobecane USA" is a legit company......jus sayin

They were French.

Some other interesting info on their website is regarding warranties. Under huge headings you'll find the warranty info on Titanium, Steel, and Aluminum frames. What about CF? Well, you'll have to do a little digging to find that. Want to know what it is?

One Year.

Trek, Specialized, Giant: Life Time

Apparently they feel their paint job has an equal chance of lasting just as long.

No one is there , like at a bike shop, to tension and true the wheels , bearing adjustments , fuss with the index stuff..
and all the little things that are part of your LBS prepping a bike before putting it on the sales floor.

But if you already have those skills, then it may be fine.

brand names are another commodity you can buy a brand name,
then contract another company to paint it on.

I bought a Windsor Knight a couple of years ago. Took me about 10 minutes to put it together and off I went. I look at this a bit differently. I looked at what kind of components am I getting for my money. This model came with mostly ultegra components and when I looked at an LBS bike with that kind of set-up, it was close to $500 more.

Also I'm somewhat handy and do not have to run back to the LBS when ever the bike has a hiccup so I was not afraid of that aspect.

I have now about 9K miles on it and have swapped out some ot the components because of normal wear and tear but the frame is in fine working order except for some cosmetic issues which are my fault.

As far as the sizing and all that, the chart on their website worked fine for me and the bike suits my purposes. Like I said I've put about 9k miles on it and I am quite comfy on it.

Is a bd bike for everyone; probably not; but in my opinion if you can turn a wrench and want to save a bundle, go for it.

Given the perimeters people are criticizing BD for, I cannot see how
Bianchi escapes the "Scam of the Century" catagory by virtue of their pricing.
Built right along side BD bikes in a generic asian factory, but using the whole
"Italian Heritage" visage to charge crazy amounts of cash for a boringly
generic bike is deceptive enuff to pass into the gray area of 'unethical'.

LOL, BD rehabilitated Motobecane's name. Those 70's era Motos were junk. Simplex, Rigida steel rims, crappy frames, crappy paint...Even back them Asian bikes were better than Motobecanes.

If I had the money, I would have bought a bd bike. I didn't, so I bought something on cl that's heavier, has lower quality components, still isn't quite my size, and has the same warranty/service program (i.e. none). There are worse things for newbs to buy than a bd bike (and hey, I didn't even buy an x-mart bike).

Take a look at the limtation on the Trek warranty and you'll realize they can ding you for just about any replacement you try and claim against.
2 year cover on Bontrager forks and swing arms on FS models.
3 year coverage on their dirt jump and DH models (most likely to take the highest abuse)
phrases straight from the warranty:
■Improper follow-up maintenance
(Can you prove that you didn't over-torque that bolt? I bet Trek's engineers can prove you did.)
■Installation of components, parts, or accessories not originally intended for or compatible with the bicycle as sold.
(P-clipped some fenders on your CF roadie rig for a rainy century? Maybe just used some Speed-EZ? Yeah, you've voided your warranty because your racing rig was not intended to be used with those accessories.)

I'm sure there's some stories out there about companies with lifetime warranty going above and beyond for someone making a claim against a 25 year old steel bike that snapped a weld, and they offer some kind of massive discount on a replacement frame... but I'm guessing the more likely case is they'll lawyer up to save themselves a few grand by finding some miniscule reason not to honor the claim.
Specialized waranty states that you must have proof of sale that identifies the bicycle by serial number. Do you have a receipt with your bike's SN printed on it? They also disavow any need to replace bikes which have been damaged by "riding in severe climates" (does a PNW winter with 6 straight months of riding in the rain count? I'll bet it does) or "with heavy loads" (another vague statement. How heavy is heavy? 25 pounds of commuter gear? 60 pounds of touring equipment? I'm sure their legal team will tell you the specific limitations when you file a claim.

BD catches a lot of undeserved flak for their perceived wrongdoings against brick and mortar shops and for supposedly sullying the brand names they purchased.
Pffft. Whatever. I didn't see any effort on their part to "hide" the CF warranty coverage. It's spelled out plain and simple on the left side of the Motobecane warranty page, along with the coverage for their other parts.
If I look to get a CF bike in the future, BD is high on my list of places I'd purchase from. I've seen quite a few of them on club century rides around here, and a few people with my rando group ride full CF BD rigs for brevets.

I have now built two wheels starting from zero experience, and both of them ran dead true for > 10,000 miles, on a commuting route where the factory wheel was breaking spokes once a week. It's not hard. I just bought the parts, printed out Sheldon's wheel building page, built a truing stand out of 2x4s, some shelf brackets and a couple of aluminum pieces that I drilled and filed to put the wheel into. They took me about 90 minutes each to make, while sitting on the living room floor watching TV.

