Today, on my commute in the morning, I was taking the lane on this section on 9W, from E. Palisade Ave to E. Clinton Ave: https://www.google.com/maps/search/R...73.9394318,15z
It's a sketchy bit, and it's easier if move over so cars can move around

I was pulled over and the officer gave me a warning. He had driven up beside me a mile back and told me to move over. He drove up beside me in the outer lane on a downhill section, but I said that it was less dangerous to take the lane. He was unaware of this tactic, apparently. I also said that he had me pulled over for 6 and a half minutes and it takes me a total of 7 minutes to ride the entire section. At this point, he sort of realized that I ride this often, and he asked me how often, and I said 3 times a week.

I was in full kit, with my mirror, helmet, two lights (front and back on a dynamo), fluorescent reflective gloves, and a reflective leg band. I was highly visible. The weather was clear, the light was good with good overall visibility.

My point in talking to him was that taking the lane is safer than having a close passing distance. He said if it's so dangerous then do not ride that section. I'm somewhat sympathetic. I don't like this stretch, and I don't like taking the lane. There's a painted median that serves no purpose. I pointed to it, and said if they just repainted the lane, then there would be space for cyclists. He shrugged, gesturing, like, "Yeah, I know." I also told him about the advocacy on taking the lane. I asked about the minimum passing distance in NJ, and he said he didn't know.

It seems that there are no passing limitations, though something did pass the state assembly last year: Move over? NJ Assembly passes bill to require 4 foot buffer between drivers, cyclists | NJ.com

Overall, the officer was professional, and I wasn't too antagonistic. He has a job to do, and I was going to my office.
Biking in New Jersey, Regulations, Commuter Information
39:4-14.1 Rights and Duties of Persons on Bicycles.
Every person riding a bicycle on a roadway is granted all the rights and subject to all of the duties of the motor vehicle driver.

39:4-14.2, 39:4-10.11 Operating Regulations.
Every person riding a bicycle on a roadway shall ride as near to the right roadside as practicable exercising due care when passing a standing vehicle or one proceeding in the same direction. A bicyclist may move left under any of the following conditions: 1) To make a left turn from a left turn lane or pocket; 2) To avoid debris, drains, or other hazardous conditions on the right; 3) To pass a slower moving vehicle; 4) To occupy any available lane when traveling at the same speed as other traffic; 5) To travel no more than two abreast when traffic is not impeded, but otherwise ride in single file. Every person riding a bicycle shall ride in the same direction as vehicular traffic.

In New Jersey, the law states a bicyclist must obey all state and local automobile driving laws. A parent may be held responsible for the child’s violation of any traffic law.

sounds like a good encounter! it's always a balancing act trying to figure your safety and also managing the motoring public's interpretation of right/wrong. every rd is different.

I'll bet the cop has seen his share of injuries over there especially this winter.

I'm not sure what you are expecting here. Do you have a question? Do you just need to vent? Your Google Map link does not make or break your case, it is meaningless in this context. As I see it you were pulled over mainly for ignoring the earlier admonition to move over. I'm guessing that you are not a racial minority. The motorist equivalent of your style of riding is the driver whose car has no mechanical impediment and there is no meteorological situation requiring an excess of caution but they put their hazard lights on and proceed down the road ten miles an hour below the speed limit because they don't want anything to happen to their precious car. Most of the time you get away with acting like that but every once in awhile law enforcement calls you on it. New York and New Jersey simply cannot allow cyclists to hold vehicles on major highways to have to crawl along at cyclist speeds. Come to Portland if you want to continue riding like that.

H

Overall, I would call the interaction neutral. I don't like being pulled over on a stretch I've ridden regularly for the past 4 years. If someone has information on commuting in NJ, I'd like to hear it.

This is true. However, there is no shoulder on this section. If you had looked at the street view on the google maps, you would have seen that.

I think the "as far to the right as is practicable" language is at play here. I feel it is the cyclist's call as to what is practicable.

He didn't give you a citation, did he? It sounds like your talk may have had some good effect. He told you that you should move over, and you gave him a reason why you were where you were, and he listened. Is that about right?

I think the cop gave you sound advice. If you are riding on a road that can only safely be ridden by taking the lane for more than 10-15 seconds, you should make every effort to avoid that road. Seven minutes is crazy. Sorry, but someone has to say it.

What is the speed limit? If I have to take the lane for a while on a 40mph road, I find another route (keeping in mind what 40mph roads are like here, maybe they're different where you are). If it's 25 I go for it 'cause I can keep up w/ traffic on those kinds of roads around here.

not all cops are bike savvy - MASS has a program to educate law officers on bike related rules. I could not quickly find an official reference to their bike education program other than this Law Officer Training | MassBike

this stuff looks interesting but it's not what i was thinking of
https://ipmba.org/training/about-the-courses

Your point illustrates a common case with cops: they simply don't know many of the laws they try to enforce. My local cycling club (in neighboring Rockland County, NY) had a patrol chief for the Rockland Sheriff's Department speak at a meeting and he was initially incorrect on fairly simple things like whether NYS law requires you to carry ID to cycle (it doesn't, though most find it practical) and on and on.

