BikerLover

Im not particularly into folding bicycles as i am with normal mountain bikes but ive got some questions to ask. I asking because i work for a marketing company and that recently ive been handed the job of researching on all bikes. (yas - my fav topic)

Folding bikes is the area i find hard to get information on. Ive been hearing Brompton is a verry good make of folding bikes.

I was wondering what is Brompton's intended marketing strategy? another question is that is brompton the only comapny to offer test ride before purchase? Is other make any good?

PArticularly im just gathering information. Any details would be thankful.

Weakling

I guess one have to ask them.

But looked at from outside of the fans the de facto strategy
seems to be to not say one have a folding bike but to say.

"I have a Brompton" enough said.

As if Brompton was the only folder worth to care about.

A bit like how Microsoft handle OS and computers. The dominant OS

but that is only seen from my extremely subjective perspective but
owning a Brompton seems to change people to be unpaid advertizers
and defenders or advocates for them. Maybe they didn't want it to be
that way but that is how it seems to work. I compare it to Mac owners.

They behave in same way. Linux users are a bit like that too.

14R 

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Brompton is a well known brand due to the way their bike folds: it is one of the smallest packages and the folded bike protects the user from the chainring, chain and oils. It can also be rolled once folded, is a very stable package once folded and those are some of the qualities other bikes don't offer.

The bikes have a decent performance and are ideal for multi-mode commute since it's easy to carry and will fit where other folders would not (including inside airplanes as a carry-on item).

It is not even close to the Bike Friday or other high performance folders, like the Dahon Speed line (pro or TT). If you need to win a race on a folder, the Brompton is not the right bike for you.

It's not even close the the customizable capabilities of a Downtube, that uses non proprietary parts and can be highly upgraded. If you are into tinkering, you might be better off with another brand.

It's not even close to some smaller wheels model, that allow you to fit them into lockers or other small places. If you need to store your bike into a vertical storage, you might be better served with a Strida or some other brand as well.

In other words, it's an excellent bike but with a specific target audience. For me and for my needs, it is BY FAR the best folding bike ever. But all the other models above are superior to the Bromptons if you take in account other factors.

Does it make any sence?

Speedo

Bromptons are good bikes, but the folding world is much larger than just Bromptons. If you check out the Name Your Bike thread you can get an idea of what's out there.

Speedo

jur

Your best bet is to check out all the threads in this subforum with lots of posts, and read through them. (You are paid for this, lucky skunk) Most of those big threads are bike specific so you can get a lot of good quality info from the user base.

SesameCrunch

You may also wish to speak with a number of folder riders as part of your research. Get their thoughts, likes, dislikes, etc.

wahoonc

My take on folders; I only own one at the moment and it is an a bit of an oddity...1968 Raleigh Compact RSW. Brompton's have a great rep. They are one of the few bikes with 16" wheels that I have found that can be ridden by a rider over 6'1" tall. They basically stick with the same model from year to year, but do offer upgrades and improvements as they go. They also appear to be the only bike where you can order ala carte.

If you can find a dealer you can test ride just about any brand of bike, Dahon, Strida, Bike Friday and Brompton's have all been test ridden by yours truly. Brommies are pricey, but I don't think they are outrageous for what you get for your money.

Aaron

Dahon.Steve

1. I was wondering what is Brompton's intended marketing strategy?

I guess their marketing strategy is fairly simple. They make the best 16' inch wheel commuting folding bike in the business.

2. Brompton the only company to offer test ride before purchase?

Every bike shop offers test rides before purchase of any bike. If there's one that does not, you go elsewhere.

3. Is other make any good?

LOL..... I have to say yes. My Dahon's are very good thank you. I have yet to meet a Bike Friday owner who does not think his bike is very good. There are some but they are rare.

Dahon.Steve

The M type Brompton is worth $420.00 USD. Wait a second, you do have to add Transportation costs and the falling U.S dollar so now that makes it .... Well kind of like $1,066 USD plus additional shipping to your door!

