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Crash While Commuting? Tell us about it!

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Crash While Commuting? Tell us about it!

Old 10-17-11, 02:43 PM
  #26  
BridgeNotTunnel
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Curb*

I feel better now.
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Old 10-17-11, 04:23 PM
  #27  
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Late this summer, heading home from work on a particularly gorgeous day, so there were lots and lots of cyclists out riding - lots of new riders. I was coming around a 90-degree bend in the bike path that leads up to a bridge with a fairly steep incline. I was going pretty fast, had someone on my tail drafting me so I know I was moving, didn't mind the drafter b/c he was riding smart.

Anyway, as I start to turn into this corner, I looked up and back up the bridge to see if there was anyone heading down. Some riders bomb down this thing and then cross the path to run the light at the bottom (the curb cut is not a straight shot). Less smart riders don't bother looking to see if anyone is coming around the corner first before they bomb it (they have a clear view a trail below them). So I see this guy completely hauling down the bridge and I think to myself, "he's not going to stop!" So I veer as far as I can to the right to give him room to either shoot behind me (forgetting about drafter behind me) and to get away from him as I didn't want a head on collision or a t-bone...and settled for a left hook. I scrubbed speed quick and plant myself for impact - and he at the last second brakes hard and endos into me as I give him a shove/body block off of me so he doesn't topple all three of us. I think he tried avoiding me and other rider by cutting in front of us...his front wheel ended up in my spokes. He tumbles into the street turtle-ing on his back (awesome) and lays there for a second. He's super lucky no cars were coming at that time.

He eventually gets up and the many witnesses make sure *I'm* ok before heading off. We extrude bikes. His is a POS mountain bike, completely beat up and obviously not ridden much on the street at least (hey, he wasn't even following mtn bike etiquette of uphill = yield) but we both seem ok. I reamed him for a minute about slowing down and paying attention. Then made him check his bike for safety purposes (chain on, brakes working) and made him wait till I checked mine. He rides off after saying, "Too bad you were in my way." I like to think he was still in a bit of shock as he said that...but I doubt it. He was just an a$$.

Last edited by Catgrrl70; 10-17-11 at 04:28 PM.
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Old 10-17-11, 07:43 PM
  #28  
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I have had a few scrapes with clipless pedals falling at the strangest times. Conclusion - I don't do clipless. To old, to fragile and easily embarrassed.

I think October is out to get me.. Last year, October 25th (my birthday) headed to work at 5:30AM cold crisp dark day. Roll up to stoplight to go left on River Road. I have helmet light, reflective vest, front headlight and flashing tail light. Light changes I roll to the shoulder. Spot semitruck running light and rolling toward shoulder at 50+ MPH. See front headlight pass me and I jump my Bianchi over the curb, up over the gaurd rail and down gully in to blackberries and rocks. As I look back over my should I see the trailers tires hop the curb and crush the gaurd rail. He tools right along back onto the road. I was out for a while. Woke up, took 45 minutes to get back to the road. Covered in blood head to knees, a good sam stopped and called 911. Nothing broken, but sore as hell. Spooked me pretty good. 2+ months on bike.

Oct 3rd 2011... Lady ran stopsign t_boned me. Torn rotator cuff, meniscus tear, 3 broken ribs, road rash, blood and depression. "Didn't see me!" Insured with ticket and witnesses. Bike totalled (GT Transeo). Cant ride yet. Lots of pain and anger. Even if I could physically, I don't think I could mentally.

Next year, I am taking October off...
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Old 10-17-11, 10:57 PM
  #29  
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Three and a half crashes in seven years of commuting. In order of occurrence:
2005: I was irritated by a dump truck that pulled out into the street I was riding on right in front of me (like, couldn't he wait five seconds until there was no traffic) and then lumbers along at 5 mph. I hopped on the sidewalk to get past him, forgetting that the sidewalk has a sharper bend in it than the street at the upcoming curve. Went wide in the curve, fell in the grass, got up, rode to work.

