Sorry about the photo quality of the previous photo. Hopefully this one is better. (Garmin Venu 2+ with a third-party analogue-watch screen).

I had an Apple Watch 4 for years; eventually the side button gave out, and I lived with that for a while, but decided to treat myself to a new one and got an Ultra 2 (so, not at the cheap end of the spectrum). The big attraction of the Ultra to me is that it has 2x the battery life. I can get 3 days between charges; I could probably get more. Charging it for the duration of a shower is enough to prolong that. As noted, this is nothing compared to a Garmin.

It's useful to think of the Apple Watch as an iPhone peripheral. The watch specifically needs to pair with an iPhone (not even a different Apple gadget). Heart rate, despite what crazyravr said, is accurate. Comparing it against a chest band showed the two were the same, sometimes with one lagging the other by a second. It's not great for sleep tracking—it's inferring your sleep state from the noises you make, your body temperature, your heart rate, and your movement. So I've had a couple of nights where my brain was spinning but it showed as a decent night's sleep.

Some years ago, I had a Fitbit, and it would automatically track activities. If you go for a walk, it will notice that and record it as a walk. With an Apple Watch, it will notice you're going for a walk, and after 14:45 alert you: "It looks like you're going for a walk. Do you want to record it?" You need to give it explicit instructions. And there's some stuff, like yardwork, that could count as a workout but that movement pattern hasn't been modeled, so the watch won't pick up on it. You can explicitly start a "mixed cardio" workout though.

I probably get more benefit from it as a convenience (it's nice in the kitchen to raise my wrist and say "start a timer for 20 minutes named 'potatoes'.") than as a fitness tracker. If all I wanted was a fitness tracker, I'd probably get one.

FWIW, here's a comparison page for the SE, 9, and 10 . Also FWIW, bands are interchangeable between all Apple Watches.

Whatever anyone does, do NOT get a Scanwatch. Total junk. It is billed as the smartwatch for people who hate smart watches. It has a nice analogue interface (not just pixels on a screen, it really has hour, second and minute hand, and some obscure dials.) I think it was the first to offer EKG (which is cool, but she used it maybe once.) I got my wife one of those a couple of years ago. Basically, it hands all the heavy-lifting over to your phone. The watch itself looks great. That is where it ends. It doesn't even keep time properly. If it doesn't sync with your phone for whatever reason (you take it to England -- I have no idea why), it loses like 5 min per day. One of the features we thought would be good is it would auto-detect activities and record them. When she brushed her teeth (which is a physical activity you really want to encourage with anyone British), it would record it as swimming. There were a thousand other frustrations. It is in a desk drawer now (bottom, right). I just looked at it when I took out my solar Seiko (below, left) to charge (I can't remember whether it still holds a charge or not.)

That chart helped. I suspect I will be happy with the SE.

You're a funny guy. A watch that can't keep time. I remember the wind-up Timex watches, but you got what you paid for in those days.

I swear to god this is true. I was stunned. I could not believe it could really be that bad. I'd give it away, but most of the people I really hate have watches.

Do the newer Apple watches not detect blood oxygen? I was looking at the comparator.

[edit: This is due to a patent dispute.]

I made continuous use of the blood oxygen measure in my watch the time I had SARS-Co-V-2. Fortunately, it didn't go south. I think it is a worthwhile feature. )I suspect Apple builds them in, but the software doesn't activate it until an update after the dispute gets resolved in their favor.)

Interesting story. Apple was found guilty of patent infringement for the pulse-ox feature in the USA, so they have disabled that feature on US-sold watches. The company whose patent they have infringed is not willing to license it. The feature is enabled everywhere else in the world, AFAIK. If Apple manages to license it, they'll be able to re-enable it, since it's just a software switch.

Sorry, I looked it up just as I posted. I dimmly recalled the story.

Garmin will often put hardware (like the EKG monitor) in a watch but not activate it with a software switch until getting FDA (in this case) approval.

PS: I am glad to hear the Apple Watch gas-lights a lousy night of sleep just like my Venu 2+ does. I think they all use a fairly similar algorithm.

I have a heart defect (mitral valve prolapse) that, if I understand it right, is benign. One side effect is that EKGs will always be inaccurate. If a doctor doesn't know this, they get alarmed at my EKG. When they really need to know how my heart is doing, they do an echo-cardiogram which is far more extensive and expensive. Anyway, I don't need the ability in a watch, because the data it produces will probably not be useful.

My Garmin Fenix 7 provides sleep data that has helped me understand the impact of my evening habits on my sleep, and this has helped me to improve my sleep substantially. I feel better, recover faster, and thus can train harder with greater frequency.

​​​​​​Again, my Fenix 7 provides me with a range of actionable data; it utilizes resting HR, HRV, sleep data, workout history, and other metrics to predict my training readiness. Since I started using it, I have learned how to time my workout frequency and intensity for better fitness. While my own perceptions are useful, the watch provides much helpful data.

​​​​​Literally NONE of these watches, nor any Garmin computer, ever recommend staying in bed for 5 days, or even one day. Never. And in my experience, Garmin devices never recommend more than 92 hours (that's four days) of recovery -- and even that doesn't mean four days of doing nothing -- it includes active recovery. Your claim is nonsense.

It doesn't seem like you really have much experience with these devices and hence you do not understand how to use them.

Sorry to hear that, but glad it is benign. In that case the SE watch should be perfect.

I like the EKG functionality but really don't quite know what to do with it, apart from playing with it during faculty meetings.

Thanks for the unfortunately timely reminder. Have turned it on on my Fenix 6 (and dealt with the associated battery warning).

