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At a roadbike crossroad

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Old 11-23-10 | 12:17 PM
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At a roadbike crossroad

I am in a bit of a spot trying to decide on how to increase my cycling. I really enjoy the miles I have put on my mountain bike and have been contemplating a road bike for a while now. The desire to do centuries and maybe what I see as epic rides ( St Augustine to Key West) has been a constant for a while now. However, I have one main difficulty with this....traffic. I ride my bike mainly at a local MUP which is a 5k loop that I ride 12 to 20 miles daily. It is hilly and is a good workout. In addition I drive a couple hours occasionally to go to other areas that have Bike Paths that are longer 20 to 30 miles and have done 60 miles once (loved it).

I have ridden on the road a number of times but in my area there are zero bike lanes and at time lots of traffic. I am not necessarily afraid of the traffic when I am riding, it just seems like once a week we all read an article or a thread of a biker being killed by an inattentive driver. I am all about being a defensive rider, I rode motorcycles for years. I think at this point I should mention that a drunk hit me on my motorcycle 25 years ago and I lost a finger in that little "accident".

There are a lot of seasoned riders here with many miles under them, so I guess I am just curious how to you stay safe, or try to anyway.
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Old 11-23-10 | 12:26 PM
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I ride with a mirror, head light and a Dinnotte 140L Tail Light in Day light.
It is the driver that never saw you that will hit you.

I rode motorcycles safely for 28 years.
But there was No texting back then.
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Old 11-23-10 | 12:32 PM
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From: SW. Sacramento Region, aka, down river

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You choose your routes and increase visibility. Stay off roads where speed limit is greater than 40 mph. Wear hi vis clothing in daylight and use bright lights in twilight and darkness.

Some get comfort in using a mirror.

Risks are fairly low in terms of number killed. For the last 5 years the totals in US have dropped and yet population has increased.
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Old 11-23-10 | 12:37 PM
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Well, I would sit here in my easy chair and tell you how safe your roads 1,000 miles away are, but that would be kind of pointless. Maybe they are dangerous, I don't know.

Some thoughts on it all, though.

First off, about every DAY here in the Dallas area, somebody is killed while driving. A friend from church was killed in a car wreck several months back, and it didn't even make the regular paper. So the fact that you can read about every bicycle fatality in the country, but don't know the difference when the guy down the street gets killed in a car tends to give you a very skewed perception of the hazard. As best I can tell, bicycling safety in general is comparable on an hourly basis to driving. You can increase your safety considerably by being sober, sane, following laws and good riding habits, using lights when it's dark, using reflective gear when it's dark, using bright clothing when it's light, etc.

Secondly, the roads are highly variable around here, and are likely to be so in your area. The best roads for riding any distance are the FM roads here, which are state-owned secondary but paved roads. They quite often don't have a shoulder, but more importantly, tend to have very light traffic. So doing some research in your area may turn up roads quite a bit better for riding than what you are viewing as unsafe roads.

I started riding with a bicycle shop ride a couple of years ago. The route they take is one that never would have occurred to me, but it turns out to be an excellent route that I now ride daily. So check around with local clubs or shops and see where they ride.
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Old 11-23-10 | 12:52 PM
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Pick your routes with obsessive care. As HiYoSilver said: find roads with lower speed limits, light traffic and wide shoulders. I'll drive to rural areas to avoid dangerous routes if needed. But I don't let the hazards of road cycling keep me from cycling. I rode 8000 miles in the last two years. Consider joining a club and riding in a group with cyclist your age. Clubs will provide safe routes, and travel in groups can provide more safety than traveling alone.

I studied The Art of Cycling by R. Hurst https://www.amazon.com/Art-Cycling-Bi.../dp/0762743166 which provides very practical advice for cyclist. A few hours of prep & planning could be life-saving.
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Old 11-23-10 | 12:54 PM
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From: Los Angeles area

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Good suggestions above!

Sounds from your post as if you're in FL, and that is (statistically) the most dangerous state for cyclists but I don't guess you'd consider moving to a safer state?

If not, ride defensively (I would suggest using a mirror) and don't be too surprised if motorists aren't keeping your safety in mind.

I've ridden thousands of miles (started road riding in '68 and never stopped) and only had one accident caused by an inattentive motorist. Thankfully, I rolled up on the hood and my only injury was having my back scrapped up by the wind-screen wipers!

Ride safe out there!