2009: Drafting a coworker/fellow commuter on the ride home on the (usually deserted) bike path. There were two riders coming at us, riding side by side and taking up the entire path. My coworker and I kept riding, expecting the one on our side of the path to move over. Finally we realized that he has no clue that we're there. We both get on the brakes hard, but he weighs quite a bit less than I do so he can stop a bit faster. I left the path to avoid rear-ending him, and the bike went over on the soft shoulder. I managed to jump over the bars as the bike endo'd under me, so it fell but I didn't. That was my half crash. (The oncoming rider was very apologetic - he said it was his first time on a bike since he was a kid, so I went easy on him and just told him to remember that he needs to look out for oncoming traffic and other things in front of him.)

2010: Sprinting across a street to avoid a motorcyclist that decided to accelerate hard after I'd started across. Found a pothole that was apparently exactly the right size and shape to stop my front wheel - I never did figure out why I crashed there, but I suddenly found myself going headfirst over the bars. Landed hard on my arm and shoulder, went to the ER for X-rays. No broken collarbone (which shocked me), but I dislocated the joint between my clavicle and sternum. I'll have a funny lump there for the rest of my life, but no lasting pain or other negative effects, other than still being unhappy that I spent my son's eighth birthday in the ER instead of decorating the house for his party the next day. Totalled the bike - both the top tube and down tube were buckled, and I ran the carbon fork through the bandsaw before I put it in the dumpster to dissuade anybody from trying to salvage it.

2011: Front tire started to go flat right before the one sharp turn on my current commute. I didn't realize it was low until halfway through the turn when I needed to tighten my line slightly, and it suddenly slipped and dumped me unceremoniously on the ground. Lots of road rash and my thigh was black and blue from my hit to my knee, but no lasting damage. No damage whatsoever to the bike - not even a scratch on the paint. Note to self - slow down for that corner. It really freaked out the rider who was coming the other way and caused me to tighten my line, although to be fair there was nothing wrong with how he was riding or where he was positioned; I was just going too fast.

A few scary close calls (including bombing down a hill at 35 mph, expecting the light to cycle to green in my direction and not realizing that they'd changed the order of the signals earlier that day, resulting in me crossing six lanes of rush hour traffic at full speed - I still don't know how I managed to survive that one!), but no other actual falls.
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Old 10-18-11, 04:58 AM
  #30  
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I've crashed maybe 10 times in my nearly 2 decades of active commuting, and by "crashing" I mean either body or bike required some kind of attention afterwards. In addition to those I've done the failure to unclip a couple of times. It's far, far more embarrassing than anything else.

Most severe of these were in my early days of commuting, I needed some dental work done after a face plant due to rainy / slippery surface. Other than that, smaller cuts and bruises and minor repairing for the bike.

Out of the 10 I'd say 7 were my fault entirely (too much speed for the conditions, not being alert enough etc). 1 wasn't my fault but I should have known better (front brake lockup to avoid crashing into the guilty party, with predictable results) and in about two cases I couldn't have done anything to avoid the crash. One of these was a dooring incident.

I am apparently improving, because the interval between crashes is increasing, in terms of both calendar time and mileage. I am aware I just jinxed myself with this post.

Crash threads are worthless without pics. There's the "MS Paint your Mishaps" thread in SSFG that has total ownership over everything in this regard. [edit] Some of the mishaps there are NSFW. [/edit]
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Last edited by Juha; 10-18-11 at 05:02 AM. Reason: Added the NSFW warning
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Old 10-18-11, 05:18 PM
  #31  
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I had my very first crash this past Saturday...I was shocked! Actually LAID OUT on the pavement! Some bruising on my knee, had to get some minor bike adjustments, but other than that, all good in the hood.

Basically, I was in the Prospect Park West bike path in Brooklyn when a guy stepped out from between two cars. He was looking in my direction when he emerged and definitely saw me. I commute daily and usually I am very mindful of pedestrian right of way and will give right of way even if they dont deserve it. I was about 4 feet from him when I saw him and I feel like in these situations, one of two things can happen: 1. He will dart ahead on his intended path and cross the bike lane before I get there or 2. He will STOP MOVING. What actually happened was that he...and there really is no other word for it...moseyed. I didnt have time to brake or go around him and while I was the one on the bike, HE ran into ME. I lost control and fell OUT! My first instinct was the rage...I very politely inquired, "ARE YOU ****ING KIDDING ME??" to which he responded, "Miss, you ran into ME!" I managed to get out a "It's a ****ing BIKE LANE" before he disappeared into the crowd of like, a hundred people that were there for the American Cancer Society walk. I spent the entire day planning what I was going to say the next time the same EXACT situation happened...like, "You were looking RIGHT AT ME and not at a crosswalk...WHY would you not STOP WALKING when you see a biker coming at you at 15 mph?" or "I ran into YOU? Then why is your giant a** still walking around and I'm full out on the pavement?"

