Mr IGH

Interesting that it's being confirmed the SafeRide Dynamo light is the best light on the market battery or dyno. Just another reason to go dyno!

this guy is OCD about lights and he makes it clear the SafeRide is tops when it comes to beam pattern:
Bicycle lighting, mostly powered via dynamo, and USB power from dynamo

PaulRivers

That guy has an opinion I've never seen repeated anywhere else.

The Saferide would be a more worthwhile contender if it's battery life wasn't so abysmal. I was really disappointed to read opinion after opinion from people who actually owned it that 1-2 hours was the max - that doesn't even cover my commute to and from work.

Mr IGH

If you limit yourself to batteries then other considerations are in play. For best beam shape and longest riding time, dyno wins with SafeRide.

acidfast7

It's not 400 USD, but I don't want to have this discussion again.

acidfast7

It's a very nice website that demonstrates what I describe as "German-ness" to my American friends that I often see in Western Europeans (I know he's Dutch).

zacster

When all was said and done, $250 for hub, rim, spokes, nipples, rim tape, and light. That's without labor since I built it myself. Hub is Shimano 3N72, Rim is Mavic XM317, spokes were WS DB, light is B&M Cyo Premium, the most expensive version with all the bells and whistles. If you add labor you're getting closer to $400, but maybe not all the way there. I was lucky with the rims too, I paid $50 for a pair, and most decent rims cost a lot more than that, even in the lower quality range of the 317s. I'm not including the tools I bought (new spoke wrench, tension gauge) as I'll use those again.

So $140 for a wheel isn't bad even for non-dynamo, and add the light, which has gone up in price since I bought mine.

acidfast7

Quick check by me in 2 mins:

A317 rim: 49.95€
Dynamo 3N72: 71€
+50€ (at 2€/spoke)

still under €150 ... remove VAT and add US shipping and should be $150 to your door.

that's with a lazy Amazon.de search.

also, you should be getting way more than 2 years out of that set up. if you're wearing out the braking surface on the rim ... switch to a front disc or a cheaper dynamo (you should be getting at least 10 years out it.) the cheaper shimano dynamos are €20 and will easily do 2 years ... 15000km.

Mr IGH

Universal Cycles has everything at retail:
Shimano or SRAM dyno hub $100
Mavic rim $55
Alex rim $23
Sun $27
DT butted spoke/nip $1.11
DT straight spoke/nip $0.87

At the low end the cost is $160 plus labor, or you use them to build the wheel too, that came out to $190.

Mr IGH

He is very accurate and his comments are precise and reflect the engineering process. You're the guy that quotes unscientific Amazon reviews as proof.

acidfast7

That's a reasonable price.

However, Shimano dynamos can be had much, much cheaper than 100 USD that should easily last 2 years / 20 000km.

What you've spec'd out is a mid-grade wheel at a mid-grade price. I wouldn't say that's the cheapest way to a dynamo-powered system, which was the suggest of people posting above.

In analogy, it's like saying cars are expensive, then quoting a mid-grade car like an Audi A4 as an example.

acidfast7

That's because he's extremely quantitative.

It's by far the best lighting resource on the web, bar none.

Mr IGH

I was trying to show it's not that expensive to buy at retail using an LBS. $200 for a wheel with Nexus dyno/disc from an LBS is cheap when one considers the technology being offered.

Only $20 more for a Sturmey-Archer drum/dyno:

acidfast7

I see your point, but I find that quite expensive still.

Bike24 - Shimano-Mach1 Trekking Vorderrad DH-3N30 Nabendynamo QR - 810 V-Brake - schwarz

€57 probably about 70 USD to the states.

Mr IGH

Shimano product is much cheaper in Europe due to how the distribution system is done. For example; Wiggle buys bulk frames and gets Shimano at OEM kit prices, then breaks up everything and undersells US distributors. A US based LBS can't get hubs that cheap before markup. When we order from Wiggle, we get cheap but no warranty unless we ship back to Wiggle.

Mr IGH

This could be upsetting Paul's view of the world:

acidfast7

I travel a lot globally and shop. I never buy a warranty. The first time I was bit by this strategy was last month when my Japanese retina MBP lost it's solid state drive just outside of the one-year warranty.

Therefore, I usually don't consider a warranty on a consumer good that valuable.

I don't think that Wiggle is that cheap. Some places in the Eastern EU undercut them. I was tempted to buy a car when I was in Romania last time actually but I did want to drive anything back to Germany.

