In the low torque/high rpm world of road riding, this may be true. But in the world of high torque/low rpm world of mountain biking, I'm not so sure. Mountain bike riders pull more on their pedals because of the way in which they have to ride than roadies do. Clipless...and pulling up on the back stroke... help a lot when you have to power over an obstacle at a high angle. Pulling up on the back stroke helps with sprints too. Since commuting could be considered a series of sprints, being able to pull on the pedals has advantages as well.

Try dragging a toeclip and flipping a pedal while trying to negotiate something like this

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r...e/52900001.jpg

She's not using clipless but it does makes it a whole lot easier;)

Going down that is easier...and faster...and safer...with clipless too. Slipping off a platform off-road is painful:eek: Slipping off a platform in traffic is dangerous. And trying to flip a pedal in traffic is an invitation to a vertical faceplant on the back of a car because you're fumbling with the damned pedals:twitchy:

They may have a small efficiency benefit. They won't make you Lance Armstrong, and if you're riding in the city, you'll probably still find yourself stopped at all the same lights.

I have one-side clips on my summer bike, so I ride whatever shoe I want to and from work, and save the clipless shoes for weekend fun rides and touring. I find that clips - regardless of any efficiency or other benefit - help encourage a steady rhythm that I can keep up for hours. That said, when I first packed my bike for touring last summer, it was unbalanced and combining that with clipless pedals lead to a couple of hard falls. After 3 falls in 2 days, I repacked and was fine from there on out.

+1. I think it's going to make me loose my mind. :innocent:

Great post. The thing is I think the benefits of clipless pedals and toeclips are so over-hyped in SOME CASES that it makes people sound like they would be idiots if they aren't using them. People should give them a try because obviously some people just love them. On the other hand people should feel like they have ue these pedals to get out and enjoy cycling to its fullest. I don't see clipless, toeclips or platform pedals as something that need to be argued which is better. It just depends. For me platform pedals are the best thing for me. Its been said before the OP should give clipless a try at least on some weekend rides or something to see what they think. IMHO this thread is giving great info on the subject especially pointing out alot of great options for a variety of pedals and shoes.

I use these on my bike that I ride around on for errands and casual rides with the wife. I prefer to go clipless but if I just need to run up to get some groceries or to the bar, I have the option of wearing normal shoes.
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=190948

i agree that personal preference ultimately can't be debated (though i do enjoy threads like this reading other people's opinions on the topic). my whole mantra of cycling is "if you're on a bike and not having fun, then you're doing it wrong". if platforms are what you enjoy riding on the most, then that's the end of the discussion for you. no one should ever be made to feel like an idiot for not liking something as much as another person, that's why it's called personal preference. i love, LOVE, LOVE clipless pedals because they make me feel like i become one with the bike, but if other people don't like that feeling as much as i do or if they don't find it as useful and conducive to how, where, when, what, and why they ride a bike, well, that's all good. ultimately each person has to find what works for them in their situation.

there are no right or wrong answers here, i just really love riding with clipless pedals, speed/efficiency advantage (or possible lack thereof) be damned.

This is the truth. I guess I get in a huff about it because so many people insist you have to have clipless, especially the roadies, and it's just not true. Just because they can't live without carbon and clipless doesn't mean it's the only way. It bothers me when people do that in cycling... the truth is, most noobs asking whether they need clipless or not haven't been riding long enough to know either way. I know people who switched and now swear by 'em, and then there's people like me who could care less. I just don't see the need.

The correct answer is: "You don't need them, but they make a big difference in feel. Whether or not you'll like that difference depends on your pedaling technique, cycling style, and so forth. Try them and see."

They feel better. They're easier for me to get into and out of than straps. They're better when you're trying to go faster, but don't make as much difference when you're cruising. Mostly, I think they just feel better.

