I don't need any myself but I was recommending them to an acquaintance and he pointed out the website is down, host sez "account suspended".

I can try to find contact info, like through the Wayback Machine, but I thought I'd ask here to see if anyone knows anything.

EDIT: OK I got the contact info, but I won't bother him on a Sunday, will keep you posted if I learn more.

His Etsy store is also down.

Don't know if this is relevant. I ordered a Rosebud for my oxy/propane setup this winter. It was 4 weeks coming even though they sent it right away. But ever call I place to check on it was never answered or returned nor was my email.
Hopefully this is just temporary.

This blog has a lot of information about using propane and an oxygen concentrator for making bicycle frames. He is very detailed about equipment. <https://kuromori.home.blog/propane-and-propane-accessories/> Read what he says about Richard at Paige Tools. It is pretty funny. I've had a number of conversations with Richard over the years. It took awhile to talk him into making the adaptors for other torch handles. My bet is that his age is an influence on what he is/isn't doing.

Otto Frei is a jewelry supply company that sells Meco equipment (including their tips) and light weight hoses. These hoses might be what to get now that TM Technologies is no longer around. I haven't tried them of course. They appear to be a little more durable than the Smith Kevlar hoses. I like that they have an A fitting on one end and a B fitting on the other.

There are other propane tips available and if Paige has disappeared. I'll have to provide that information.

Otto Frei sells several different torch hoses. Can you comment on which one(s) you think are most appropriate for an oxy-propane setup or are most similar to the old TM Tech hoses?

The only ones that look like bothering with on Otto Frei are the meco midget hoses with a to b fittings. I guess the ones with one end missing would be okay, but I hate to put fittings on.

finding what you want from a online catalog can drive a person crazy. Otto Frei has this hose unterhausen didn't see: Part # 114.189 Meco Midget Torch Primo Fire Resistant Flexible Hose set-8",, $79.00.

Do we know if that hose suitable for use with propane ("Grade T")? I asked the Q just now on the website, will report back if they answer.

Frustrating that for some of their hoses they specify grade R or T, others don't say. Makes me respect them a little less...

Do you need a paper catalog to find things from them? That's quaint.

I'm sad about the Paige tips. Since I don't currently use propane, I could never make myself buy any, but I got close many times.

Thanks. One of the comments indicated the inside diameter is only ⅛ inch, not 3/16 as described. I don't know enough to know if it would be a deal breaker, just pointing it out.

They did reply, sadly that hose is Grade R, no-go on propane.

TM lightweight hose is great when I am teaching students in one of my framebuilding classes. They are a bit sturdier than Smith's Kevlar hose and won't get a hole if a bit of melted flux falls on them. However for me personally Smith's hose is the best option. They are the lightest and give no resistance to the torch handle when moving the flame around. It is necessary to remember not to place the hose underneath what you are brazing and also to not let them rest on the floor. If one is capable of not doing those 2 bad things, they are great.

Just to be clear, the hosing combination I recommend from the flashback arrestor with a B fitting is 12 1/2' of 3/16" Type T rubber hose with B fittings on each end. This is joined with the 10' (or what length it is) of Smith Kevlar hose with a B fitting on one end and an A fitting on the other. The 2 hoses are combined with a B/B male brass connector. The A end of the hose should go into the end of an A size check valve attached to the torch handle. Somehow or another you should hang these hoses from above so they are not touching the floor.

It is unfortunate that both TM Technologies and Paige Tools have disappeared. They were convenient. Welders Warehouse in the UK seems to have diminished its inventory of their multiport tips. Looking online now they seem to have only the smallest and largest tips in stock. They sold at a fantastic price too. However their ¼” X 36 tpi threads require using a die so they can be used on Smith’s ¼” X 32 tpi threads. https://www.thewelderswarehouse.com/...s-Nozzles.html

G-tec is a supplier of propane specific mixers, goosenecks, and tips to fit almost every American brand of torch handles. Their various mixers have threads that match a specific brand of torch handle and their goosenecks and tips all have the same Victor threads so they are interchangeable with each other and any mixer. They make both multi-port and single orifice tips. Those are very similar to Victor and Gentec TEN tips except they are made of brass. Their multi-port tips are made out of brass/copper and also designated as TEN so don’t get them confused with their single hole tips. They are much bigger than what we usually use so only the smallest sizes are worth buying. In some applications, their multipart tips are like a rosebud except with a sharp center flame. This can be useful when brazing a fork crown and want the big heat to warm up the mass and still use the center flame to clean the shorelines.
https://www.gas-tec.com/torchtips

I like my Smith hoses. I keep thinking of hanging them from the ceiling so I am not as likely to drop flux on them.