Mr. Smith

Brompton has the compact fold. That's their sales gimick and the basis of their following, just like the thinnest cell phone is usually the most popular and the smallest laptop. Brompton doesn't exactly try and refresh things or keep up with the times in my eyes. Their brakes are old and outdated, and so is the 3 speed hub drive system. The grips seem like they were taken from a child's tricycle, missing only the streamers. It seems to me that they're philosophy is "if it ain't broke..." I spent a few hours trying one and found it to be reasonable but a far cry in ride and performance from my BF tikit. I would consider owning one because there are times when the size of the fold would be handy, particularly in an instance where discretion is required. My stock "large" tikit is still obviously a folded bicycle even with the cover on and hard to get into restaurants and movie theaters.

wahoonc

And nobody else makes a 16" wheeled folder that fits me...I tried. Everything is taking a beating on the price side of the market in the US due to the collapsing dollar, and escalating material costs. Even the made in China Scwhinns are up around 20% this year.

Aaron

PDR

It would be a very bold statement to say that Brompton make the best folding bike.

It all comes down to how you intend to use the bike. For example if your commute consist of riding to the bus stop or train station platform and folding the bike knowing you will be getting on a packed bus or train, then getting off unfolding the bike and riding away from the buss stop or station platform.. then YES Brompton is probably the best bike for the job.

If on the other hand you have to carry a folded Brompton any distance, then there are much better choices out there.

I often see Brompton owners around the city train station and invariably they are wheeling their bikes unfolded (ready to ride). There is only one German guy I met who carries his folded bike up from the underground to the mainline station. Excluding the sections of escalator where he places the bike on the step in front of him, I would say that he has a walk of about 150 yards or so. He is a tall and fairly strong looking guy but even still it is obvious when following him that the weight is affecting his stance and his spine & shoulder is pulled over to one side. I have never yet seen a Brompton owner pushing or pulling their folded bike along on the little jockey wheels.

The clamps on a Brompton are a long way from what I would call “quick release”. I have a Titan Mountain 20” wheeled folder (looks similar to a Dahon) which I bought from e-bay just to try out a folder. I can fold it fairly fast now (it has 3 quick release catches) but it is never going to be as quick as the Bike Friday Tikit that I’m planning to buy this year. Most days I only need to fold the bike once I get to work, but there are times when a train rolls in and I realise it is packed and then have to fold the bike and squeeze into the carriage. There are also times when they put on rail replacement busses due to engineering work. On the first day I folding the bike while still on the train so it was ready to go into the small luggage rack on the buss (and I'd also seen a notice that bikes where not permitted on the buss), but invariably the train stopped at the furthermost end of the platform that morning so it was a case of rushing along the platform and then up and over the bridge and out to the waiting buss, by which time the weight was getting a bit much....at least the buss drivers where very happy to accommodate my folder. The Bike Friday Tikit with its quick fold and easy to roll (when folded) feature would really excel in such situations.

Oh and Bike Friday have dealers here with bikes that can be test ridden before purchase or placing an order

Paul

folder fanatic

Hello BikerLover,

I am the Webmaster to a series of Websites on Folding Bicycles (see below). I try to gather as much information on these sites as I can on not only my own (I have 3 folding bikes-2 Dahons and 1 Brompton), but the much larger overview of the folding bike world with text and photos. See the official Brompton Website for more information on their marketing strategy. Actually the world's largest bike company that devotes itself to this unique style of bike is Dahon. While most dealers might not have one on their showroom floor, the Dahon Stocking Dealer (a dealer that specializes in Dahons) usually have a model or 2 on their showroom floor for test riding purposes. I would check out both the Dahon Stocking Dealer closest to your residence as well as your closest Brompton dealer to start your research. In my own case, the closest Brompton dealer to me is also a Dahon Stocking Dealer too. They also stock Birdies and other folding bikes brands too. Shops like that are the best places to start (and purchase from).

invisiblehand

What are you really looking for? Information on folding bikes or information on marketing strategy?

cooker

I test rode a Brompton and found it too cramped and upright...the seat tube is not angled back far enough and the seat is mounted far forward on it...although perhaps it can be moved back by flipping the clamp, I'm not sure. The pedal struck the ground when I made a sharp turn. It just didn't feel like it would be comfortable to ride very far or very long.