I just started riding semi-seriously last year, and went from a crappy bike to a decent bike with cheap pedals, to cheap pedals with toe clips, to smarty pedals and cycling specific shoes, and I have to say that I liked everything except the crappy bike. :) I'm sticking w/ the clipless because I think it's more comfortable overall. It wasn't when I was first starting with them and I had to correct the improper positioning I'd become accustomed to, but now my feet don't hurt even after hours of riding. I'd like to say I got a huge speed boost out of the switch, but really I think that any speed improvement was from the improved fitness as I went along. Maybe a few extra mph downhill, maybe a little extra push uphill... i don't know.

Your comment about the feel of clipless is very much to the point; it's not ultimately about performance at all, is it? I gave SPDs a sincere try, even using them on a couple of tours, and they performed well enough not to disappoint me, but I just couldn't warm up to them, mostly because on a very visceral level, I just don't like feeling like I'm stuck to the bike. I like to have my feet unable to slip off the pedals, but the whole bike/human cyborg thing just makes me feel uncomfortable, no matter how much practice I get with clipping in and out.

I'm sure at this point that clipless pedals will never quite work for me,, but I don't agree with Grant Peterson's assertion that clipless pedals are one of the greatest frauds ever foisted on bicyclists; they clearly work really well for a lot of people. I just wish that some cyclists could be more realistic about their advantages. Last year I tried to sign up for an organized tour in Spain, but opted out after I was informed that clipless pedals were required for the trip, as if other kinds of pedals were totally unsafe.

This is what I have the most trouble with. Why on Earth would anybody care what kind of pedals you use? It's because they were told clipless is the only thing worth riding, and all "serious" cyclists use them... and they believed it. There is so much ignorance and misinformation being passed around as fact.

Ugh! Just this morning, saw people posting in the Road Bike forum about how clipless will "make you faster and is more efficient." Groan.

Well I have to say when I started this thread I wasnt expecting it to cause so much controversy! glad I gave everyone somthing to talk about!!

oh and i'm liking the PEDALS and shoes so far but cant say i've noticed a massive change in performance...although I did manage to reach my goal of averaging 18mph over my 14 mile route yesterday...

I went to several bike shops the other day and one of them I overheard on a conversation of a salesman explaining the benefits of clipless pedals and shoes to a customer buying a road bike. I cringed because I wondered if the person was a new rider. If so buying clipless pedals makes no sense to me. Just get out and ride for a while and come back to get your free adjustments and decide on pedals and shoes if you want to go that route. Of course he could have been saying all the right things for the situation since I didn't hear the whole conversation. He did mention the whole being able to pull up with the pedals etc...

I am glad the OP is enjoying the new pedals and shoes. I am glad other people enjoy them because that made it easy to sell all the ones I had laying around. =)

If you couldn't care less and you think it's a personal choice...as you first posted...then why are you getting your knickers in a such a knot about whether or not people use clipless?

Clipless pedals do offer advantages over toe clips just as toe clips offer advantages over nonclipped (would that make them clipless clipless pedals:rolleyes:) platform pedals. Toe clips and clipless offer a better connection to the bike over platform pedals. That means less possibility of slipping off the pedal in all kinds of situations where you don't want to slip off the pedals. They offer more efficiency while pedaling because even though the anti-clipless crowd says that you don't pull up on the pedals, you really do, especially when sprinting up to speed and it situations that call for more power like hill climbing and pedaling out of the saddle.

Clipless pedals, especially double sided mountain bike pedals, offer the advantage over toe clips of not having to flip the pedals and/or tightening the straps to secure the pedal/foot connection. If you don't want to clip into the clipless pedals, you can just misalign your foot a little and pedal. If you don't want to get into clipped pedals you have to deal with scraping the toeclip on the ground.

Then there is the comfort issue. Clipless pedals are more comfortable then clipped pedals. If, in an attempt to gain some efficiency and security, you tightened your straps with clipped pedals, the strap creates a pressure point across the top of the foot...I rode for 15+ years in toe clips so I know a little about them:rolleyes: Clipless pedals have some other hot spot issues but at least the shoes fit across the top of your foot more comfortably.

Liability? Someone one on one of their tours probably crashed when their foot slipped off a platform and crashed. Or they may have had someone crash into a vehicle or object while trying to flip up a toe clip.

