2old

Another lawsuit for the company to challenge as one of their bikes apparently stopped precipitously tossing the rider to the ground, causing injury, loss of wages etc. This will "supplement" at least two other alleged ones, for a young girl that was killed riding on the back of a Rad piloted by another young girl and one from an insurance company for a bike fire that burned down a house. Seems like success breeds lawsuits these days, although I haven't heard of the big OEM's having problems.

speedy25

You are correct. The big companies dont have those problems because they have better quality, their product isnt self assembled. and they dont have "bottom feeder" customers.

While the crash with the two girls is lamentable, the reality is they were two up on a hill that most cyclists wont go down. That one isnt a defect in the bike.

I have personal contact with two bikes that had flameage but it happened with the rider around so it didnt create a huge catastrophe.

-sp

tds101 

Did this happen with a RadPower bike? I own one, and I'd personally appriciate a heads up.

2old

tds, all three of the incidents that I referenced were with Rad bikes. As stated above, the death was tragic, and the other two incidences are not defined clearly by what was presented (IMO). In one a rider is suing because his bike stopped abruptly throwing him off and in the other an insurance company is suing because the bike battery "burned down a house they insured" (be interesting to see the proof). Check BRAIN (Bicycle Retailer and Industry News) for the stories.

tds101 

is my bike, the radmission, included in this list?

Djangomatic82

interesting. Guess i wont get one of those for my mum.

2old

I deleted the posts and can't recollect which bikes were referenced. Maybe there's a way to locate a copy of the individual lawsuits.

fooferdoggie 

We are seeing a start to UL rated batteries on the Low ned bikes.

tds101 

I looked, and the only issue is my propriatary chain tension being an issue at times. Not something to be sued over.
My RadMission and NIU kqi3 Max electric scooter are both UL Listed/compliant. My Fiido L3 is under EU compliance (CE).

2old

My post wasn't meant to denigrate Rad in any way (my son purchased one for his wife and the reports from owners have been positive). I was just pointing out lawsuits against them which I thought were interesting and a reflection of our litigious society. I read a report that stated the US has 17 times as many attorneys per capita as Japan.

tds101 

No problem. I was just wondering, that's all. I love the single speed simplicity of my Radmission. I even purchased a second battery for $200, for heading out for day trips this summer. Quite a steal, considering they changed their marketing towards older adults. This was something they decided went against their future goals.

Smaug1

I just read up on the one with the two girls going down the hill:

The hill is VERY steep, and with two big kids on that bike, maybe the brakes just couldn't take it. Maybe they got going 20, 30, 40 mph, grabbed the brakes and they just burned up. You can read about it here, starting about 1/3 of the way down the page: (before that, it is just emotional drivel)
https://www.bicycling.com/culture/a4...electric-bike/

It should be noted that both parents are lawyers and are not wanting to take ANY responsibility for letting their daughter ride the bike down this hill they live on.

Further down in the article, they document brake problems on the Rad bikes; especially those who ride a LOT of miles in hilly areas and don't feel like brake maintenance every 200-300 miles is reasonable. That's something that I'm sure Rad is looking into.

The one bright thing about the story is that Molly's organs saved three peoples' lives after her own death.

The effect on the rest of us is that eBike manufacturers are going to be increasingly more legally careful because of this family. Better brakes and lower speeds, probably.

It seems to me though, from what I can see, that the brakes were worn out or that Rad didn't design their brakes for two-up riding down a 14% grade. It's just a matter of time before someone does it.

Rad will probably get out of it, maybe by settling, but they'll stick to their warning that < 16 year old riders don't have the experience or judgment to ride these bikes. They'll definitely beef up their wording about brakes and maybe even instruct on maintenance and changing pads and rotors.

Smaug1

Looks like there was a related recall and change of management too:
https://www.theverge.com/2023/1/25/2...s-safety-ebike

Here's the article about State Farm suing Rad for burning down a house that they had to pay for:
https://www.bicycleretailer.com/indu...e#.ZGJdv3bMKCp

I wonder if that has something to do with the limitations Rad puts on their batteries, where they try to block user access to a fuse, and if the fuse blows, they want you to buy a new $600 battery. It makes more sense to use UL Listed batteries & chargers, similar to what was done with hoverboards when those started burning down houses...

speedy25

I see there has been a lot added to this thread since I last commented.

