Wow, I'd bet against that! Dahon is the most widely distributed folding bike in the world, and production dwarfs Brompton. They'll probably outsell Brompton just to people who've never even heard of Brompton!

Wow back as you comparing Dahon's entire range with Brompton's very narrow niche. You might be surprised if you checked Brompton's figures and recent growth. FYI Bromptons sell to people who never heard of them but witness its fold then ride the bike. You write Brompton off too easily based on your own assumptions ;-)

Thor, recognizing a problem is the first step in solving it. These repeating denials of spare part availability issues suggest it will never get improved.
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I don't know what assumptions you're talking about, because that Dahon produce and sell more folding bikes every year than Brompton, and have done so for 30 years, is a fact. That the Dahon dealer network is larger is a fact.

I don't want to take too much for granted, but the numbers suggest a tremendous sales advantage for Dahon, and I don't see any reason that Brompton's sales should grow. In fact, there almost certainly will be some lost sales for Brompton because there has been a lack of competitive products to do what Bromptons do. The Curl seems poised to bring the battle straight to them.

It seems that the video has already been made, but is private.

I still have not seen a Curl in action; youtube or otherwise. I saw from this one site that it's a one speed. Thor, have you played around with one yet? I would like to learn more about it.

I don't think that video is a about the Curl. From what I remember, it shows up on all the bikes that don't have videos.

what you need ? Bring it ....

1. A diagram and part list similar to http://www.brompton.co.uk/uploads/data_full.pdf for Mu P24 purchased 4 years ago.

2. A place where one can order parts similar to http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/brompton-shopbrompton_pg1/

In the past you was able to get me some parts (thanks!) and some not (e.g. left grip shifter for Mu P24 DualDrive 24). In one case I had to dremel a 'vitesse IGH' chain guard to fit. It's a crapshoot. I appreciate your help but Dahon should make its spare parts more available to the public.

When I joined the forum, this war was raging with the usual suspects doing battle. When I leave, it will continue, so, carry on!

I must admit, it does get tiresome.

As I said you are comparing an entire range of bikes to a niche folder so I won't bother debating with you. You think Brompton aren't growing? I can give you real facts and stats since I'm writing a business case study on them but I won't waste my breath.

The Curl will take the battle to Brompton? That's a big claim and let's see what happens. I'd rather talk about the Curl now than try to have a conversation with someone who has no clue about Brompton's business model or bike.

It is OK for people to debate a point but it is futile to rubbish particular brands and some people get over-opinionated and start to troll. Luckily, the majority of people who use the folding bikes sub-forum are intelligent helpful, often funny and interesting individuals. The trolls are a minority who like to dismiss others and try to score points in their own mind.

I'm glad the Curl is finally being released and any new bike will always be of interest. I'm glad a reputable specialist like NYCe wheels are giving it a go and I expect to see Thor the God of Dahon's thunder to follow suit soon :p

Get a grip. Who said anything about Brompton growing? You're just pulling crap out of your bung because you got called out, and don't have a leg to stand on. Rage on, if you want, but you're clearly not a serious person.

The comment on the nycewheels page, "The Dahon Curl is no longer available. Best- Jack" sounds rather final to me.

agree Kamtsa an exploded view would indeed be nice. Last I heard is that a couple folks are working on it. But I havent seen anything yet either..

having a website with all parts listed for sale is only half the battle, having them in stock is the next.... just sayin

about that SRAM part. All suppliers are supposed to have the parts in stock and should be able to deliver them to shops who carry the brand. Unfortunately Sram didnt have the exact shifter, I think I send you a replacement which worked, but was not the same, but a combined unit. Shame on Sram but not so much Dahon... Sometimes the exact replacement isnt available, but something else to make the bike perform is the key. Different color or different model as long as it works I am happy, to a point anyhow. For me the main thing is to have stuff ( or something which works) to have the bike back on the road, some of my customers relay on their bikes to get to work..

Thor

What did I do to you to warrant such comments simply because I disagree with you? I agreed with you that I don't like the handlebars and offered to show you a pic of my modification. Secondly I pointed out there is no point comparing Dahon's entire folding range to Brompton's niche. The Brompton is aimed at commute n'go and shorter journeys. Dahons 20" wheels and upwards are suited or longer distances and have different segments. I'm just talking about comparing like for like. I don't think you've taken the time to understand Brompton or their company before jumping on my comments.

