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Fake and Fake again

Old 12-15-08, 03:27 PM
  #26  
trueno92
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Originally Posted by regfman View Post
I have another question about the fake Stridas:

I weight 185lbs and I find (I should be using the past tense as my fake Strida has a broken ball joint that needs to be repaired so I'm not riding it) that when I pedal the seat wiggles side to side a lot. It is not firm. It's not really the seat that is flexing - I've changed out the cheap kids seat that it comes with for a regular rail mount seat I had around from another old bike. It's the large plastic bracket that attaches to the frame with the bands that is doing the flexing.



Do other people have this problem on their fake Stridas? It's been mentioned that there are multiple makers of these fakes, I assume using multiple versions of the parts. Is it possible to swap out a better/less flexy, firmer plastic version of the seat bracket part?
even tho there seems to be multiple makers of the fakes, I bet they all use stuff that comes from the same bins.

either way, the best way to resolve flexing is sorta a comprimise.
what you have to do is use 2 of the screw pegs that go into the rear tube. from there, mount the taller peg at the highest point you can when the plastic shell fits around it when its fitted. There are 3 holes for the 2 pegs so choose the height that works best for you. Do not be afraid to go higher than what you think is normal, as this bike is far from normal and since i have owned my strida and put quite a few km's on it, i have increased the saddle height 3 times. lowered it 0 times. it really feels far more nimble, natural and fast when the seat is higher. At the highest most comfortable setting on the strida, the saddle is still lower,

also try not to over tighten the 3 screws that hold the shell together, as they can strip.. although heavy duty ones can be had for less than $2 from Home Depot.
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Old 12-15-08, 03:41 PM
  #27  
trueno92
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Originally Posted by EvilV View Post
........and someone swapped out a front disk brake for another one, so I have no reason to suppose I'll not be able to get genuine Strida bits if I want them
Indeed. I have swapped out the front disc brake for an AVID BB7, the front disc brake kit is actually a rear unit from a normal bike, minor modification would be required to fit a front bracket disc brake kit to the front wheel..

i have also swapped out the crankset, pedals, seat, and added bar-ends to the folding bars - extending the reach a little, making longer rides not so cramped.

genuine strida-centric bits like the plastic headset, belt, wheelset can be had from areaware.com simply email them and they can source these for you, they even have some already instock. Just be aware to not bike-nerd them onto your fake bike details!
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Old 12-15-08, 06:05 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by EvilV View Post
'Is the price of the real Strida any sort of a bargain, given that we are talking about buying three tubes, a plastic transmission system, a crank spider and two small wheels?' The answer in my opinion is NO. By any standards, in a global market, the Strida is far too expensive...

I know that Mr Saunders is not involved in marketing the Strida 5, so he can't be blamed for its ridiculous price, and nor can he be blamed for being cheesed off at people copying what he designed...
You've hit the universal dilemma of manufacturers and designers square on the head there, EvilV... and one can only hope that those that come out winners in this particular instance are the ones that deserve to be rewarded.

I must admit, when I found out how much a genuine Straida cost in my country, I was a taken aback. However, I have some inside knowledge in the industry (however limited), so I know how incredibly expensive R&D can cost, not to mention the minimum legal and patenting expenses that are necessary in claiming and protecting a "new" idea or product. The Straida is not merely three tubes, a couple of wheels and some pedals put together as it would appear now that the rest of us have the benefit of hindsight. Behind the scenes, it represents years of critical thinking, design refinement, material selection, tooling and marketing investment, and so on... a lot of buckaroos. Somewhere along the line, those that took the risk and coughed-up the "initial" cold hard cash (and time) have to factor-in this investment in order to recover it.

Unfortunately for the Straida bike, the beauty and brilliance of it's design may also prove to be it's achilles heel. It just looks too simple to cost that much (however justified I'm sure). Because the bottom-line is, the public will and can only compare it with other existing bikes already in the market. The public does not see what goes on behind closed doors to be able to relate the cost to those factors. It's about a thousand bucks over here and that - is the price of a pretty good medium spec MTB hardtail with front suspension fork, 27 speeds, and so on... It's just too hard for the consumer to bridge the mental gap between price and value.