I did get one single "Are you ok?" from a fellow biker who came up behind me, to which I responded, "Yes, I am, thank you so much for being the only person to ask me!" She even added a "You know...these people!" So I felt a little better that at least one person sided with me...

Last edited by unterhausen; 10-18-11 at 09:39 PM. Reason: please don't defeat the censor
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Old 10-18-11, 06:39 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by 3 circles View Post
Oh yeah one more EMBARRASSING one: " Breaking in my clips on a first date"

I'm not sure what I was thinking but I guy I was kinda interested at the time asked if I wanted to go for a ride....so knowing myself and that I don't usually turn down an opportunity to ride I said, "yes". However there was one minor thing: I had just switched out my pedals and was just breaking in clips for the first time. DUN DUN DUN Dunnnnnnnnnnn!

I told him I would go but that I was breaking in clips for the first time and that i would probably get "dumped" multiple times.-- He didn't really understand what I was talking about( at the time he rode a MTB with baskets), but he said he was cool with it. So we headed out on the green way and I did fine for about 5 miles then we approached a stop and sure enough I forgot to clip out, and "BAM"!!! I imagined it looked much like a stiff animal that was being tipped over in a state of peaceful sleep.

I got back on with a minor gash to the elbow, and we cycled on.... made in about another 10 miles until I tipped over again. But the final clincher was when we headed into the sculpture garden up a grassy-rocky landscaped hill which wasn't really the ideal terrain for my bike to begin with, then upon reaching the top while messing around trying to switch gears we came to an immediate stop at a BUSY intersection!! Yup, you called it, I got my a** handed to me... It was totally embarrassing but when we arrived at the top everything happened so quickly I didn't have time to clip out and I got completely dumped unto the shoulder of the street. I musta fell hard because I tried for the life of me to unclip but I couldn't break my cleat free from my clip. I WAS STUCK on my bike laying in the street!! (I felt like the old lady on the:" HELP, I've fallen and I can't get up infomercial" --( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jdh3OusFF-k -fast fwd to sec 24) So, he had to hop off his bike and lift me AND my bike up cuz I couldn't clip out! It was awesome.... one of my prouder moments!! The next day I woke up with a HUGE bruise on my thigh the size of a grapefruit!!
Sooo did you ever see the guy afterwards?
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Old 10-19-11, 06:40 AM
  #33  
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march, 2002, NJ - at the time i was still a car-caine addict, doing +30k miles/yr just in my saturn. i was doing a few rides per week of "recreational commuting" and on one of my trips... i just left the apartment, was heading downhill towards an intersection. i had one hand on my backpack or something, making an adjustment and i saw a car approach the intersection (car had right of way) so i bled-off some speed with one hand on the bars... apparently i went over the bars and the next thing i remember, i was lying flat on my back, looking up at my bike flying through the air, at me. i had just enough time and sense to raise my feet and, before it landed on top of me, kick the bike away from me. i did a quick once-over and seemed fine. i got back on the bike for about 1-2 miles, and when i got off my bike my left elbow was STUCK and i couldn't move it. i was in extreme pain (and couldn't sleep) for a few days. X-rays didn't find anything broken. it took about 2-3 months to regain 50% range on motion on that arm, and a little over a year before it was back to 100% range of motion. it was a few years after that before i had any desire to get back on a bike, but that was a month before i moved to western NC, were a bicycle wasn't of any use to me.