The rear that I built was retired and replaced with a wheel purchased already built (found a good deal) after the axle broke (crappy freewheel factory hub), the front I built when I switched to disc brakes on the front and it's still running.

Just truing is pretty trivial, if the wheel is built OK to start with. If I had trouble pulling it true though I think given my experience I'd just loosen all the spokes up and retension from scratch.

Wow. Thanks everybody for the replies. I am looking to buy some type of beginners road bike for my son (12 Yrs old) and thought this would be a good place to start. I am not really sure if he will stick with the riding so we do not want to invest to much into it yet. If there are some other types of bikes that people recommend i would love to hear from you. He is about 4'11" tall if that helps. Also, we live in Seattle so if there are some bikes being recommended, i can always head out and look at them instead going through Bikes direct. Thanks again everybody. Did not know this was such a sensitive subject.

Well, I can assure you that what BD does is what European bicycle manufacturers have done for many, many decades. This includes buying brand names from defunct bicycle companies, and keep many different brands separate. There are sensible business reasons for doing so.

One can of course argue that they leech on the brand name, but on the other hand, if BD didn't actually deliver some value for money, the brand name value would quickly diminish. Motobecane wasn't so hot a name either (there was a reason why they folded), and who would actually buy a present day Motobecane because they once used to ride one themselves? Probably only a fraction of BD's costumers even know the old Motobecane company.
So as argued elsewhere, BD actually makes Motobecane a better brand name than it was before.

So what do you think of QPB? They own Surly bikes, Salsa bicycles and Civia. Are QPB a shady company? Are the Surly brand the same after they got bought?
I personally don't have any problems with a company owning several brands, or that old brands continue under new owners, as long as the new owners doesn't use the name to scam and cheat their costumers, and BD certainly doesn't seem to do so.

--
Regards

I bought my son a Windsor The Hour from BD. He has only had it for a little over a month, but he has ridden it 3-5 times a week, 11-15 miles each time. So far so good. All we did was get different pedals, the rest is stock.

Gotta hand it to BD for their creative business model what with shadow company and website set ups.
If the price point allows would be cyclists to step over a top tube and ride one, it is all good. Same with a Wally World bike. It sure beats sitting on a couch thumbing furiously at Nintendo Wii.

+ 1e6

If these brands were worth what you say they are, someone should have had the foresight to retain the rights. I'm 45, and growing up, Moto is the only brand that BD sells whose name I remember. Never saw a Kestrel, Dawes or Windsor. I don't care about the name on the bike, I like the fit. I have been shopping them for a while as I save my money. So far, no LBS deal, save the Scattante 105 5700 at Performance, measures up to the deal you get at BD, and that's only if you buy on a double points weekend.

Fit aside, I don't see the problem.

[QUOTE
. . .
Mine went through the salt slush and mud season of Vermont with
only a few flats. Between the bombed out roads and the miles needed to
get ANYWHERE in VT, I think thats a pretty good test as to a bikes
worthiness. I say, tell people all is good , just do it ! [/QUOTE]

um. . . .the number of flats you have are not a testament to bike quality. ..that only relates to tires and terrain. . ..

Sooo. Back to the subject. Any thoughts on this.
https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...agesport_x.htm

Bought a Windsor The Hour, and with very average home mechanic skills, got it together real easy out or the box. Wheels were true enough. In retrospect, I'm not sure the chain tension was right--migt have been too tight; not sure if I got the headset tension correct; sure as heck didn't know enough to check wheel bearing tension (or maybe the hubs were sealed bearing?). Swapped it to fixed, rode it for a while, sold it at little loss.

Now, I r bike mechanic. Scares me to think of consumers getting box bikes straight from the factory. Nothing someone of even glancing mechanical skills couldn't competently make rideable with a weekend morning in the garage and access to the Park Tools website. However, it's far from an easy "insert A into B" assembly. Be competent with dérailleur adjustment and setting limit screws, headset bearing tension,'truing wheels, setting up brakes, etc.

Windsor Knight came into the shot after a customer bough one and self-assembled.
- cable routing was wrong
- headset was waayyyy too tight
- brakepads askew, brakes not centered
- front dérailleur crooked, limit screws
incorrect, cable tension off
- rear dérailleur cable tension close, low limit screw in too far
- rear brake pads close, brake not centered
- front quick release in backward

So be competent in the first place; prepare a chunk of time for assembly as a learning experience; or figure an additional box bike assembly fee into the overall price for assembly by your LBS... who might be touchy about your Internet ordered bike. (Not hatin', just sayin'...)

If you are adverse to saving a bit longer to get something like the Windsor Fens, you may as well spend the extra $30 now and get the Windsor Wellington 2.0 with the carbon fork. Both 8 speed, both about the same level componentry.

do ya think ?
thanks for the enlightenment