Or maybe the company wants to ensure that the riders on their ride are at a certain skill level. While saying that everyone on the ride has to use clipless may seem silly, it's the touring company's choice. If you don't want to abide by their conditions, you don't have to pay money to use their services.

I also noticed that you ride clipped pedals on your chopper bike on your signature line. You don't seem to use them normally, so why do it or a 115 mile ride? Efficiency? Comfort? Choice? Advantages?

I'll stick with 72% and not fall over at the light, thanks. (I use toe clips without straps.)

did you get the answers you were seeking?

A small addition is something tjspiel touched on, shoe stiffness. Most clipless shoes have a stiffer soul then regular shoes. This adds to the efficiency of the system, but is also a draw back if you want to walk anywhere.

Half of my bikes have clipless, half are platforms, each serves it purpose.
Learn to track stand and you will have to un-clip half as much. ;) I can usually track stand even the cargo bike for 10 seconds or so (platform pedals). Fixed, which is SPD clipless with no brakes, can have me at a 10 minute light and I'll still be standing on the pedals like a goof. :)

Because people are passing off opinions as fact. I have issues with that. Personal preferences I have no problem with.

I understand they secure your foot to the pedal (sometimes too well), but you cannot physically sprint downward with one leg and pull upward with any significant force on the other, especially when you are standing. It "feels" like you are, but according to science, you're not. Even if you could, toe clips can do the exact same thing. If you have contrary facts to back it up, I will gladly recind my reprimand.

This is extremely convenient. I agree.

Comfort is opinion. I've been riding toe clips for 15 years as well, and I have no such comfort or hotspot issues. It's personal preference.

That's fine, except that it's quickly becoming common practice for companies to do this. What happens when they all require it? Why do clipless pedals have to be an indicator of cycling proficiency? I'm thinking any kind of foot retention would work.

I normally use toe clips, and have since the early 90's. I actually wished I hadn't used them on that bike, as the toe clips were hard to use with such a laid-back seating position. This year, I will be using pinned platforms on it, which will allow me to climb much more comfortably and still allow for some spin. I'm planning on doing the full 150 miles with it this year.

The study often quoted that demonstrates that people "unweight" more than "pull up" is somewhat suspect and runs counter to what people feel they experience in the real world. There have been endless debates over that study in this forum and others. I will suggest though that people may be pulling back more than up. When you think about the mechanics of running, it's the pulling back that moves you forward, not the pushing down. To me that says our legs were designed (or have evolved) to generate significant force with that motion and clipless takes advantage of that more than toe clips alone do.

Personally I feel I get the most benefit from clipless while standing. Whether it's because I'm pulling up or back I can't say for sure. I do know that when I rode home once without socks and my shoe kind of loose I did nearly pull my foot right out of the shoe.

Either way it's more efficient than without retention. You can certainly get some of the same benefit with pins on BMX style pedals and that may be enough for most people.

FWIW, in normal conditions I've never fallen over with any pedal type, platform, toe clips or SPD. The only time a pedal has caused me to fall was when I was riding on a very crowned road surface with about 4 inches of wet snow on it. When I hit the pedals the rear tire would tend to side-slip, and I had to put a foot on the ground INSTANTLY - a half second delay meant eating snow. I rode in that with toe clips for about the first 200 feet up a hill then flipped it over and rode on the platform side, and put the platform pedals on when I got home that evening (with the toe clips flipped over, they dragged in the snow every rotation).

If you don't like them, don't use them. I have 3 sets of clipless pedals that sit in a closet - I formerly used them, but don't at present.

If you were seeking confirmation that you can ride on regular flat pedals -- you have it.

If you were seeking confirmation that clipless pedals are a complete waste of money -- you don't have it, because people ride bikes for different reasons, which completely blurs the idea of what is a waste or not.

It's opinion.

Clipless pedals follow the ski binding evolution. Most serious cyclists use them nowadays for a reason . . . they offer significant advantages over the alternatives.

+10

:lol: