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Swift folders

Old 01-19-12, 08:12 PM
  #2951  
jur
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Yeah I built a skipped spoke wheelset for my wife's Moulton APB. I basically skipped pairs because skipping every second one results in all spokes going to one flange being stressed at the rim due to the angled nipple holes.

On my Swift (pic above) I skipped every 2nd spoke on the non-drive side and laced that side radially as well.
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Old 01-23-12, 08:13 PM
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I am over 6'4" and had a problem at first with flips over the handlebars. One was with a pothole. The other was instant braking to avoid a collision with a car. By putting on a three inch extension to the steerer tube, the problem was solved.
It is a very good bike and this little tweak made it safe for taller riders.
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Old 02-01-12, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by ginojames
Ok all ordered up after a lot of uming and talking to my local bike shop about fitting the hub

The main thing I was worrying about was the axel length on the s2c as it 162mm, so it would only leave 7mm either side to get a lock nut on, the guy at the shop insured me it will be ok.....

I will post some pics when I'm finished

I'm trying to figure out if the S2C, with its 162mm axle length, would indeed work on the Swift. Has anyone actually done it? I haven't found any concrete evidence anywhere. Advice? Comment?

Thanks much!
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Old 02-01-12, 02:16 PM
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lexm had a Swift built for his wife with the S2.
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Old 02-01-12, 03:39 PM
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Found it! Very nice. I note that it's a custom. I wonder if the rear dropout dimensions are the same. Sir, if you're out there, could you chime in with the particulars? I was just going to order a stock model from Xootr and change some parts.

Thanks!
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Old 02-01-12, 03:42 PM
  #2956  
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You could also buy just the Xootr frame from designer Peter Reich (contact via Xootr) and build it up as you want.
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Old 02-01-12, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by jur
You could also buy just the Xootr frame from designer Peter Reich (contact via Xootr) and build it up as you want.
I could indeed. Thanks for the thought. I'm guessing I'd end up spending more, though. The last bike I built up from a frame and fork ended up costing me double what a floor model would have been. I was thinking of being less picky this time, though that's always hard.
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Old 02-01-12, 07:20 PM
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The Sram Duomatic has spacers so it can be out to 130mm.
https://www.universalcycles.com/shopp...&category=2713
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Old 02-01-12, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Dynocoaster
The Sram Duomatic has spacers so it can be out to 130mm.
https://www.universalcycles.com/shopp...&category=2713
Thanks. I did just notice that, but I'm not so confident about the spring modification that's been discussed. I'll poke around for some more direction on that.
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Old 02-02-12, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Dynocoaster
The Sram Duomatic has spacers so it can be out to 130mm.
https://www.universalcycles.com/shopp...&category=2713

Another question that I haven't been able to find the answer to (it's not on Sram's site) -

What's the chain line for this hub?

Thanks again, all.
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Old 02-04-12, 02:58 PM
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Hello. I've been enjoying an 8-speed IGH hub on my swift, but I'm thinking of switching to a fixed gear (I'll keep the old wheel, of course). Looks like 20 inch complete wheels with fixed hubs are hard to come by, so I assume I'll have to get something built. There are a number of great fixed swifts on the forum, but any suggestions for setting up the swift as a fixed?

In particular, I'm wondering if it's worth getting 451 rims given the expense and limited tire selection or if I should stick with 406s.
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Old 02-04-12, 09:45 PM
  #2962  
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Originally Posted by nstone
In particular, I'm wondering if it's worth getting 451 rims given the expense and limited tire selection or if I should stick with 406s.
I built up a Swift from a frame with drop bars, sidepull brakes,and 451 rims. But I have become dissatisfied with tire selection - no studs, no Schwalbe, etc - so I have put V-brakes back on the bike with Travel Agents so the STIs can drive them. I just gave Harris Cyclery $225 to build me a 406 wheel with a Capreo hub. I'm done with 451.

others' mileage varies
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Old 02-09-12, 09:41 PM
  #2963  
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hey well this is very interesting. I just got a quote from HPM to weld a disc tab onto my fork, but I'd of course have to pull it off the bike and ship it to them and wait. if I can just do this with a jubilee clip (and new wheel, of course) it would be days not weeks.

performance question: I have drums on my Trek Soho and they suck rocks. equally bad wet or dry. so I am nervous, though I've heard that the Sturmey-Archer version is much more effective - some say they are as good as disc brakes. is that possible?

Originally Posted by bendembroski
I'll just toss one more option out there:

A drum brake. I don't know what the weight penalty would be compared to a disc conversion, but they pull the same amount of cable as road levers. They stop well, and a new wheel much simpler solution than trying to get a disc fitted.

