For the bearing play adjustment bold, it must not be really tightened, it must be adjusted to have no play in the bearing.

For the two others, I don't know the torque value.

I didn't adjust the wheel stopper plug after switching from the factory mounted Marathon Racer to the Big Apple (what I did is removing one plastic washer between the fender and fork on the bolt at front of the fender to have more clearance between fender and tire). You just need to push the wheel harder to make it go over the wheel stopper plug.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...6cabe7dc11.jpg

Thanks Jipe but it didn’t work for me. Stopper was so deep into the tire that I’m pretty sure it will cause tire damage if left like this for prolonged time. BYW how frequent do you check tire pressure on Big Apples? I’d assume they will loose air much slower than high pressure Brompton tires which I had to control weekly.

As you an see, on a Birdy with front light, the stopper plug is mounted on the front light adapter plate. This one can be adjusted .

Maybe this plate is not placed the same on your bike as on my bike?

On Birdy without front light, the stopper plug is directly bolted in the fork and its possible to do so on a Birdy with front light by mounting it on the left side of the fork that has the same threaded hole than on the right side (hole which is used to mount the front light adapter plate).

mine has the same adaptor.


https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...8e2bd85a7.jpeg


But I can’t see how it can be adjusted in depth, so I simply removed the plastic stopper which is secured with a screw. Light adaptor remains there. Also I don’t see how this stopper it can be mounted on the fork as it’s designed to be mounted on a bracket with screw on the other side.

The front light adapter plate position can be adjusted what also changes the position of the stopper plug, maybe changing the position of the plate would help ?

On the Birdy without front light, the plug is different and can be adjusted (at least the one I have mounted on my Ti Birdy, but this bike is different from a Birdy III, so I am never sure that it will be the same on a Birdy III).

Now what you could do to mount the stopper plug on the right side in the fork threaded hole is to put in the thread of the stopper plug a short threaded rod with one or two nuts and use the nut/nuts to adjust the length of the stopper lug.

I don’t think moving light bracket will change depth pf the plastic stopper as it remains parallel to the fork. I’m planning to ordered these and use one on one side or maybe two. These are specifically designed as wheel stoppers.


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c9fdd7da7.jpeg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...594c87dd8.jpeg

This is exactly what suggested you to make with the current stopper plug and a piece of threaded rod+a nut !

A stopper on one side is enough.

You have seen the picture of my Birdy/fork, it has Big Apple and it works.

The R&M Birdy Rohloff come from factory with the same front light assembly and Big Apple and it of course works, below a picture of such a Birdy Rohloff:

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e010a263d8.jpg
.

I don’t have a piece of threaded rod and if I can order one I don’t have the tools to cut it to length. I understand how it maybe done but I guess I’ll need to see if I can do it.

Did you try to mount your chanring at the inner position what reduces the chainline and might allow you to remount a 11-36t cassette ?

This might work, but beware, it may cause chain rubbing in a different spot instead: Where the chain passes close to the suspension pivot point. I had that problem before when I was using 11-speed derailer gearing, before the Alfine 11. CEBEP, I guess it's hard to know for sure without trying, but it's an easy thing to try.

CEBEP, I thought your chain rubbing problem was with the original, medium elastomer? Could the new harder elastomer allow 34-36t?

If not, it might be possible to raise the swingarm just enough by inserting a shim of a hard material between the elastomer and the swingarm. This must be done with great care and in small millimeter increments, and it may void the warranty. But done carefully it could allow you to use the 36t.

My bike mechanic was trying what he thought was right to do and it was taking much longer than it should. He tried 36 and 34t which were both rubbing with removed spacer from the crank hub. So I just ask him to install 32t and call it a day.

I installed hard elastomer after cassette was was installed so I can’t say. Still I assume elastomer will deform a little after usage and/or loading the rear with 15kg of bags and the last thing I want is it starting to rub again. My mechanic offered to leave the bike to him so he can experiment with different cranksets but I didn’t want to spend anymore time or money on it. 32t is after all a factory wide cog so I thought I’d just leave it at that. I’ll use it the way it is and see if 32t is enough for where I ride.

I suggest to try to place the chainring on the inner position to reduce the chainline because another member runs a 36t cassette without problem with a Dura-ace crankset which is a rod crankset and has also a reduced chainline compared to the factory installed crankset.