One thing's for sure, if I (or one of us) came up with that design and put a considerable portion of our lives on the line to see it through, I'd be pretty piss'd-off too if other factories grabbed the idea then marketed the product based on manufacturing costs alone. But what can we do? Who wants to spend more money with litigation?

T'is the times we live in...
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Old 12-15-08, 11:05 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by trueno92 View Post
either way, the best way to resolve flexing is sorta a comprimise.
what you have to do is use 2 of the screw pegs that go into the rear tube. from there, mount the taller peg at the highest point you can when the plastic shell fits around it when its fitted. There are 3 holes for the 2 pegs so choose the height that works best for you.
It's too cold to go out to the garage, unscrew the three screws clamping the bracket together and check it out. But my recollection is that there was only one peg. Did yours come with two pegs?
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Old 12-17-08, 09:23 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by Pocko View Post
One thing's for sure, if I (or one of us) came up with that design and put a considerable portion of our lives on the line to see it through, I'd be pretty piss'd-off too if other factories grabbed the idea then marketed the product based on manufacturing costs alone. But what can we do? Who wants to spend more money with litigation?

T'is the times we live in...
Completely take on board the whole of your post and especially agree with the quoted sentiment. However - I bought it - I am a flawed human being. To be honest, like most people, I'm looking for a bargain even though I know that not all bargains are as great as they may seem when you've had them a while.

I've ridden it 45 miles now. Today I took out the old Merc for an 11 miles spin and it is a FAR more capable machine. There is really no comparison for even moderately hilly terrain, and I averaged about 13 mph which is more than the top speed of the triangle. However, this unfavourable comparison is not a feature of this particular iteration, but of the fundamental design. This is of course well acknowledged by everyone involved with the project and also riders. Strida is a short range, clean, utterly simple machine that will take you around a city three times faster than you can walk. So far, so does the fake. I even rode it two miles down a fieldside mud path yesterday and it even handled that, inspite of ending up very muddy.


Pros:
  • Very cheap
  • Tight, stiff frame and structure
  • Major components strong and functionally effective
  • Fun to ride
  • Silent in use
  • Clean and slip free transmission
  • Very light and compact
  • Well painted


Cons:
  • Luggage rack brittle at low temperatures. At a mere -2degrees C, it broke when I dropped it on unfolding
  • Some allen screw heads not well machined. Query hardness
  • Drive belt adjusted too tight on delivery
  • Minor wheel truing and spoke tension issues
  • Spongy brake action, but stops effectively (edit - massively improved by proper adjustment. Now not spongy at all )
  • Creaking from bottom bracket shell made of plastic (fixed with oil)
  • No spares backup. Use Strida originals
  • Tendency to handle in a twitchy way on wet manholes, leaves and ridges in tarmac - a feature of small wheels and tyres

Last edited by EvilV; 12-30-08 at 01:17 PM.
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Old 12-17-08, 09:54 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by regfman View Post
It's too cold to go out to the garage, unscrew the three screws clamping the bracket together and check it out. But my recollection is that there was only one peg. Did yours come with two pegs?

Yes mine came with 2 stainless threaded pegs that fit into either of the 3 holes.

Take the existing one and see if you can find a suitable screw from homedepot. There should be a match.

the bike is foldable, so bring it into the house to work on...!
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Old 12-17-08, 10:00 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Pocko View Post
One thing's for sure, if I (or one of us) came up with that design and put a considerable portion of our lives on the line to see it through, I'd be pretty piss'd-off too if other factories grabbed the idea then marketed the product based on manufacturing costs alone. But what can we do? Who wants to spend more money with litigation?

T'is the times we live in...
This debate came up a million times talking about fake bikes, and Mark Sanders had publicly made his sentiments known. If he can just see more people riding bikes, regardless if they are real/fake/otherwise, and it took knock-offs of his lifes work to make that happen, he is more than satisfied.

he is looking at the bigger picture of what bicycles should be used for - not profited from.

Originally Posted by EvilV
Originally Posted by EvilV
I even rode it two miles down a fieldside mud path yesterday and it even handled that, inspite of ending up very muddy.
I have actually taken my bike around and returned 24 beer bottles on it, and have been riding it 3x a week, even in the snow, here in toronto. I've been riding it to my weekly spinning classes at the gym and for errands to run around my urban neighborhood.




Its rather neat looking, with 2x 6 packs in the pannier and another case of 12 bottles on the rack.

Last edited by trueno92; 12-17-08 at 10:16 AM.
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Old 12-17-08, 10:43 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by trueno92 View Post
I've been riding it to my weekly spinning classes at the gym and for errands to run around my urban neighborhood.




Its rather neat looking, with 2x 6 packs in the pannier and another case of 12 bottles on the rack.
Outstanding. It's getting a real workout and looks supremely flexible as a simple transport solution.

Yours has one small bolt on either side of the steering pin and mine has two each side. Some claim the pin to be flexible and loose. Mine is totally rigid. Yours also has the exact tyre tread pattern as mine, but I don't have the red coloured information patch on the tyres. The remark up above about the bikes being put together by different factories out of the same parts bins rings true. I expect there is one factory producing plastic bits and selling them onto assembling factories. Likewise tyres and other bits like brakes.

LOVE the Brooks saddle though. Really classy. Some would say that's like putting lipstick on a pig mind you, but then I like pigs, so why not?

Did the Brooks saddle go on there in a straightforward way? It looks like the lower rails are far lower than the standard seat rails at the back.

EDIT:

Jeez! I just checked out the price of those darned things... Some are nearly the price of the bike. I do need a better seat though. The riding position is very upright and the butt takes a pounding.

Last edited by EvilV; 12-17-08 at 11:04 AM.
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Old 12-17-08, 11:07 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by EvilV View Post
Outstanding. It's getting a real workout and looks supremely flexible as a simple transport solution.

Yours has one small bolt on either side of the steering pin and mine has two each side. Some claim the pin to be flexible and loose. Mine is totally rigid. Yours also has the exact tyre tread pattern as mine, but I don't have the red coloured information patch on the tyres. The remark up above about the bikes being put together by different factories out of the same parts bins rings true. I expect there is one factory producing plastic bits and selling them onto assembling factories. Likewise tyres and other bits like brakes.

LOVE the Brooks saddle though. Really classy. Some would say that's like putting lipstick on a pig mind you, but then I like pigs, so why not?

Did the Brooks saddle go on there in a straightforward way? It looks like the lower rails are far lower than the standard seat rails at the back.
I could have walked all those beer bottles over, or could have threw them in the car, but as a bike ride about 15 mins away, if that, this was the most ideal situation. none broke and with the extra-weight, the downhill sections were fun!

The pin being flexible.. well.. thats kinda a 2-sided story. the pin itself is solid. its fixed, and its not moving anywhere. however the size of the pin and how it fits the bottom-bracket tube is critical to the how much play there is in that bottom bracket tube. since that lower tube is getting all the torque applied to it, it does twist and move a little bit, affecting how cleanly the belt engages and disengages from the drivewheel. So, the pin doesn't move, however its size and fit directly relates to how flexy the overall frame is, since thats the only connection that could develop play. If the pin itself is loose from the front tube, it can be tightened down.

The tires you speak of on your bike are some chinese brand, i forgot which.. they have a 45psi limit I believe. I replaced my rear with a Schwalbe Marathon and the front is a Kenda K-west, both kevlar lined. They are also both rated for 100psi. Changing over the tires to something that is 100psi is in my opinion, the best upgrade for the bike overall. resistance is dramatically reduced and the bike rolls along effortlessly.

The brooks saddle fits the bill, esp with the higher pressure tires. the small 305 wheels barely absorb any shock on their own. the rails fit the seat bracket just fine.. takes a bit of squeezing to get it on at the front of the rails, but after that, its easy. Again, raise this higher and although at first, the ride is increasingly twitchy, and u feel like u have a high center of gravity, after a few rides, you will find it feels far more effecient and much better posture.
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Old 12-17-08, 11:17 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by trueno92 View Post
The tires you speak of on your bike are some chinese brand, i forgot which.. they have a 45psi limit I believe. I replaced my rear with a Schwalbe Marathon and the front is a Kenda K-west, both kevlar lined. They are also both rated for 100psi. Changing over the tires to something that is 100psi is in my opinion, the best upgrade for the bike overall. resistance is dramatically reduced and the bike rolls along effortlessly.