Originally Posted by Juha View Post
Crash threads are worthless without pics. There's the "MS Paint your Mishaps" thread in SSFG that has total ownership over everything in this regard. [edit] Some of the mishaps there are NSFW. [/edit]
how about video?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-4UGUlbL1s

july, 2011, NZ - maybe he was trying to kill me? more likely he was trying to pass me despite no room to get around, no room in front, over the crest of a hill, against oncoming traffic, over the solid yellow line, towards a red light... then after he figures out it's not gonna work, aborts the pass by swerving into me. i partially lose control of the bike and crash into the car in front. the latest update from the police, after reviewing the video, is that they are NOT filing charges against the motorist

i'm still chasing this up with the police (can you please explain what criteria wasn't met, that you are unable to file charges) and other resources, but no real injuries for me, and one way or another i'll get reimbursed for damage to my wheels. still, i'd like to see this guy charged with "careless driving" or, better yet, "dangerous driving"... anything that gets him off the road will make the world a better place.
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Old 10-19-11, 03:08 PM
  #34  
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One too many, but here they are:

• My fault entirely. I was new to commuting and was an ******* on the MUP. Turned a corner that brings the Hudson River Greenway back under the highway around 65th St. Two bikes ahead of me. I shout "On Your Left," no one moves. There's ample room on the right. So I shout "On Your Right" and accelerate. As I pass he swerves into my rear wheel. We both go down; had I not had a backpack on (Ogio's motorcycling backpack...pretty awesome), I would have had road rash all up and down my back. He had a separated shoulder. I stayed with him until the ambulance guys said it was ok to leave, exchanged info. Followed up with him, he seems ok, but I still have major guilt over being such an idiot.

• Crossing a yellow light, T-boned into a cab that had jumped his light early and was speeding down the avenue. Was able to brake enough that my front wheel bounced off the driver's side door. No one hurt, I now know to never, ever cross a yellow in NYC on an avenue, since those avenue lights are timed to have a 30mph green wave.

• Riding up the 1st Avenue protected bike lane after a late night in the Lower East Side. Protected from cars, yes, but not from idiot drunk pedestrians. Two drunk guys decide it's a good idea to start running along the cars, then step out into the bike lane to cross over to the sidewalk just as I pass them. My handlebars clipped one guy's bag, and down I went. Hit my knee on the curb, got some bad road rash there, and tore my favorite pair of jeans. I had my u-lock in my back pocket at the time. Once I was done yelling at them and the adrenaline had sufficiently cooled down that I wasn't shaking anymore I found the lock hanging off the pedal of a bike locked up to a rack 10 feet in front of me. Best game of horseshoe throwing I've ever played!

• Just between Riverbank State Park and 125th St the Greenway has a sharp S-turn onto and then off of the road to hook up with itself again. Hit a patch of debris on the second turn and down I went. Road rash all up and down my left arm, and a sore wrist from where I stuck my hand out, but the worst was that my fork got bent. I still need to pack a broom into my panniers and clean that section up. And now I know to roll out of a fall and not stick my hand out. I'm lucky my shoulder ended up ok.

Last two weren't really my fault, but I'm still of the mind that all of these accidents could have been prevented. I still treat my commute as a way to work out, but I'm much, much more careful about it now and much more respectful to my fellow path-users. If only I could get that kind of respect from the cars....
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Old 10-25-11, 09:23 AM
  #35  
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endo accidents

A couple of years ago, an acquaintance of mine was riding down a paved trail in local canyon when someone stepped out in front of him. He hit the brakes, did an end-over-end (endo), and broke his neck. He is now completely paralyzed from the neck down. Sometime later, my 25-yr-old daughter was taken to the ER with a head injury. She remembered nothing of the accident, but her injuries (concussion and scraped forearms) indicate an endo. She had been coming downhill on her bike at the time. Also in the ER was a woman with a broken arm. She had been riding along when a bee flew into her face. She hit the brakes and did an endo.

All this led me to wonder how safe modern bicycles are. I experimented first with my daughter's bike: rolled along at about 2 mph and slammed on the brakes. Even at that speed, the rear wheel came right off the ground. So I began trying this on other bikes and discovered that many bikes are like this: it is easy to get the rear wheel off the ground by slamming on the brakes. In a panic stop, such bikes would be likely to do an endo.

Now it is true that one can bring such bikes safely to a stop. All you need is the presence of mind to hit the rear brakes first and squeeze gently on the front one. But accidents happen fast, and no one should count on having that sort of presence of mind. In my view, many modern bikes are death traps.