Rick / OCRR
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Old 11-23-10 | 01:18 PM
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Thanks all. I live in southern Alabama. Just 15 miles north of the Florida border. I am a New England transplant. I am still not deterred from getting the road bike, however, I don't think my wife is exactly thrilled by the idea. I will take all your suggestions to heart, I think in particular the visibility recommendations. Excellent video btw 10 wheels. Many thanks.
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Old 11-23-10 | 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by retnav94
There are a lot of seasoned riders here with many miles under them, so I guess I am just curious how to you stay safe, or try to anyway.
Don't let motorists intimidate you.
Be visible when riding.
Be predictable when riding in traffic.
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Old 11-23-10 | 02:39 PM
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I rode offroad to get away from the traffic. Occasionally we would do a few organised road rides and the only change to the MTB was to fit slicks. Those organised road rides were a great intro to road riding in general. I suppose the cars were not going to do anything funny or dangerous with so many "Hostile" witness' to gang up on them.

But 4 years ago I went road. Don't know any roadies so I ride solo. Never had a problem with cars but I choose my routes away from the heavy traffic. But I drive my bike just as I would a car- except a lot slower. At junctions I make certain that I let other road users know what I am doing. I wear visible clothing and have rear light on blink all the time and sometimes use a powerfull front lamp aswell. I have a bar mounted mirror on my main road bike and use it. And on top of that- I am not too proud to get off the bike and walk it if I feel the traffic is not suitable for me.

I still have to keep my eyes and ears open though and take avoiding action if required.
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Old 11-23-10 | 02:50 PM
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I ride following the rules of the road. That is, I act like I'm part of traffic, because I am. I wear clothes that don't just make me visible; they make me conspicuous. I live in an area where the population density is close to 2300 per square mile; there is a LOT of traffic. So, I pick my routes and times of day carefully. Finally, I know that more people are killed in accidents where automobiles hit each other. So, I try not to let the stories about a cyclist being killed get free rent in my head.
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Old 11-23-10 | 05:03 PM
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From: SW. Sacramento Region, aka, down river

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Keep cycling in perspective

https://www-fars.nhtsa.dot.gov/Main/index.aspx


2009 2008 2007
Fatal Crashes 30,797 34,172 37,435
Drivers 17,640 19,279 21,717
Passengers 6,770 7,441 8,716

Motorcyclists 4,462 5,312 5,174
Pedestrians 4,092 4,414 4,699
Pedalcyclists 630 718 701

Resident Population (Thousands)
307,007 304,375 301,580


So cycling is about 7 times safer than walking or riding a motor cycle and about 11 times safer than riding as a passenger in a motor vehicle.
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Old 11-23-10 | 05:55 PM
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I think you're right to be concerned about safety on a bike. One hazard is that drivers can be distracted and not and not see a cyclist because they are not looking for one. I have been distracted myself on occasion and can understand this. A second hazard is that some drivers are stupid and some are angry and some are stupid and angry. I don't know what the risk is but it is certain that any confrontation between auto and cyclist the odds are against the cyclist. I mostly ride MUPs and when I do ride the road I pick quiet country roads with little traffic. I also always wear a high Vis jersey and for next summer will add blinky lights front and back. I also always use a mirror and as necessary, such as intersections, behave just like all other traffic and don't blow through stop lights.
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Old 11-23-10 | 06:40 PM
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I've become much more confident road riding since I started commuting regularly to work. It is mostly about being seen (flashing lights front and rear plus the right clothing), seeing (mirror is a big help and I've gotten much better at reading drivers), being predictable then driving like they don't know you are there. I've had more close calls with people being "nice" than with inattentive drivers.

That said, there are roads I won't ride on. If a road is busy, 40 MPH + and has no shoulder or bike lane, I'll avoid it. Pretty much anything else, including the 101 freeway, is fair game.
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Old 11-23-10 | 07:53 PM
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You lead the dance

Commute Orlando has a very nice piece about managing traffic, and a there's companion video.

https://commuteorlando.com/wordpress/...ead-the-dance/

https://vimeo.com/9827254
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Old 11-24-10 | 10:05 AM
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I think if you have a good mirror and use it, develop riding-in-traffic skills, don't anger drivers, and keep up your vigilance, you should be safe, except from a random act by an idiot. That could happen driving as well.

I pick roads that either have a nice shoulder or little traffic. Fast traffic doesn't bother me as long as there is a wide shoulder. I keep to the right side of the shoulder. If I have to ride on a road with little or no shoulder I keep checking my mirror. If it looks like someone is going to overtake me at the same time as someone is going to go by in the oncoming lane (so there's no room for the passing car to give me a wide berth) I pull over. Some numbskulls will try to pass anyway when there isn't sufficient room. They think a few inches is plenty, and they're so skillful they can pull it off. Sometimes they can, but what if they can't? I'd rather pull over and let them pass. It takes a few moments of my day, but if I stay alive, great.