Is this hose set from Otto Frei an option? The description says A & B fittings, Grade T hose. They don't mention the hose diameter, but in the only comment (5 stars) it says:

Well yes and no, I think that hose is made out of standard rubber but just smaller ø. I use that hose as the 1st hose coming from the tank and concentrator. I connect it to the very lightweight hose. If you buy the Smith kevlar hose, then you have to make sure the connector between the 2 hoses are matched in size.

Came across these tips. The Phoenix OX tips sure look like the Tin Man Tips I have.

https://impgen.com/

This last week I was updating the chapter and section in my framebuilding class manual on brazing equipment. It was heavy on TM Technologies and Paige Tools available equipment. TM had just about everything a new builder would need to get started brazing (1 stop shopping). I was the one that talked Richard at Paige Tools into making the adaptors to convert a mixer/elbow from various manufactures into Meco threads. This made “Meco” and Paige multiport propane tips work with about any brand of American made torch handle. These companies’ disappearance has made it more challenging to get a torch + tips set up that works well with propane.

The Jewelry world we borrow from very commonly uses the Meco Midget torch handle. Meco is a now defunct brazing/welding equipment supply company that was bought out by Victor. I suppose its American made projects could no longer compete in price. Victor was bought out by Esab. About the only thing in the Meco line Victor kept making and selling was the Meco Midget. Almost every jewelry and welding supply house online now shows it is out of stock. My assumption is that Esab is not supplying the Midget handle any more and like TM’s hose and Paige tips, it will disappear from new sales when inventory is gone. I think this may have implications for the Meco multiport tips too. There is no future in making them if the torch handle they fit is no longer easily available or really expensive. According to Richard at Paige Tools, Meco/Victor didn’t make Meco tips and I’m sure who the 3rd party was. Richard would get emotionally upset about this subject (dishonest branding saying they are “Meco” when they were being made by someone else) so I would try and keep off of it when I was talking to him.

The price of the Meco Midget has risen considerably even though you almost can’t find one for sale because most places are out of stock. Prices vary between suppliers of course but most displayed a near $500 cost. A former student of mine bought one last week for about $280 from Welding Supply in Elk Grove, IL. It was his preference after trying the various ones I have available. I usually bought Victor equipment from Welding Supply because they actually kept Victor equipment in their inventory instead of most suppliers having stuff drop shipped from Victor after you placed an order (a delay if several weeks). However, typing in Meco Midget torch handle on their website won’t work. This is what will: https://weldingsupply.com/products/v...04?search=true You need to call it Victor instead of Meco and Victor’s part # helps if you are googling to find suppliers. This is why I was complaining about trying to find stuff online. Without the right wording, it can’t be found even if it is being sold. This is why I prefer paper catalogs. I miss QBP catalogs. Also there might be something in that area I might be interested in but not know it exists so I wouldn’t know to google it.

I’m pointing out the fading of Meco branded equipment in case those that might like using their torch and tips can still buy now before inventory runs out. Or consider what other options are available.

I have a Meco Midget that I haven't used much. I actually got it for free, included with a Gas Fluxer I bought used on ebay, not shown or described in the auction.

Are there consumables I should stock up on? Maybe I'll see if I can get another length of gooseneck since Meco sold 3 lengths at least IIRC. Though the one that's on there has seemed fine ffor whatever I've done with it.

It seemed to me that I couldn't get a very large flame with the Meco on my O2 concentrator. It was definitely the O2 that was limiting the flame size. When I put my Smith torch on the same propane bottle and concentrator I got a much bigger fllame. Could that be something in the Midget design, the mixer maybe? Or is it just something about mine, needs an overhaul perhaps? It is pretty old and crusty looking... In case it's your next question, no I didn't have any check valve or flashback arrestor on the O2 line, it's nothing but hose from the concentrator to the torch valve. I guess I could at least take apart the Meco's O2 valve and see if there's anything blocking. Packing washer gone ragged at the edge or some such? So far I've been lazy and I have 2 other working torches so the Meco is on the back burner.