I used drums on my Swift and was extremely happy with them. They stopped fine (on par with a good set of v-brakes IMHO), weren't affected by weather, needed no maintenance, and I didn't have to worry about the rotor getting bashed while the bike was folded and in transit.

It doesn't really jive with the 'high prefomance' feel you are looking for, but that's probably a matter of aesthetics more than function..
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Old 02-09-12, 11:44 PM
  #2964  
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Originally Posted by mtalinm
hey well this is very interesting. I just got a quote from HPM to weld a disc tab onto my fork, but I'd of course have to pull it off the bike and ship it to them and wait. if I can just do this with a jubilee clip (and new wheel, of course) it would be days not weeks.

performance question: I have drums on my Trek Soho and they suck rocks. equally bad wet or dry. so I am nervous, though I've heard that the Sturmey-Archer version is much more effective - some say they are as good as disc brakes. is that possible?
My ICE trike has SA drums. They are awesome and I have flown down many oregon mountain passes with them.
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Old 02-09-12, 11:48 PM
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nice to hear, nice to hear
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Old 02-10-12, 11:40 AM
  #2966  
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Just wondering if anyone with experience on their Swift has any caveats/general advice on my potential build. I've done some research to come up with this. This is for primarily having a "performance" bike I can take with me and ride when I travel, and ideally commuting as well. Potentially even some group rides:

I definitely want drops and something that has reasonably high gearing so I'm thinking of 451 wheels, a wide cassette 11-32 with a large front chainring (~56 teeth), and no front derailleur (to reduce weight/maintenance). I don't really want to have to go with Capreo because of it's expensive/exclusive parts. I've read 451 wheels have fewer tire choices, but I won't need studded tires (I have a 26" MTB winter bike for bad conditions). I ride a lot of hills so I want wider gearing.

Obviously it doesn't have to be a small fold - I just need it to fit in a suitcase occasionally.

Any advice/tips appreciated!
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Old 02-10-12, 01:05 PM
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IDC, I imagine you'll get a ton of responses to this question. I'll weigh in as an owner of two Swifts, one the standard config and the other with drop bars.

The Swift is a great bike with drop bars. I wouldn't say it's quite as fast as my road bike, but it's not a huge difference. If you want drop bars you will need to do 451 wheels unless you want to adopt 1) cantilever brakes 2) non-rim brakes like drums or discs 3) extra-extra long reach sidepulls, or 4) Travel Agents (as I have, because I prefer 406 wheels). If road tires are sufficient then you should be fine with Primo Comets or Panaracers, neither of which is to my liking though many folks swear by them.

I second your idea of avoiding the Capreo setup. I have it on two rear wheels, a 451 and a 406, but I had to literally file down the derailleur and hanger to get it to drop into the lowest (9-tooth) gear. It's an ugly hack and while it works, I like your idea of a wider cassette with a large front chainring and wish I had done the same.

My main caution to you would be that the Swift may not fit eeasily into a suitcase with drop bars. I haven't tried it, but I'm in no hurry to either because I can barely get the flat-0bar version to fit. Mine is a 30" hardshell Samsonite that confirms to airline specs, so I never pay a surcharge. A bigger suitcase might fit drop bars, but check whether your favorite airline charges extra for oversize (many care only about weight, in which case you'd probably be ok).

good luck!
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Old 02-10-12, 02:18 PM
  #2968  
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I have mostly what you spec: For a long time I rode my Swift with 406 wheels, a 60T chainring and 11-28T cassette or when I need the extra range, 11-34T cassette.



Because I found I wanted slightly higher gearing and also don't like the ide of Capreo, I went 451 wheels. The bars are bullhorns but with the upturned front portions sawn off. I eventually installed a FD because I do the Alpine Classic and need the low gears for when my legs are stuffed near the end. But for years I didn't have the FD and I primarily ride in the mountains here. When I installed the 451 wheels I rode with a small chainring fitted and would shift by hand if needed.

So, ignoring the FD, I currently have 451 wheels with 60T ring, a 11-28 cassette, bullhorns with cross-top brake levers and barend shifters, an XT Shadow RD. You would need a MTB RD because a road RD does not have enough large cog capacity, especially if you went for a wider range cassette. With a 56T ring you might not need to worry about getting lower gearing especially if you are reasonably fit. But you might find you lack enough top end on fast rides ir slight downhills. That is what I found - on slight downhills, I would tend to end up spinning too fast for my liking. When taking downhills, I like to pedal at lower cadence compared to doing a fast ride on a flat road, mainly because downhill I am resting and don't want to bounce in the saddle.