There are two ways to avoid this problem. One approach is to buy a bike with a long wheelbase, a relaxed head tube angle, and plenty of trail in the fork. In other words, a touring bike. (I now ride a Surly Longhaul Trucker.) On this bike, I can't get the rear wheel off the ground no matter how hard I try. The other approach is to put brakes on your bike that can be adjusted, and adjust the front ones so that you can't get the rear wheel off the ground. Cantilever brakes, for example, can be adjusted by changing the angle of the link unit that connects the cable to the levers. So far as I know, V brakes cannot be adjusted. After the accident, I took the V brakes off of my daughter's bike and installed cantis.
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Old 10-25-11, 10:30 AM
  #36  
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I am just getting back to full days at work from time off because of a bad crash at the beginning of this month...

I was on my way to work, about 7:30-ish AM. It wasn't fully light, yet, but it was light enough that some cars were out there without headlights on. I ride with a headlight, reflective jacket, and a blinking taillight.
There is a huge black spot in my memory, but what I remember/have been told is that I was approaching an intersection when a young girl (on her cell phone, scourge of the biker) turned left in front of me. The last thing I remember is seeing the tail-end of a car and me death-gripping my break levers. Next thing I remember is staring up at the sky with a crowd of people looking down at me.

3 broken ribs, broken collar bone, collapsed lung, completely separated shoulder, and a bashed side/hip so bad that it tore/scratched (?) the kidney on that side. 5 days in the hospital. Weeks worth of missed work, so far. Totally the girl's fault. Cited for "failure to yield" which seems painfully lacking, to me. "Attempted vehicular homicide" seems more appropriate.

There are tons of funny things about this: The day before this, I had "forced" myself to commit to commuting by bike by leaving my work-shoes at my desk, I finally registered here (I've been lurking for quite a while) so I would have a group to keep some peer-pressure on me, and that night I finally switched the crappy steel wheels on my bike with some aluminum ones. So much for those wheels...
Also, in a completely awesome coincidence, the car that was behind me and witnessed the whole thing was a customer of mine. He doesn't work anywhere near me, he just happened to be going down that section of road. He didn't even realize it was me on the bike until he hopped out of his car to help. He called my boss for me, talked to the cops, called my wife, took my bike to my office for me. I am very grateful to him for his help.


RIP: 1974 Schwinn Le Tour. 64cm, lugged steel beauty.

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Old 10-25-11, 12:24 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by alanrogers View Post
There are two ways to avoid this problem.
three...? i've never ridden a recumbent, but i don't see how it's possible to go endo on one.
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Old 10-25-11, 12:31 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Wolfwerx View Post
3 broken ribs, broken collar bone, collapsed lung, completely separated shoulder, and a bashed side/hip so bad that it tore/scratched (?) the kidney on that side. 5 days in the hospital. Weeks worth of missed work, so far. Totally the girl's fault. Cited for "failure to yield" which seems painfully lacking, to me. "Attempted vehicular homicide" seems more appropriate.
"failure to yield" is all you need to demonstrate that she's at fault when it gets to civil court, and you take everything she owns. talking on the phone and "careless driving" would also be appropriate, but i think "failure to yield" is low enough hanging fruit that she won't be able to beat it.
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Old 10-25-11, 02:13 PM
  #39  
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Three words: Wet railway tracks

'nuff said
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Old 10-25-11, 06:26 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by nelson249 View Post
Three words: Wet railway tracks

'nuff said
I have 5 sets to cross every day. Two are at about a 60 degree angle to traffic. They are lurking, waiting for me.....
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Old 10-25-11, 07:28 PM
  #41  
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Seasoned rider, rookie mistake. Riding a lower ground clearance bike than all my other commuters, made a slight right turn with right pedal down and slightly forward, pedal strikes roadway, I get bucked off to the left side of the bike and into the travel lane.
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Old 10-26-11, 03:47 AM
  #42  
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October 2011: Entered round-a-bout around 7am. I have lights on and ride a large visible commuter bike, Giant 22''. A car yields at a sign to my right then proceeds forward. I turned into the vehicle. The car ran over both my tires along with my right foot just missing my ankle. The bike slammed against my left leg. The vehicle slowed down but didn't stop. Just kept on driving.... Two police cars drove by me and didn't stop. I managed to pull my bike out of the intersection. Called my wife and then called 911. There was a 25 min gap between the two police cars and 911 call. The next officer who responded to the 911 call asked me about the gap in time... Really??? I just go hit by a car... in shock possibly? No witnesses, no license plate. The office didn't file a report. Just noted that I may have hit a curb. My front wheel was bent at a 30 degree angle. Snapped the forks in half. The right metal pedal was bent to the side. The back tire was bent to the point it would not turn. I have a doctor bill with two separate insurance companies involved now. A Curb!?#* It's been three weeks now and just starting to walk reasonably well. My commute is 6.5 miles one way to work. Now i am driving my car. Sad, hurting and still feel a bit of resentment.
- Glad I was not killed. Thanks for the space to vent a little.
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Old 10-26-11, 04:20 AM
  #43  
Juha
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Originally Posted by alanrogers View Post
All this led me to wonder how safe modern bicycles are. I experimented first with my daughter's bike: rolled along at about 2 mph and slammed on the brakes. Even at that speed, the rear wheel came right off the ground. So I began trying this on other bikes and discovered that many bikes are like this: it is easy to get the rear wheel off the ground by slamming on the brakes. In a panic stop, such bikes would be likely to do an endo.