The business in Seattle that used to rebuild torches and regulators sadly went out of business when the old man retired. Luckily they're not complex machines, so I'll just have to be my own rebuilder.

Well, at least there are cloners making the J28. Sad to see all of these companies be bought up. I considered an Esab torch at one time, they have one that is the right size for building frames. But since it's fairly rare, I went with an A1WA. Since I started building bikes with a torch the size of my forearm, my A1WA seems like a nice size.

Not to brag but, a few years ago I got a 2-fer on J28's on ebay for pennies and then I stumbled across a clone also very low priced. I now have several lifetime supplies of torch handles. I can't bring myself to sell them though.

bulgie The CWS in Ballard (on 50th?) apparently took over their services but I don't really know what that means. It's what the previous owner told me as he was closing shop up. I can't imagine they are that complicated so it seems like a careful user should be able to figure it out safely.

I used to haunt ebay buying torches, which is how I got 2 AiWA with two full sets of tips. I'm pretty sure I have 2 J28, but not that many tips. I was going to put Paige tips on my J28, not sure what to do now. Maybe modify a set of A1WA tips

Yeah I heard that too; I'm pretty sure they send them offsite, which probably adds delay and shipping costs, but I might be mis-remembering, this was a while ago.
I've rebuilt both torches and regulators just by buying and installing an official rebuild kit (good reason to buy name brand, so these kits exist). But that's not the same as confirming that everything is to factory spec and working properly. That might take more than slapping in a kit with a few washers and O-rings.

What I was hoping for is someone who uses a Midget on an O2 concentrator to tell me if they're all (like mine) constricted in the O2 volume they can throughput, or if that's only on mine, from some fault or blockage.
I've heard of injector-type torches, that need a high O2 pressure. Is the Midget one of those? I'm thinking not, but I can't find definitive answer. I think I have only experienced equal-pressure type torches.

I haven't tried ImpGen tips but they look promising. They don't screw right on to a Victor, but maybe you could machine an adapter. Possibly a pain since Victor uses that weird 27 tpi thread, but for such a short length of thread, making it in 28 tpi might work fine. Anyone here ever tried such a thing? Or put them on your Smith torch if not stuck on using the Victor. Just spitballin'.

I remember Doug talking about some mod you could do, maybe with Paige tips?

I thought tip mods were for creating a recessed tip from one made for acetylene by drilling a shallow counter bore of sorts. Andy

A propane flame uses 4 times as much oxygen as acetylene. That is why it is much better to use a UN-J mixer/elbow designed for use with propane with Victor equipment. It has more and bigger oxygen supply holes. The Smith equivalent is their AT-61. Multi-port tips like the Mecos and Paiges provide a more stable flame less likely to blow out than their single orifice cousins. Blowout is usually not a problem except when the tip is held close to the work like when fillet brazing. And to make fillet brazing easier I like to use a smaller tip - which is even more likely to blow out. However if multi-tips didn't exist, I could use single hole tips just fine to use as long as they have that small recess at the end to help keep the flame attached. Victor's TEN tips for propane provide a decent flame and in fact I tend to like them better than my Meco or Paige tips for some work like lug brazing.

One propane use solution for various torch handles comes from the G-tec company. They supply equipment to use natural gas - which also works with propane. They make propane mixers to fit different brand torch handles. Their elbows screw into their mixers and can be bought with different lengths. Both ends of their elbows have Victor threads. They also make single and multi-port tips with Victor threads. Their single port tips are the same as Victor TEN tips except they are made out of brass instead of copper. Their multi-port tips work great but have much larger side holes than the Paige or Meco tips designed for the jewelry trade.

Smith used to make a series of mixer/elbows for propane. The ones suitable for framebuilding are the AW405, AW407 and AW409. I have some and love them because they provide a very sharp flame but because they are no longer made, so I don't make them available to my students. Unterhausen might want to look for a set on eBay.