I decided on a Bike Friday, and when I ordered it, I was shocked at how much more expensive it was than I had expected, once I asked for all the features I wanted. Almost $3000 after shipping to Canada, but I decided it was a lifetime investment so I went through with it. The ride is so much better than the Brompton I tested I was thrilled, but perhaps I would have been just as happy and gotten away far cheaper with a Swift or some other folder designed for standard riding geometry.

doraemonkey

I guess I would have to repeat what everyone here has said. It depends on what you want to do with the bike. I don't have a folder yet, but I plan on getting one soon. I will probably go with the brompton because it folds the smallest. I have other bikes, and will use those mostly... so having the most compact would be the primary issue for me... I am not going to take it on long rides, so if I can pedal with it for 30 minutes, it's ok...

Primary usage for me would be to take on the TGV train when I go to Paris a few times per month.

mulleady

I second 14R's comments which are very objective as he has experienced several folders including the Brompton which is for him.

As a marketing lecturer I would have the following to say:

1) Brompton's are expensive because the founder Andrew Rtchie is commited to keeping the manufacturing in the UK based in Brentford West London rather than outsourcing manufacturing to lower cost countries.
2) Brompton's mainstay are its middle class commuters. They use a good old fashioned distribution network of local bike dealers who are capable of demoing and servicing the bikes. Brompton only use the Internet and their website as brochureware and as a point of customer contact.
3) The Brompton is probably renowned as the best combination of compact folding and ride performance in a commuting type bike. As the market for folding bikes has exploded because of the green movement and increased emphasis on fitness, Brompton reacted to the strong competition by increasing its product development and 16" wheel bike range. In London the demand for Bromptons rocketed 400% after the July 7th terrorist bombings in 2005 which targeted the public transport networks. Demand has continued to grow in the UK because of the government cycle scheme where you can pay in instalments through payroll. Although Bromptons are expensive, people using this scheme can save roughly 22-57.5% off the price of a folder. It doesn't have to be a Brompton but BR benefitted the most from this in the UK.
4) Brompton have a popular niche market overseas, especially in major cities where people commute and need compact folding. Again they use expert dealers to distribute the bikes for them and ship them from the UK. The pricing strategy is to keep them at a similar pricing point and not pass on the shipping costs from the factory.
5) The biggest folding bike manufacturer is Dahon who make a huge range of folders, some argue too many. Dahon cannot match Brompton in the compact folder 16" wheel class to be honest. However they make some excellent all purpose and specialist folders. There has been huge growth in the market entry of other folding companies as the international market for folders continues to grow. It is likely the folder will become the major commuting bike of choice globally as competition, increased rates of innovation and support for urban cycling continues to grow. This is reinforced by niche markets for folders for touring, camping and sailing. The internet has contributed hugely through its viral nature in spreading the awareness of folding bikes. They are no longer a small niche.
6) To give him credit, Andrew Ritchie feels that the increased competition is only good for both his company and the folding bike market in general. His only issue is copyright rip-offs and I don't blame him!

rhm

I admire Brompton's resolve to keep manufacturing in GB, but that's about as far as I can go in their praise. I suspect their marketing strategy is based on the assumption that the high cost of their bicycles adds to their allure: Faced with two bicycles, one priced at $400 and the other at $1400, people will assume the $1400 one is somehow better. After I test rode a $1400 Brompton I bought a $400 Downtube Mini, and have been pleased with the purchase.

14R 

A practical example:

This picture was taken in Rio de janeiro, Brazil, last December. The guy in the middle had a chance to test ride 2 Bromptons and the Downtube Mini before making his final choice. He said that if the Brompton were the same price of the downtube Mini, he still would rather have the Mini. Better cockpit geometry for him, more gears, radioactive paint, the list goes on, he said the Mini is WAY BETTER than the Brompton. Period.

The guy with the black Brompton, on the other hand, could not fit 2 folding bikes inside the trunk of his small sedan, making any folding bike worthless for his needs. If the Mini or any Dahon bike was FREE and the Brompton US$5K each, he still would go after the Brompton since that's the only folding bike meeting his needs (now he can travel with his girlfriend-and their Bromptons- without the hassle of bike racks).

Money wasn't an issue on their decision, and they could not see themselves happier with another bike than the ones they purchased.

Now the guy wearing black on the other hand, would be happy riding the R14Ti
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interesting, at least.

R14Ti...I mean....14R.