Mr IGH

I understand, I wouldn't worry about warranty on a Shimano dyno hub, I've never heard of one failing. It is hard to take a discounted mail-order hub into an LBS and ask for a wheel build I'm able to build my own wheels so I fall on the low cost side. I bought my SA 90mm drum/dyno NIB for $80 shipped.

Mr IGH

Reading his comments about
4.1.1 Philips LED bike light (battery powered with cutoff) (abbreviated as LBL) = Philips Saferide 80 (name change from ca. 2011)
it seems some of the earlier units had an issue with battery life, now it's fixed and you can buy the good battery powered SafeRide 80 with best LED from him here:
Bicycle parts: lighting

TransitBiker

Coming from battery to dyno lights....... the dyno is worth it. What if it's night time and your only battery is dead?

- Andy

Mr IGH

That's the old unit, it's been updated to Li-Ion as of Sept 2013, when did you buy your older unit?

Neue Leuchte Busch & Müller Ixon Core IQ2 für Stadt usw. | MTB-News.de

(I used google translate to read the review, not a lot of love for the old or new version)

Saving Hawaii

The Saferide wouldn't have any competition if it's battery life wasn't so short. The Ixon IQ Premium is a fine light but it's only real advantage on the Saferide is battery life. The Saferide is brighter and has a better beam. Turning it on late at night was a "wow" moment. You'd be riding down the street late at night with a car to your left and the pavement in front of you is much better illuminated than the pavement in front of them. The Ixon IQ Premium is a good light. I recommend it. But it doesn't do that.

jpatkinson

[SIZE=2][FONT=arial]I respect the opinions of those who believe dynamo-driven lights are a panacea; I tried that system for two years. I love the idea of providing my own electricity, of having an "always on" light, of having everything bolted in place, and the list goes on!

My commute is 15 minutes each way, at the most. In a couple years, it may double. I need the lights maybe HALF of the year (like most of us). I have hills on my commute, so climbing a a few of the grades with my old legs produces a flickering "suggestion" of a headlight when driving a Lumotec with an Alfine hub. Getting a Luxos U would address this, of course. If I were a hard-core commuter (rain or shine, longer distances), had flat terrain, and didn't have my Vespa or SUV for post-work errands or child-transport needs, I wouldn't be typing this.

It really isn't $190 for me: I would need a disc hub, so that's $123 for Alfine + $20 6-bolt adapter + $25 rotor + $23 cheapest possible rim (who would do this?) + $60 for spokes/nipples + $60 labor + $90 for the (equivalent) 80 lux dynamo version B&M IQ Cyo Premium shipped from STARBIKE = $401.

noglider 

I don't respect that opinion, but then again, I haven't seen anyone espouse it.

acidfast7

No. it's actually less than $190 shipped to your door. Depending on the exchange rate, that's about $160 or so.

at your weak argument.

interested

I totally disagree. I find his "tests" and conclusions highly subjective and very opinionated. The problem isn't so much that he has idiosyncratic preferences, but that he thinks he is highly objective. Eg. he doesn't like that the old IQ Cyo 40 lux "near field" model has a sharp cut-off beam, fair enough, we all have different opinions of what a good beam shape is, but it ends up as weighty criticism of the lamp, even though it is just a personal opinion. He also criticize it for not having a long throw which is slightly bizarre since the model is advertised a being optimized for a powerful near field illumination, not throw. If you wanted a beam with a long throw you were advised to the 60 Lux IQ Cyo "R" model.

IMHO, the IQ Cyo "near field" model has very good beam shape for the purpose it is intended for; urban riding. The near field is well illuminated which is good when navigating through broken bottles on the road, and the clearly defined beam shape helps car drivers coming from a side road to discover that a bike is coming, even before they can see the rider.

My point here is merely to show that a very different conclusion can be reached about the same lamp, and that his reviews are merely personal opinions and preferences, disguised as objective tests.

(update) I just discovered he is actually selling the stuff that he "recommends". So much for his independent "reviews". He doesn't mention that as a bias in his section about "bias" and "objectivity. He must have forgotten it, eh.


If one wants "quantitative" tests of bicycle lights, then nothing beats Olaf Schultz' home page:
möglichst umfassende Auswertung von Scheinwerfern

The beam shapes are measured with a Goniometer, so no subjective "beam shots" when comparing. The above link is just for his beam shots, there is a lot of other good stuff on his site. He uses "frames" on his website though, something I haven't seen for years on other web sites.