I do ride with the lycra gang from time to time and have no trouble keeping up. My own impression is the Swift is indistinguishable from a road bike in terms of speed, but due to the smaller lighter stiffer wheels it accelerates quickly and really carves through corners; with the bigger wheels the BB is also higher and I can pedal through most corners. I just love the feeling of tucking tight and zooming down descents while pedalling through the bends.





I haven't packed my Swift in a suitcase, but others have and it's not impossible but I understand it's not as simple as some other bikes.

To increase the gearing range, you could pair a 10-sp 11-36T MTB cassette with 10-sp road levers.

Last edited by jur; 02-10-12 at 02:21 PM.
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Old 02-10-12, 03:54 PM
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[ If you want drop bars you will need to do 451 wheels unless you want to adopt 1) cantilever brakes 2) non-rim brakes like drums or discs 3) extra-extra long reach sidepulls, or 4) Travel Agents (as I have, because I prefer 406 wheels).

You don't need to do any of that. Just get a pair of drop bar brake levers that work with V brakes. There are several around and they are not expensive. I've just had a pair of 406 wheels built for my Swift, using Ultegra hubs and Sun rims with 32 spokes per wheel. They look fantastic but it will be some time before I can fit them as I'm working six long days a week at the moment and the weather is bad. Still, something to look forward to!
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Old 02-10-12, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by mtalinm
hey well this is very interesting. I just got a quote from HPM to weld a disc tab onto my fork, but I'd of course have to pull it off the bike and ship it to them and wait. if I can just do this with a jubilee clip (and new wheel, of course) it would be days not weeks.

performance question: I have drums on my Trek Soho and they suck rocks. equally bad wet or dry. so I am nervous, though I've heard that the Sturmey-Archer version is much more effective - some say they are as good as disc brakes. is that possible?
As good as is kind of hard to say. They definitely 'feel' different. They almost feel spongy, but when it comes to actual stopping power (as in how much distance to stop the bike at a given speed) I'd guess that they would match a 160mm rotor mechanical disc. Or near enough that any difference is likely to be academic. I haven't done any tests to back this up, just a gut feeling.

The Shimano front roller brake has a widget that is supposed to prevent the brake from locking up. My understanding is that what it really does is hinder the performance of the brake significantly. Sheldon Brown had much to say on the subject if I recall correctly.
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Old 02-11-12, 08:10 PM
  #2971  
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Thanks for all the input! I think I will go ahead with my current spec.

Originally Posted by mtalinm
My main caution to you would be that the Swift may not fit eeasily into a suitcase with drop bars. I haven't tried it, but I'm in no hurry to either because I can barely get the flat-0bar version to fit. Mine is a 30" hardshell Samsonite that confirms to airline specs, so I never pay a surcharge. A bigger suitcase might fit drop bars, but check whether your favorite airline charges extra for oversize (many care only about weight, in which case you'd probably be ok).

good luck!
Thanks! If I have to I think I should be able to pack one or both the wheels in another suitcase to fit the drop bars in the main suitcase. I usually travel fairly light so I imagine that would be ok. I am looking at more compact, 40mm drop bars anyway.

Originally Posted by jur
I have mostly what you spec: For a long time I rode my Swift with 406 wheels, a 60T chainring and 11-28T cassette or when I need the extra range, 11-34T cassette.



Because I found I wanted slightly higher gearing and also don't like the ide of Capreo, I went 451 wheels. The bars are bullhorns but with the upturned front portions sawn off. I eventually installed a FD because I do the Alpine Classic and need the low gears for when my legs are stuffed near the end. But for years I didn't have the FD and I primarily ride in the mountains here. When I installed the 451 wheels I rode with a small chainring fitted and would shift by hand if needed.

So, ignoring the FD, I currently have 451 wheels with 60T ring, a 11-28 cassette, bullhorns with cross-top brake levers and barend shifters, an XT Shadow RD. You would need a MTB RD because a road RD does not have enough large cog capacity, especially if you went for a wider range cassette. With a 56T ring you might not need to worry about getting lower gearing especially if you are reasonably fit. But you might find you lack enough top end on fast rides ir slight downhills. That is what I found - on slight downhills, I would tend to end up spinning too fast for my liking. When taking downhills, I like to pedal at lower cadence compared to doing a fast ride on a flat road, mainly because downhill I am resting and don't want to bounce in the saddle.