The brooks saddle fits the bill, esp with the higher pressure tires. the small 305 wheels barely absorb any shock on their own. the rails fit the seat bracket just fine.. takes a bit of squeezing to get it on at the front of the rails, but after that, its easy. Again, raise this higher and although at first, the ride is increasingly twitchy, and u feel like u have a high center of gravity, after a few rides, you will find it feels far more effecient and much better posture.
I was thinking today when riding the merc that the ride was a fair bit harsher than the SLO. Tyres are probably a large part of that. The SLO is pretty plush by comparison.

What model Brooks saddle did you use?

I can see how a sprung saddle might make the ride more twitchy. The slightest movement can make the bike change direction. Checking the time on my watch for example. Taking my hand off the left H. bar and wiggling my watch out of the cuff of the jacket was enough to set me wobbling.
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Old 12-17-08, 11:50 AM
  #36  
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I can ride the strida no hands now, but thats quite a bit of practice, combined with my other somewhat less tight geometry track bike.

The brooks I have has the coils in the back, its the Champion Flyer. the saddle itself doesn't make things twitchy, but as you move the saddle higher, it also moves it closer to the apex of the triangle and you effectively pull yourself further away from the rear tire.. so your geometry goes counter intuitive to what more conventional geometry bikes produce when the saddle is raised.

BTW< the coiled brooks saddle may seem to have non functional coils since they are so stiff, but your arms squeezing them together will not simulate 170+lbs being on them, and thats when they really shine.
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Old 12-17-08, 05:42 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by EvilV View Post
Completely take on board the whole of your post and especially agree with the quoted sentiment. However - I bought it - I am a flawed human being. To be honest, like most people, I'm looking for a bargain even though I know that not all bargains are as great as they may seem...
Oh, cheers EvilV, but I think you may have misunderstood (or maybe I worded it poorly).

I was talking about manufacturer's dilemma where it is vital for companies to price their products accordingly - as close as possible to it's perceived market value... and how sometimes it's not always possible to achieve. Leave too big a price gap and someone else will fill that gap with a knock-off. Leave too small a gap and the company could go under from lack of revenue. That sort of dilemma.

My sentiment wasn't pertaining to our dilemma as consumers...

.
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Old 12-18-08, 03:28 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Pocko View Post
Oh, cheers EvilV, but I think you may have misunderstood (or maybe I worded it poorly).

I was talking about manufacturer's dilemma where it is vital for companies to price their products accordingly - as close as possible to it's perceived market value... and how sometimes it's not always possible to achieve. Leave too big a price gap and someone else will fill that gap with a knock-off. Leave too small a gap and the company could go under from lack of revenue. That sort of dilemma.

My sentiment wasn't pertaining to our dilemma as consumers...

.
No - I got that Poko. Your wording was very clear. I just took the idea on a touch - empathising with the people who invented an idea, did all the engineering calculations and testing, developed the concept in the light of that, struggled for the capital to produce it, and then I go any buy a knock off. The guilt (such as it is) or the sentiment of it was entirely self imposed. I knew you weren't pouring it on me. LOL - and it is water off a duck's back anyhow. This is a tough old world, and people are opportunists. That's how we survive. If all my ancestors had scrupled over taking meat by force from those who had killed the mammoth, I wouldn't be here, and neither would you. It's a hard world, and we are all a part of it. Who comes out best is up to each one of us.
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Old 12-18-08, 04:26 AM
  #39  
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Old 12-18-08, 06:49 AM
  #40  
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Well, I also have fallen victim to the Strida bug. I got a red one from the guy in Wembley, a bit luckier than others, the auction closed at 100 pounds exactly. He told me he had bought a container of them as a one off, he was offered the bike and he took them, didnt think it would be repeated. He was also stunned at the anti-dumping duty that had to be paid, implying that it vertually doubled the landed cost of each bike.

Not ridden it yet as travelling on buiness, but will be taking it to Milan in the new year, where the single speed is not an issue, the whole place is flat. Italian girls like to ride side saddle on the backs of bikes, so maybe i need to do something about the brittle rack, replace it with something more sturdy and comfortble. I may also put some Ferrari stickers on it, I doubt threre are too many Strida's in Italy, even less fake ones, and Ferrari have brought out a range of cycles, so that could be good for a laugh or two,

At the moment I cant quite see the best way to lock the bike up, in the little handbook it seems to suggest locking therough the rear wheel, but that would presumably leave the frame exposed - any ideas ?