Regarding refurbs for apple watches, the refurbs are indistinguishable from new and may well be clearance items.

I suspect an apple watch might be better for all round fitness for most people, but the garmins are definitely better on for sportspeople.

There is no definitive answer to my question, but I'll ask anyway. In your view, what's a sportspeople?

Refurb things are not just things that have been used and then brought back into the specs of new items. They can be returned before use. But there is little or no way to tell the difference. I bought a refurb iphone 12 over a year ago to save money. I bought it from Apple, and they probably have high standards for refurb. The battery strength has followed that of a brand new unit, very strong in the first several months and then a little less. The phone has performed at least as well as I had hoped. A few years ago, I bought a refurb iphone from Gazelle, and that did not work well. I returned it a day or two after the warranty ran out, but they accepted it and gave me a full refund. I'll consider a refurb watch, and I'll look carefully at the warranties offered.

Any thoughts on Applecare for Apple Watches? As I said earlier, I do buy Applecare for phones, computers, and tablets, even though I resent the necessity.

Oh, yes I specifically meant refurbs from Apple. You take your chances with anyone else. My Fenix 6 was a returned item described as brand new looking from Amazon. It was about a third the cost of a new 7 last year and indeed looked brand new, but at that price I'd have been ok if it wasn't.

I haven't needed apple care on any of my device. My eldest closed her MacBook on a pen and I replaced the screen myself for a bit more than the cost of AppleCare. She and her sister have also smashed an ipad screen each which I got someone to replace. Similar story with the price. Actually maybe it's a good investment for younger kids. All in all I'm better off without it though. Are a lot of apple watch screens needing replacement?

I was at a meeting last week with 10 colleagues I hadn't seen in over two years. I noticed they were now all wearing apple watches except three of us who were I knew were keen cyclists had garmins. I guess we three are sportspeople. Also noted they were all reasonably heathy looking bar one wrt the general population. That may be because of the amount of running around we do in our jobs. I use apple health to gamify my steps for one thing and have boosted them 30% this year. My phone thinks I'm gaining steps when I'm cycling but my garmin watch knows I'm not. Apple watch is probably better for that sort of thing.

Timely conversation. My Fitbit died recently and I need a new fitness watch. I'm an Android so the Apple Watch is out of the picture. Looking at the Garmins. And Polar too.

I don't have a cycle computer. I'm looking for a device that I can use on multiple bike and on runs and hikes too. Does anyone use their fitness watch as their cycle computer instead of in addition to one?

First, thanks for your thoughts on Applecare. I think I will skip it this time. It has paid off for me with the Macbook Pros I've owned and with my ipad.

Where is your phone when you are cycling and it thinks you are walking? It never happens to me, and I'm glad about that. It seems to know when I'm walking and when I'm not. It does not infer that I'm cycling, ever. I normally keep it in a mount on my handlebars, but sometimes it's in a pocket.

I've been happy with my Venu2+. It has a lot of the qualities of the far more expensive ones, works fine for biking and other activities, and has a very nice screen. The current iteration is Venu3 I believe. I got mine on sale. If you can hold out, keep a close eye on Garmin's website and Garmin-approved vendors like BikeTiresDirect .

I used mine on a recent trip to the UK, where I rode a friend's bicycle. It worked flawlessly. You can even hook up your radar and lights if so inclined.

I also use it for recording walks, runs, hikes, and other activities. You can even include golf functions (as if).

DC Rainmaker is a a great place to get an overview and in depth reviews of the vast number of options.

eg: https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2021/11/...endations.html

I don't plan to buy a cycle computer. I believe fitness watches can do what you want. And I will be a tester of that, though I think I will continue to use ridewithgps on my phone. I really like it. I just wish I didn't have to hit RECORD and START. I also wish I didn't have to hit STOP and SAVE. It would be so nice if it just inferred that I'm riding and then asked me later to confirm. I believe that would be possible.

Back jersey pocket.

I like Apple watches. I run an online business, and have been using Apply devices for a long time. The Apple watch helps me keep on top of things, and it is an effective tool when cycling. I have an Ultra 2, which I have been using for about half a year, and which I love. I had been using a series 7, but as I started going on rides of 6 or more hours, the battery life often didn’t get me to the end of the ride, fitness apps like Strava seem to consume a fair amount of energy. The Ultra 2 can go all day, and still have plenty of juice left over.

Welp, I couldn't resist the sale. A Fenix 7 is heading my way.

noglider if you do end up getting it, please do post back whether it met your expectations etc. Would love to hear your honest opinion as you seem to be in the same boat as I am. You want one, but not really know why lol well other than the doctors orders.

I'm curious if any can comment on whether the Apple watch with cellular is worth the price over just GPS. Is the additional $ worth it in your experience?

My wife got that with hers. It's $10/mo with our carrier. She likes it, but I think she'd readily admit it's a luxury. My watch has the cellular radio, but I haven't set it up with my carrier. You can make and receive calls with any Apple Watch as long as it's in range of your iphone (handy if you're just in a different part of the house). If you're the kind of person who would carry their phone when out and about no matter what, there's no benefit to it. It just means you can leave the phone at home and still be connected. Obviously your watch isn't an ideal phone, but you can use airpods or any bluetooth headset with it.

I get the impression that the way this works is that the carrier sets up a different phone number for the watch, but does some forwarding magic so that it seems like you just have one phone number that you can use on two devices.

Yeah. I'm mostly thinking of a gift for my wife, who is a runner, so that she can run w/o a phone and still have music and, more importantly emergency contact.