[edit: removed antagonistic comment]

Brakes, especially cable- People dont adjust them like they are supposed to. Almost every time a cable disk bike comes in the levers go to the bar. Yep, no brakes, and the customers never seem to notice. The maintenance of a few clicks with a 5mm allen key is outrageously simple to do!! I had only thought of that steep hill and marginal brakes on a heavy bike, but especially if used by a teen, you can bet it didnt have the best maintenance.

Thanks for adding some detail smaug1.

-SP

StanSeven

I deleted a few posts which are argumentative and fueling fighting. Let’s keep this civil please.

tds101 

I no longer own the Radmission. Have a wonderful evening,...

7up

IMO anytime you have a successful business and you deal with the public, You’ll always be open to lawsuits especially in todays climate.These lawsuits will have an effect on future pricing per unit down the road.

mpetry912 

yes sadly I think this is true. you put a few hundred thousand of these things out there, surely there will be a few accidents and lawsuits will result.

Bikes are simple machines but they are not like cars. you have to understand the limitations of the machine. Things like brakes and tires do not have a level of redundancy. If the front tire goes flat or the brake fails, you're probably going down.

I see lots of young people riding ebikes in ways that seem unsafe to me, speeding thru parking lots with their thumbs holding the throttle button down. They have not got enough biking experience to understand the safety implications of what they are doing. Just get on the ebike and off they go. Glad to see most are wearing helmets.

I've had good experiences with the Rad bikes generally. They are tanks, but safe and reliable if used responsibly. A little concerned about the quick release front axle fitment.

as for fires, that's a whole 'nother topic. I'm not convinced that "UL Approved" will solve it.

/markp

cat0020

It is sad in our society that parents seem to want retribution from businesses rather than take responsibility for not teaching their own children before tragedy occurs.
Kids do dumb things and sometimes accidents happen, consequences of not spending the time to educate your children for a few hours to operate an ebike can be deadly.
Is it the responsibility of businesses when parents don't spend few hours with their kids on ebikes before letting them roam on their on their own?
Is it the responsibility of businesses children operate vehicle that could be poorly maintained and beyond the vehicle's designed operating parameters?

2old

IMO, in this instance it provides small and/or foreign companies with a marketing advantage since it's difficult to impossible trying to sue them. One frequent poster on Endless Sphere had his house burned down by a Chinese battery, but his insurance company couldn't even locate the company. They had changed their name or whatever and were gone. Smaller companies might not have enough resources to make a lawsuit feasible. This could be an instance where staying small is advantageous.

unterhausen

That hill is really steep, it's really not much of a surprise they crashed with two people on a single bike. I bet experienced tandemists with a drag brake would think twice about riding down that hill. I don't know what to think about the bike that stopped suddenly. Doesn't seem like something that would happen because of a bike failure.

As far as the fires go, I imagine rad has almost enough business buying batteries that they could afford an agent to monitor the factories that make their packs if they don't already have one.

2old

I knew individual(s) in the Pedego hierarchy, and they had a QC Engineer that worked for them in their factory in China (I think they may have moved the operation to Viet Nam).

Smaug1

This is how they do business in China. The start a company, build as much as they can, make as much money as they can even if they have to do shady stuff. They'll do whatever they can get away with. When the eventually get caught, the close the business, move down the block and open a new business with a new name. (same staff and equipment, oftentimes)

Yes, it is often said that Chinese CAN build good stuff, one just has to supervise them to insure the level of quality that is wanted. QC people on-site is one way. They are perfectly happy to build something that doesn't even work, as long as they can sell it first and can find away around returns and honoring warranty. They will figure out how the system works and utilize it to their advantage; no conscience.
It's just how their culture works. They have a saying: "if you can cheat, then cheat" If someone can get away with it, it is considered a sign of intelligence. Just a very different culture. We westerners consider it dishonorable, but there are a lot of Chinese cultural traits that are good, too. Their work ethic is very good, for example, and they place a high value on education. Much higher than in the USA, these days.

kayakindude

I was leaving the bank earlier this week and noticed a wobble in the front fork. At 1st I thought I blew a shock from all the trails we ride, this bike is awesome off roading. I examined the wheel and the quick release came undone and the wheel was basically only in place from gravity! I retighted and secured the wheel but yes your concern about the quick release is noted!

2old

I haven't seen Rad's QR and am not trying to defend them, but I've had this happen to me riding off road lately (DIY bike), and assume (I know) the heavy brush we're encountering in socal from all the rain somehow dislodged it. It was kind of scary when I realized the wheel wasn't secured adequately since I had just descended a downhill section at 35+ mph.