You said and I quote directly Brompton Bicycles is a type of company once thought extinct: a London-based
manufacturing company. Based in Brentford, where they make the folding bikes for which
they are famous, this 30 year old company has seen recent sales growth of 25 to 30 per cent
per year.


So there is no reason for Brompton to grow? And there product is not competitive? The market speaks for itself so you can keep using the word FACT without providing any. Finally the Curl is not exactly cheap is it? Despite Brompton's prices they keep selling. Brompton now produce over 30,000 bikes per annum and it can still not sell enough. It's greatest problem is not selling its bikes but meeting orders and expanding production capacity. They plan to double this in 2012-13 to deal with order backlogs.

And I repeat, I never said Brompton are bigger than Dahon but they are growing and cannot sell enough bikes and the market wants it despite all your claims. I don't see the Curl preventing that.

The Curl looks like a quality bike and I look forward to seeing it. The Brompton is not for everybody and nor should it be. I own a Dahon, Brompton, Pacific and Airnimal and the entire folding bike sector is growing right now which is great to see.

[embarrassed] Oh yeah, I did say something about growth, didn't I? Sorry for lashing out at you with my misplaced indignation. [/embarrassed] What I wrote is not what I was thinking, but I'm compelled to concede your points on the growth issue, particularly as I did not know Brompton was geared up to double output in '12/'13.

Thanks and no hard feelings to you. I like Dahons and can't wait to see the Curl in person. Don't forget I'm in agreement with you that Brompton can innovate more on things like handlebars and some other options. I love it but modified it and recognise it's not the bike for everyone.

I didn't like the riser bars. See my old posting below:

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...=pacific+reach

PS: I didn't like the gear shifters either and changed those.

Brompton could use the Apple model, Western design and customer service and tightly controlled Asian manufacturing. This would increase their margin and allow them to scale as much as they need.

If I were in the market for a bike like the Brommie or the Curl, my money would go to the Brommie. It's proven itself over time and IMHO it's has a classic beauty to it (read "frumpy" to others). Also, the Curl appears to be made of alum' and I prefer steel alloys... another reason I'd opt for the Brommie.

I hope not. Once they aren't made in england anymore they would start to lose their appeal.

Actually one of the reasons asians love them is because they are "made in england" it's the mystique of it all. Once they find it's made in their own backyard they'll lump it together with the rest and not expect to pay such a price for the item. At that point you'd better have some awesome component groups hanging off your bike and better frame technology to stand out instead of just the name.

Brooks itself has been trying to move alot of their other items back to europe because some questions on their website asked why are they paying european prices for asian manufacturing which is much less.

It would need to be tightly controlled after their Neobike experience. They are focusing on factory expansion in Brentford West London. The recent increase in prices isn't helping but this seems to be symptomatic across the sector.

Did you expect the topics or style to change just because you recently joined this forum?

Apparently we are by far the best behaved of all the sub-forums so there you go! :D

How could something that's never been sold retail become 'no longer available'?

Just a guess: the Curl is in the pipeline, but NYCEwheels jumped the gun by listing it for delivery.
Know for sure: the Curl continues its 5+ year odyssey of not being ready for prime time.

Asia? They could do that by moving the factory from London to Belfast or Glasgow, and still keep their manufacturing in the UK.

I think you made some very good points However the Brompton frames are extremely well made under the local process. When Brompton had a brief foray with Neobike in Taiwan, the quality was never quite the same. You would need some premier league Taiwanese manufacturer like Pacific making the frames and then they wouldn't be that cheap in the end with the repatriation of transport costs to ship them outside of Asia.

Lol at Kammie!

I would take nycewheels stock status with a grain of salt. I ordered this item twice in the last year, in both cases it was not available despite the permanent "usually ships in the next business day' status.

http://www.nycewheels.com/brompton-a-seatp-alu.html

Their videos and Brompton selector are great though.

I don't know why Dahon gave up on the Curve SL 8 speed hug? That was a good bike but it had a poor choice of color. The new Curve has a great color scheme but it appears Dahon was not able to keep the price down.

There's no reason for Dahon to make a Brompton size folding bike that only has 2 speeds. The Curve 8 speed was a better bike.