I hope it works out ok, just as a bike, because if it does I would certainly like to move up to that beautiful cream one they have on the french Strida site.
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Old 12-18-08, 07:08 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by EvilV View Post
No - I got that Poko. Your wording was very clear. I just took the idea on a touch - empathising with the people who invented an idea, did all the engineering calculations and testing, developed the concept in the light of that, struggled for the capital to produce it, and then I go any buy a knock off. The guilt (such as it is) or the sentiment of it was entirely self imposed. I knew you weren't pouring it on me. LOL - and it is water off a duck's back anyhow. This is a tough old world, and people are opportunists. That's how we survive. If all my ancestors had scrupled over taking meat by force from those who had killed the mammoth, I wouldn't be here, and neither would you. It's a hard world, and we are all a part of it. Who comes out best is up to each one of us.
.. you may take the crown from Snafu for top posts !!
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Old 12-18-08, 03:15 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Diode100 View Post
Well, I also have fallen victim to the Strida bug. I got a red one from the guy in Wembley, a bit luckier than others, the auction closed at 100 pounds exactly. He told me he had bought a container of them as a one off, he was offered the bike and he took them, didnt think it would be repeated. He was also stunned at the anti-dumping duty that had to be paid, implying that it vertually doubled the landed cost of each bike.

Not ridden it yet as travelling on buiness, but will be taking it to Milan in the new year, where the single speed is not an issue, the whole place is flat. Italian girls like to ride side saddle on the backs of bikes, so maybe i need to do something about the brittle rack, replace it with something more sturdy and comfortble. I may also put some Ferrari stickers on it, I doubt threre are too many Strida's in Italy, even less fake ones, and Ferrari have brought out a range of cycles, so that could be good for a laugh or two,

At the moment I cant quite see the best way to lock the bike up, in the little handbook it seems to suggest locking therough the rear wheel, but that would presumably leave the frame exposed - any ideas ?

I hope it works out ok, just as a bike, because if it does I would certainly like to move up to that beautiful cream one they have on the french Strida site.
Buy two and let the Italian girls ride the spare.

If the anti dumping duty hit him that hard, he's in trouble letting them go at 100 - 110. The Chinese price on the website I referenced earlier was showing them at $94. If they were doubled (not counting transportation charges) he needs about $190 per bike. If he paid $94 and had the price doubled by duty, he needs to be selling them at 126 just to cover his costs. He certainly isn't getting that.

You can lock it with a cable lock through the crank wheel. I mean the chain wheel, but there is no chain. It has holes in it that a cable will go through. However, the back wheel doesn't come off easily, so you could lock it through there.

Last edited by EvilV; 12-18-08 at 03:20 PM.
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Old 12-18-08, 03:23 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by Simple Simon View Post
.. you may take the crown from Snafu for top posts !!
No - never, but thanks. I miss her drole sense of humour. She might come back one day.
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Old 12-30-08, 11:04 AM
  #44  
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Well I'm still loving the SLO (Strida Knockoff). I rode it about eleven miles this afternoon and it behaves perfectly. The only gripes I have are with the seat which starts to feel pretty hard after about six miles. I can shuffle about on it, and relieve the pressure, but it is still uncomfortable.

I spent a few minutes adjusting the brakes before I took it out and they now work very well. One pad (the fixed one) was adjusted, but on both front and back, the moving pad was about 2 mm off the disk. This meant that it only came firmly into contact at the end of the brake lever travel. The brakes are so good now that I can easily lock the back wheel. I'm careful about yanking on the front brake, because I know it will pitch me over the bars and onto the road. Since I am fond of my front teeth, I treat that lever with caution.

I've done about seventy miles on the bike and I can't really find fault with it in any serious way. For the money I paid, it was a steal. One sold for 100 today from the same seller.

He has a job lot of 5 going for a buy it now price of 510.

http://shop.ebay.co.uk/merchant/abo_...Q_fromZQQ_mdoZ
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Old 12-30-08, 12:04 PM
  #45  
kegoguinness
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This post is giving me hopes for the Strida2 I got off Ebay. I'm so in love my with Speed P8 that I haven't given the Strida its due yet. Only looped around the parking lot with it so far.