Sure, these guys are humans and humans make mistakes. But it gets "in my craw" that they're paid more than 100K a year to enforce laws they don't know, when knowing the law is the most crucial part to effective enforcement.

I agree with Hardy. I have a similar road on my commute to work which is a hair longer than yours and is also 4 lanes with center turn lane. During this portion of my commute, I always take the lane. I just don't feel safe when 2 cars and a bike are occupying those 2 lanes at the same time. Also, drivers regularly travel this road at 50-60mph. It's a recipe for disaster. For me, there's no alternative route, so I take the lane and watch my rear-view mirror like a hawk. For your situation, there appears to be several alternative routes that might serve you much better, for instance North Woodland Street. That one appears to be very residential and scenic. I don't know the specifics of your commute, but to me route selection is critical to my peace and well being.

That roadway is a very dangerous place to ride. I've investigated many bike/car/motorcycle/truck deaths from East Palisade to Closter Dock Road on that stretch. Although it is very popular, it is very deadly. Be Careful!!!!

Just because it is legal, does not make it smart. Many things you can do on a bike are legal....but stupid. It won't matter if they know the law when they just throw a sheet over you and call the M.E.

I think you're being needlessly antagonistic and making a lot of assumptions here.

Your reply completely missed my point. I'm not debating the need to balance what you can do with what is smart and safe. What I'm saying is that, in my opinion, its inexcusable for cops not to know the complete vehicle code, including laws as they pertain to bikes on public roads/streets. And yet it happened in the OP's situation to a degree and happens all the time all across the country.

What if it was the only road between A and B?

The road is only ever unsafe when other road users fail to maintain their responsibilities.

I tend to agree and suspect the officer will be less likely to pull over cyclists in similar situations in the future.

When I lived in NJ (Eatontown) I was pulled over in a somewhat similar situation. The officer wanted me to ride on the shoulder although he acknowledged that it was only partially paved and disappeared completely every few hundred feet. I gave him my reasons for feeling less safe repeatedly switching between the shoulder and lane and also that there was nothing in the vehicle code requiring me to ride on the shoulder. After an extended discussion he left without issuing any citation or warning but still said he'd issue one "for disobeying an officer's order" if he saw me back on the roadway. But he then sped away fast enough that there was no danger of him seeing me again as I continued on my way just as before.

Ride on the sidewalk.

I'm very much an agnostic on the "taking the lane concept". I have no objection to taking the land, and will when I fell it's appropriate, but I'm also mindful of the needs, wants, or rights of other road users and try to create passing opportunities whenever I can.

For me, there's a world of difference between taking the lane, and holding the lane. The NJ law is pretty clear on this allowing cyclists to hold the lane when moving with the flow of traffic, but requiring them to keep right otherwise, with room for discretion based on road conditions.

In my long cycling career, I've only been stopped by one officer because of my lane placement, which was well out in the lane of a twisty 2 lane road. He was miffed that I made safe passing nearly impossible, and I explained that the right side of the lane was very broken up and I was as far right as possible. Fortunately his superviser happened to pull up before we got very far in the conversation, and asked what the problem was. The officer started to explain, and before he finished, or I could get a word in, the sergeant pointed to the road and asked in classic NY terms "Where the F do you expect him to ride" (pointing to me and the road), and sent me on my way with "stay safe".

People here on BF can get very adamant about the law, or rights, but IMO it's not about that at all. It's about courtesy and getting along so everybody wins.

To the OP, it seems you had an OK cop. He had a problem, you had an explanation, and you were able to part with mutual pride and respect intact.

In Colorado it's legal to ride two abreast and hold the lane. So sorry some of you live in such intolerant states, I left Chicao because of the junk OP experienced.

OTOH, Colorado seems to be the epicenter of extreme driver/cyclist mutual hatred. (not saying this is true, just that plenty of incidents make the news).

Maybe that's because of too many conflicting rights and people who won't give to get.

Here in NY, riding 2 abreast is also legal, but cyclists doing so have to break down to single file to allow passing.

BTW- I don't see it as a question of legal tolerance, but of conduct. It seems that some people rarely, if ever, have negative encounters with motorists and for others it's an almost daily occurrence. I'm sure that some or even much of that can be chalked up to regional differences, but suspect that some can be chalked up to the individuals involved.

Yeah, because that's safe / legal.

Near my neighborhood, there is a busy, winding 4-lane road with a posted limit of 30 mph, but many cars are driving at 50 mph and above. There is a safe and convenient sidewalk on both sides. If I have to ride down that road, I'm on the sidewalk. It's both safe and legal.

As if those too exist everywhere.

Bravo... well stated. It is ALWAYS about cooperation.

That looks like there is a narrow shoulder. I'd probably be on the shoulder, or on the white line depending on the terrain (move over a little on downhills). There are a few grates which are a problem.

It looks like it wouldn't take much for the city to widen the road by a couple of feet, as the land to the southwest is public, and may even have some "trails" along the road.

However, what is Henry Hudson Drive like? It looks like it could be a good alternative. Those kinds of river greenways are also an excellent place to put MUTS.