Some people talk about "taking the lane" when you need to. I agree, when you need to, but I tend to pull over and wait, rather than taking the lane too soon. If a car has to follow me at my speed for very long, the driver will get mad. I don't want to be on the road with a car driven by someone who's mad at me. I'd rather sacrifice some of my time and convenience. If I need to get in the left lane for a turn and it isn't clear, I'll usually wait on the shoulder until it is.

You need to develop skills for riding on a narrow street with parked cars. You don't want to get hit from behind, but you don't want to get "car-doored" either. Again, being patient and willing to sacrifice some of your own time and convenience for staying safe is a prudent attitude.
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Old 11-24-10 | 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by BigBlueToe
Some people talk about "taking the lane" when you need to. I agree, when you need to, but I tend to pull over and wait, rather than taking the lane too soon. If a car has to follow me at my speed for very long, the driver will get mad. I don't want to be on the road with a car driven by someone who's mad at me. I'd rather sacrifice some of my time and convenience. If I need to get in the left lane for a turn and it isn't clear, I'll usually wait on the shoulder until it is.
The more I ride, the more willing I have become to take the lane. My biggest fear is being hit from behind by a distracted driver that doesn't see me. A close second is being 'brushed' by a driver squeezing past when there is another car to their left. Both are far less likely to occur if my blinking tail light is directly in front of the driver. Drivers are used to watching what is right in front of them: it's ingrained. We are far less likely to be aware of that cyclist hugging the curb, ahead and to our right. I, too, hesitate to take the lane in a situation where I will delay the drivers. I want to be considerate, and I don't want to anger the motorists. But when I stay to the right in those situations, I know that I am increasing my own risk. There is a narrow high speed spot where I have to make this decision every day, and I usually opt for taking the extra risk of giving the motorists the lane. Objectively, I know I should be either taking the lane, or reverting to the (Arggghh!) sidewalk, which is available, and unused, for the one block before I turn onto a MUP. But I hate sidewalks, and know how, in my past type A life, it would frustrate me to have a cyclist ahead of me, doing 20mph under the speed limit, even if it was only going to delay me the few seconds it took for me to change lanes.
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Old 11-25-10 | 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by HiYoSilver
You choose your routes and increase visibility. Stay off roads where speed limit is greater than 40 mph. Wear hi vis clothing in daylight and use bright lights in twilight and darkness.

Some get comfort in using a mirror.

Risks are fairly low in terms of number killed. For the last 5 years the totals in US have dropped and yet population has increased.
I agree with this advice. I have added a blinking LED taillight, just in case.
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Old 11-25-10 | 10:30 AM
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This summer I have used my CX and Mtb much more than my roadbikes. I ride for training and recreation and aggressive cars scare me so to avoid traffic I have my CX set up much as a roadbike and ride it for long trips on serviceroads in the forests north of my town. My advice would be to look at a Cyclocross bike with discbrakes and have two wheelsets (or just change tires on one set). That way you can do some long rides on regular roads and do most of your training away from traffic.
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Old 11-25-10 | 01:53 PM
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I have found that certain roads seem far safer than others. For some reason there are some roads where the motorists do not seem to be in a great big hurry and are less hostile to cyclists. The advice of lower traffic roads with lower speedlimits is a good one.

Still it only takes one inattentive rider to do you in.

As far as statistics go, cyclists are twice as safe (from fatalities) as motorists per hour on the road. I know, it seems far MORE dangerous but it is not. About half of the cycling fatalities occur at night (with "cyclists" who probably are not using lights or even reflectors). A large number of the other fatalities are "pedestrians on bicycles". Experienced road cyclists have very low fatality rates. I know of 2 large multiday rides that have gone on for years. Both have had one (1) fatality. Both of those fatalities were riders who were off the road and off the shoulder and standing in the grass. Cars managed to get them anyway. Hardly seems fair doesn't it? If they really "want" to get you they will. One fatality was caused by a drunken driver who just drove off the road. The other guy was late to church and did not make the turn (he was sorry so the police let him off without even a warning). But the 2 rides accounted for tens of millions of miles ridden without a road fatality just be careful where you pull off and stop.
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Old 11-25-10 | 04:25 PM
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On long descents when you build up speed, its more difficult to stop. You have to weigh the fun of a fast descent with the risk that a car may come out of a side street and you broadside the vehicle. Even if you choose an early morning ride with little traffic, there's that risk.

Even without cars, a fast descent may turn ugly if your bike begins to shimmy. I learned the hard way and now I create the damping effect by pressing the knees into the top tube. Some riders love the descents and go with reckless abandon.
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