I do ride with the lycra gang from time to time and have no trouble keeping up. My own impression is the Swift is indistinguishable from a road bike in terms of speed, but due to the smaller lighter stiffer wheels it accelerates quickly and really carves through corners; with the bigger wheels the BB is also higher and I can pedal through most corners. I just love the feeling of tucking tight and zooming down descents while pedalling through the bends.





I haven't packed my Swift in a suitcase, but others have and it's not impossible but I understand it's not as simple as some other bikes.

To increase the gearing range, you could pair a 10-sp 11-36T MTB cassette with 10-sp road levers.
Thanks jur, I have seen your bike before and at some point I might even adopt some of the weight reduction measures you took. I love bullhorns (my favourite handlebar) but I figure I may as well go with just straight drop for more hand positions.

My concern with anything more than 11-32 is that the spacing between gears will get too big. Also, I agree I like to have lower cadence when descending (I have 50-11 ~120 to 34-25 ~35 gear inches on my road bike which is great descending at 40+ mph as well as any not-too-crazy climbs) but given that the only time I plan to have only the Swift is on travel excursions I don't think it should matter too much. Probably best to take it easy downhill if I've never ridden the road before. RE: the FD, I actually did some gearing calculations and decided in future I can definitely add a FD and smaller chainring if need be. But I'll try it without an FD first.

Originally Posted by Paul Braithwait
[ If you want drop bars you will need to do 451 wheels unless you want to adopt 1) cantilever brakes 2) non-rim brakes like drums or discs 3) extra-extra long reach sidepulls, or 4) Travel Agents (as I have, because I prefer 406 wheels).

You don't need to do any of that. Just get a pair of drop bar brake levers that work with V brakes. There are several around and they are not expensive. I've just had a pair of 406 wheels built for my Swift, using Ultegra hubs and Sun rims with 32 spokes per wheel.
Sounds like an awesome wheelset! I think I am going to stick with the 451 wheels though for now and see how that goes. The great thing about the Swift is that is uses standard parts so even if your initial build is not quite right, you can upgrade it!
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Old 02-11-12, 09:01 PM
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good point. I was assuming that you want to use integrated shift/brake levers / "brifters" like STI.

Originally Posted by Paul Braithwait
[ If you want drop bars you will need to do 451 wheels unless you want to adopt 1) cantilever brakes 2) non-rim brakes like drums or discs 3) extra-extra long reach sidepulls, or 4) Travel Agents (as I have, because I prefer 406 wheels).

You don't need to do any of that. Just get a pair of drop bar brake levers that work with V brakes. There are several around and they are not expensive. I've just had a pair of 406 wheels built for my Swift, using Ultegra hubs and Sun rims with 32 spokes per wheel. They look fantastic but it will be some time before I can fit them as I'm working six long days a week at the moment and the weather is bad. Still, something to look forward to!
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Old 02-11-12, 09:28 PM
  #2973  
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I do want brifters actually. I'm planning on Tiagra which should do just fine.
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Old 02-11-12, 09:44 PM
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interesting ... certainly concur on the crappiness of the Shimano roller brakes, both front and rear.

Originally Posted by bendembroski
As good as is kind of hard to say. They definitely 'feel' different. They almost feel spongy, but when it comes to actual stopping power (as in how much distance to stop the bike at a given speed) I'd guess that they would match a 160mm rotor mechanical disc. Or near enough that any difference is likely to be academic. I haven't done any tests to back this up, just a gut feeling.

The Shimano front roller brake has a widget that is supposed to prevent the brake from locking up. My understanding is that what it really does is hinder the performance of the brake significantly. Sheldon Brown had much to say on the subject if I recall correctly.
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Old 02-12-12, 01:06 PM
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For what it's worth, I use the Tektro RL520's with v-brakes and 406 wheels. 30 bucks and I find the braking power just as strong as mountain bike levers. Just seems like the cheapest and simplest solution to me.

Originally Posted by Paul Braithwait
[ If you want drop bars you will need to do 451 wheels unless you want to adopt 1) cantilever brakes 2) non-rim brakes like drums or discs 3) extra-extra long reach sidepulls, or 4) Travel Agents (as I have, because I prefer 406 wheels).

You don't need to do any of that. Just get a pair of drop bar brake levers that work with V brakes. There are several around and they are not expensive. I've just had a pair of 406 wheels built for my Swift, using Ultegra hubs and Sun rims with 32 spokes per wheel. They look fantastic but it will be some time before I can fit them as I'm working six long days a week at the moment and the weather is bad. Still, something to look forward to!
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