The test is very easy to do: dismount the chainring from its factory external position on the crankset with its 5 bolts and remount it at the inner position. It could be needed to remove the black plastic chainring protection ring.

Seems to be working, just enough to hold the wheel. Thanks for advise Jipe


https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2ff07a803.jpeg

Guys what do you think could be a good option for 2 chainrings?

I think it’s the best way to increase range without compromising efficiency. If yes which chainring combination you think will work best? Big one as 52 I think will do. Also what I will need to do it? Thanks.

Update: Jipe I found your previous messages in the thread. My understanding is that your Birdy Titanium is factory equipped with 52-36 crankset and a braze-on Shimano 105 front derailleur. Do you think I can add 36t chainring to my 52t one? If yes which one would you recommend or it doesn’t matter if they all are standard?

Then I assume I’ll need Ridea front derailleur adaptor, front derailleur and then I should be fine to install it?

Hey BabyCowHK
I have R&M Birdy Touring with hollow crankset and assume I can add a smaller chainring (36t?) to the current stock spider with 52t stock chainring? Will appreciate if you could share your experience with upgrading Birdies to 2x front chainrings. Assuming stock chain line will allow adding a smaller chainring, what else will I need, which front derailleur will you recommend, anything else I’ll need to
consider? Thanks

Yes, the Ti Birdy is factory equipped quit a 52-36 compact crankset and after upgrade has a 9-32 11s 3T/Ethirtheen cassette.

But with the 9-32t cassette I never need the smaller 36t chainring and have been considering to remove all that almost useless double chainring stuff (it was mounted because the original cassette was a stupid 11-28t with a too short range).

If you want a double with a front derailleur, you not only need to add a second chainring, but also to replace the factory installed 52t chainring which is not made to switch chainrings. The usual combinations that work with all front derailleur are 50-34, 52-36 and 53-39. To have best performances, you should take a set of chainrings from one single manufacturer because chainrings are optimized to work together.
You need BCD 130mm chainrings.
I would take a Ultegra front derailleur or a cheaper 105 and you need a shifter for instance a Shimano SL-RS700 left (for the front derailleur).

I’m happy to go with Shimano chainrings as that’s what my mechanic sells. I assume 52-36 would be my best choice. I may only only need to use 36t on really steep hills on 32t cog. Do I need to change the crankset and spider/cranks or only Shimano chainrings and front derailleur will do?

What would you recommend for front derailleur adaptor, Ridea or Litepro? I think factory equipped Birdy’s come with Ridea ones.

I also came across this post from Green Basikal where they claim that bottom bracket needs to be changed to a longer one to make sure front derailleur will work correctly. I’m not sure which Birdy they modified but it looks like asian one doesn’t look like R&M. As far as I know R&M Birdy Touring bottom bracket is suitable for double chainring?

The Birdy of the link use another crankset than the original one that might have another chainline than the original one of the R&M Birdy. If ypou look at this link fro 50PlusCycling you will see that a road crankset has a too narrow chainline for the Birdy III (which isn't the case on the Ti Birdy that has a FSA SLK Light carbon road crankset).

You cannot put a Shimano 52-36 on the Birdy crankset because these are BCD 110 (old ones from old Shimano groupset, current one have a four arm proprietary Shimano mounting) while the Birdy has a BCD130 crankset. In BCD130, the standard double chainring sets are 53-39.

Anyway, the 36t chainring is much too short on a small wheel bike like the Birdy to use all cogs of the cassette, only the few smallest cogs are usable, so 39t is OK.

I haven't used a derailleur adapter on the Birdy, but Litepro is usually cheap, low quality parts, so I would take the Ridea.

Thanks Jipe
I came across your previous messages in the thread and also think that 53-39 should suite better and will give me 395% range with my 10s 11-32 cassette. I just checked gear calculator and 39 will give me 1.75m on 32t cog which I think is pretty close to the Rohloff low range of 1.5 ish and definitely lower than my lowest Brompton at 2.33. So climbing hills should be fine. Also 53t will somewhat improve high range too as it will be 6.94m which almost matches my 6 soeed Brompton at 7.05m. Do you think using 53t might cause any shifting issues or rubbing? I think 1t difference on chainring shouldn’t be an issue.