EvilV, that top ball joint on yours (where handlebars meet, um, the downtubeS), is it mired in a greasing agent that's kinda whitish? Mine is, and wondering WTF it is, or if someone did a "home lube" job on this old Strida of mine (kinda sounds like a new Home and Garden Show: This Old Strida with your host Bob).
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Old 12-30-08, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by kegoguinness View Post
This post is giving me hopes for the Strida2 I got off Ebay. I'm so in love my with Speed P8 that I haven't given the Strida its due yet. Only looped around the parking lot with it so far.

EvilV, that top ball joint on yours (where handlebars meet, um, the downtubeS), is it mired in a greasing agent that's kinda whitish? Mine is, and wondering WTF it is, or if someone did a "home lube" job on this old Strida of mine (kinda sounds like a new Home and Garden Show: This Old Strida with your host Bob).
As it happens, I had a good look at the ball joint today. Since it isn't made of nylon, but some kind of grey plastic, I check it out now and then, even though I've only ridden a few miles.... I just want to be sure I can rely on it. No - it isn't what I'd call mired in grease, but it does seem to have a small smear of grease on the ball joint - nothing surplus, just a smudge. There would be no need to 'mire' it in lube anyway. The joint only moves a very small amount and is not subject to any kind of wiping action. Sounds as if the previous owner lubed it up heavily. The strida design is a pretty lube free zone, except for internal stuff like the wheel and BB bearings.

I have wondered about smearing the lower steering pin (the joint that comes apart when you fold it). Mine does appear to have the lightest possible smear of lube on it now.

What I especially like about this bike is that it is almost totally silent. All I hear is the freewheel whirr, and occasionally, a kind of knock as I begin pedalling and the freewheel pawls kick in and drive the rear wheel.

The only bummer about this bike (apart from the hard saddle) is the 13mph top speed. My legs would become a blur if I tried to pedal faster. This is a stupid criticism though, because the whole concept of the bike is that it is a tiny, totally simple 10 - 11 mph relaxed commuter / local errand bike
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Old 12-30-08, 12:46 PM
  #47  
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EvilV, I have a Strida 1 and I bet your 'unofficial" version works better. It is indeed an errand, take it easy bike.
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Old 12-30-08, 01:10 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by bykerouac View Post
EvilV, I have a Strida 1 and I bet your 'unofficial" version works better. It is indeed an errand, take it easy bike.
LOL - Oh I couldn't possibly make a claim like that bykerouac - but the Strida 1 needed more development to make it what it has now become in the '5'.

All I can say is that so far mine works very nicely after a bit of setting up. It's OK and it rides in a very pleasant manner.

I'm quite sure that more care has gone into the making of a real Strida 5, the question would be, 'Is it three times the care and is the real bike three times better? I get the 'three' multiplier from the fact that the real bike is more than three times the price. If mine were to break in half while riding, I might consider that I should have spent more money, but to be perfectly honest, I don't think there is any chance at all of that happening. I do check all safety issues regularly though.
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Old 12-30-08, 05:20 PM
  #49  
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As mentioned in this topic I broke the plastic socket of the top ball joint and I ended up buying a replacement socket from a source that I think is a Strida distributor. I just received it this afternoon and have done the rerouting of the cable to string it back through the new socket part and I've inserted the replacement socket back in the frame.

But I can't get the ball to pop back into the socket. Sesamecrunch has pointed me to a video

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=p8yx8XsUPJw

showing it being done and I've tried that technique of setting the bike upside down and using the foot to press it into the socket, but that ain't working. anybody got any other ideas?
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Old 12-30-08, 05:39 PM
  #50  
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Hopefully the ball part of the joint on your copy bike is the same size as the ball o the real Strida. I expect that it is, but it has to be a VERY tight push into the socket, else it would be popping out and killing people as their bike fell apart while riding.

I once saw a set of instructions where someone used a rope or something, wound it around the two parts of the joint with a piece of wood inside the loop and then twisted the wood around like a 'garrotte' and forced it in that way. I have the feeling that these notes were made by Mark Saunders.

http://www.strida.us/Tips-from-Mark.pdf

There are other methods here if you follow the links, but I haven'y checked them out.

http://www.stridaforum.com/forum/vie....php?f=2&t=379

Last edited by EvilV; 12-30-08 at 05:55 PM.
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