Now it is true that one can bring such bikes safely to a stop. All you need is the presence of mind to hit the rear brakes first and squeeze gently on the front one. But accidents happen fast, and no one should count on having that sort of presence of mind. In my view, many modern bikes are death traps.
Welcome to Bike Forums, and sorry to hear about your daughter.

This is getting off topic, but yes, braking with the front brake so hard it lifts your rear wheel is the most effective way to stop the bike (there are a couple of assumptions involved, but that's the gist of it). Anything less means you're not using brakes to their full potential. Emergency braking can result in an endo, so there are devices on the market that do exactly what you're describing, i.e. weaken the front brake. It's important to realise doing this leads inevitably to longer stopping distance. Whether that's a good or a bad thing compared to a possible endo depends on the situation.

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Old 10-26-11, 08:01 AM
  #44  
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Had a minor collision with a group of pedestrians this morning. Motor traffic was backed up/stopped, so they were crossing against the light without checking to see if anyone was coming in the bike lane. No injuries worse than a couple bruises, angry words were exchanged. Even though this is the street my office is on, I've decided I'll probably change my route to approach it from the back way - at least 50% of the time I ride on this street someone walks out in front of me (it's smack dab in the middle of a university campus). Also had a close call with a cyclist that was riding on the sidewalk just ahead of me and randomly decided to move into the bike lane. Luckily I was watching him warily (had already seen him nearly mow down some pedestrians) and was able to brake in time. He went on to almost hit someone crossing (legally) in a crosswalk.
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Old 10-26-11, 09:21 AM
  #45  
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Sounds like a bicycle insurance company is much needed here.

I've had many minor accidents. The scariest one took place just before Independence Day of this year. As I recall, was talking while adjusting my handlebars and didn't quite tighten them enough, the day before. The following day, I was flying down Divisidero Hill towards Market street when suddenly I hit a crack in the road. My front wheel went into some miscellaneous direction, while I tried to keep my handlebars straight. I immediately flew over the handlebars as my bike followed me downhill. As I was landing, I heard the long screech of auto brake pads squeeze into auto rotors. I looked up to see a Mini Cooper's bumper, just an inch or so next to my head.

I suffered a dislocated shoulder, a hematoma on my right calf, badly scraped knuckles (should have been wearing my gloves), and a severely bruised ego!

- Slim

PS.

It's funny how we humans would rather sacrifice expenses to keep our health intact. That's no matter what the expense and no matter how minor the discomfort.

How much money would you be willing to pay, to rid yourself of a toothache?

I'd gladly ruin a pair of eighty dollar gloves to save my skin!

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Old 10-26-11, 02:03 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by alanrogers View Post
There are two ways to avoid this problem.
Juha has a good response above, but here's a fourth way to avoid this problem without sacrificing stopping distance: practice your emergency maneuvers. Sadly, many bikers will never do so (just as many drivers will never practice how to properly stop a skid), but it's easy enough to go to a grassy field and practice a few recommended procedures.

Endos can be prevented by keeping your arm stiff as you apply pressure to the brake; this will help keep your weight towards the back of the bike. Add standing up and shifting your weight back and you've got more prevention against endos.

Broken collar/wrist bones can be avoided by rolling into a fall. Don't stick your arm out.

Both of these techniques are unnatural at first, but if you practice them (mentally as well as physically), in an emergency you will be much better prepared. There are more techniques that can be practiced, but these are two good ones to start with.
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