Do you think Shimano 53/39 chainrings will fit on my slider or I have to change cranks too? If yes which Shimano chainring model? Should I also change bottom bracket? Derailleur and derailleur adaptor are pretty clear now.

Shimano changed the spider of their crankset many years ago from 5 arms BCD130 for double like 53-39 and BCD110 for compact 53-36 and 50-34 to a proprietary 4 arms.

You need to find a 5 arm BCD 130 53-39 set of chainrings in Dura-Ace or Ultegra or 105.

There are also compatible sets of chainrings from Specialite TA or Stronglight you will also probably need longer chainrings mounting bolts (the original ones are for a single chainring) but your mechanivs will most probably have that in stock.

I definitely advise to not change the crankset as it will most probably change the chainline !

Does anyone have experience with Shimano ZEE or SAINT derailleurs on Birdy? They have really short cage and the lowest they get is pretty high even on a 16’ wheel. Picture from another thread.


https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...27563df7d.jpeg

Very clear and helpful image!

If you can install a Shimano RD, you can install a Zee RD. There is nothing special or proprietary about its mount or mounting. It mounts on a regular derailleur hanger as shown in the image.

Thanks, but I’m asking if anyone had installed it on Birdy. You’ve mentioned in other thread SAINT too. Which ones has shorter cage in your opinion? And what’s the difference between them?

The difference between Saint and Zee is roughly the difference between XTR|XT and SLX|Deore. Weight, sheen, bragging rights and 2x the price.

M99 is now available with impressive 200 lux. It’s really amazing how they could squeeze it from dynamo hub power. Though I don’t know how this thing can be mounted on Birdy handlebar. Also not sure how the beam pattern is. €273 is not really cheap either.

And its 273€ without taxes! In EU, its 330€ with taxes.

For the beam pattern, its similar to the M99 mini for ebike that has an excellent beam pattern.

For this money you can buy decent Detachlon BTwin TILT 500 folding bicycle. 7 speed.

CEBEP I can't answer that one. I'm in Asia and the touring models are different in Asia and Europe. When Pacific Cycles makes the bike, it has this tenancy of changing minor build configurations. So if there is a 2mm spacer installed on the drive side, it's normally good to go with a direct double chainring upgrade.

Normally the Asian model (sold by Pacific Cycles) has a spacer installed on the drive side when using a hollow axle crankset. It allows sufficient clearance for a direct double chainring setup without the chain scratching the rear fork's pivot area. Chainline is often a consideration but in Birdy bikes the allowance width on the chain line is relatively narrow. My other B3 10SP Sports model (Pacific Cycles Asian model as well) has the same 1x2mm spacer setup on the BB. I had it directly upgraded to dual chainrings without scratch or chain line problem, shifting was perfect. My setup was 53/39.

** Take note that you can't go with 36T small chainring. From the photos on R&M website, it's clear that the crank is a BCD130 hollow axle crankset made by Driveline. The smallest chainring you can go is 39T. **

In my experience, you can use most of the road FD without a problem. You will need a FD clamp to work with Birdy that's specifically manufactured for Birdy due to Birdy's wide 40mm seat tube diameter. Then you get a Braze-On type road FD. We usually get the front shifter from the series of the FD. I've used Shimano Tiagra, 105, Ultegra, Dura Ace FD. My friends have used other SRAM road FD as well.

If you want to try it out. I would suggest you to get a very cheap spared, old, 2nd hand pair of BCD130 chainring set to begin with. You don't need a FD to test it. Get chainring bolts that's long enough to hold the chainrings. Install them and do a manual hand shifting between the chainrings. You will know whether the chain line is right or not, or whether the chain will scratch the rear fork.

There are another two considers to go through for a double chainring setup on Birdy. The first one is whether the RD capacity is large enough. Second is the RD position while running on the small front chainring. Very often the RD will be pointing to the ground at the position near 90 degrees to the ground when it is shifted to use larger cassette sprockets. The RD cage will become very near to the ground on some RDs. It won't have a problem when we use large front chainring. This is a bit too much to explain here in one reply. If you want to know about this one I can explain more in another reply.

Jipe might be a better one to answer that BB spacer question for the European Birdy Touring model since he's in Europe.