Cyclist vs Biker
03-13-16 | 09:57 AM
#51
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From: Middletown NY
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I joined a cycling club that practiced a type of Sharia law. I made the mistake of waving to other cyclists, my hand was removed in abrupt fashion. Another member had to take a natural out on a ride, he lost his Johnson. Some of these clubs are getting "out of hand".
03-13-16 | 10:21 AM
#52
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From: Delaware shore
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Yeah but if you think people are going to automatically act that way because of what they're riding, you're stereotyping them. If you see a person come out of a store and hop onto a certain type of motorcycle and immediately think certain things about that person, you're being judgmental.
03-13-16 | 10:29 AM
#53
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I used to wave at passing cyclist, most don't wave back. I can't understand the concept of we all ride but are prejudiced against each other. Seems to me that this philosophy isn't that far away from racism. I hope those "elite" cyclists recall that once upon a time, we were all beginners and it should be those that are experienced teaching the beginners their wisdom but not their arrogance.
03-13-16 | 10:33 AM
#54
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From: Heart Of Texas
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The thing is stereotyping is natural. You make assumptions based on past experiences. It's a convenient way to base decisions by putting people into categories. For example if you want good customer service in a high end store, dress up. If you walk into a seedy biker bar at night by yourself in spandex, you can expect trouble
Wait, if that biker bar is for bicyclists no problem.
03-13-16 | 10:41 AM
#55
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How about if we all as cyclists start from scratch,,, starting right now !,,, no matter if the other cyclists is Kited out or in shorts the only move or salutation from you or us will be a controlled Nod, of the head ,,, no smiles no waves no verbal hellos, just a genetic Nod,with no shifting of the eyes to see if you got your nod back ..nothing ,,, how would that work for you???
Back in the 80s when I first started riding there were a lot of snobby cyclist, now not so much. Funny thing is I could've dropped all of them, well except one he was the national TT record holder in the 40 and over category. And he was a jerk. And that's putting it nicely.
Last edited by texaspandj; 03-13-16 at 11:03 AM.
03-13-16 | 10:47 AM
#56
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From: Middletown NY
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How about if we all as cyclists start from scratch,,, starting right now !,,, no matter if the other cyclists is Kited out or in shorts the only move or salutation from you or us will be a controlled Nod, of the head ,,, no smiles no waves no verbal hellos, just a genetic Nod,with no shifting of the eyes to see if you got your nod back ..nothing ,,, how would that work for you???
Sometimes, I don't have the breath to yell out "hi", other times I need my hands on the bars so I can't wave, yet others my focus prevents me from nodding my head in acknowledgement, but it is a rare occasion when all three happen simultaneously and then, for the next few minutes, I fell beneath myself but vow to make it up to the next rider I pass!
So, not sure if your comment was sincere or antagonistic, but mine is sincere and if it opens an eye or two, it was worth the time to type this post.
03-13-16 | 11:01 AM
#57
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That is exactly what I do, even when in my car, if I see a person riding a bike, I wave. If they wave back, great, if not.... well then I hope they find a good therapist and work past their issues.
Sometimes, I don't have the breath to yell out "hi", other times I need my hands on the bars so I can't wave, yet others my focus prevents me from nodding my head in acknowledgement, but it is a rare occasion when all three happen simultaneously and then, for the next few minutes, I fell beneath myself but vow to make it up to the next rider I pass!
So, not sure if your comment was sincere or antagonistic, but mine is sincere and if it opens an eye or two, it was worth the time to type this post.
Sometimes, I don't have the breath to yell out "hi", other times I need my hands on the bars so I can't wave, yet others my focus prevents me from nodding my head in acknowledgement, but it is a rare occasion when all three happen simultaneously and then, for the next few minutes, I fell beneath myself but vow to make it up to the next rider I pass!
So, not sure if your comment was sincere or antagonistic, but mine is sincere and if it opens an eye or two, it was worth the time to type this post.
03-13-16 | 11:04 AM
#58
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Wouldn't work for me. How bout if somebody waves you return the wave? Does that sound ok to you? Put another way if you're walking into a building and someone says hello or good morning do you return it or ignore them? Same thing.
Back in the 80s when I first started riding there were a lot of snobby cyclist, now not so much. Funny thing is I could've dropped all of them, well except one he was the national TT record holder in the 40 and over category. And he was a jerk. And that's putting it nicely.
Back in the 80s when I first started riding there were a lot of snobby cyclist, now not so much. Funny thing is I could've dropped all of them, well except one he was the national TT record holder in the 40 and over category. And he was a jerk. And that's putting it nicely.
03-13-16 | 11:22 AM
#59
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From: Middletown NY
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Ride on... and wave, lol
03-13-16 | 11:40 AM
#60
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From: Dallas, Tx
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Don't call me a cyclist.
I don't want to be associated with the elites on their $10,000 carbon wonder toys that weigh less than a newborn baby.
Call me a bike rider, pedal pusher, biker, anything but a cyclist...
I don't want to be associated with the elites on their $10,000 carbon wonder toys that weigh less than a newborn baby.
Call me a bike rider, pedal pusher, biker, anything but a cyclist...
03-13-16 | 02:14 PM
#62
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I used to wave at passing cyclist, most don't wave back. I can't understand the concept of we all ride but are prejudiced against each other. Seems to me that this philosophy isn't that far away from racism. I hope those "elite" cyclists recall that once upon a time, we were all beginners and it should be those that are experienced teaching the beginners their wisdom but not their arrogance.
03-13-16 | 03:28 PM
#63
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From: Middletown NY
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Here we go with the waving thing again. When you're in your car, do you wave at every other car driver? Maybe at least the ones that drive the same brand as you? If you don't, does that make you an elitist, unfriendly, even anti-social? Maybe, just maybe, those non-waving cyclists are out there to ride their bikes and not to fulfill your goal of making every stranger on two wheels into a personal friend. And what sort of wisdom is taught by a wave, and why do you think a stranger owes it to you to teach it? It sounds like you're the elitist.
Ah, a personal attack from a keyboard bully. Seems like you saw a little of yourself in my post and got your panties in a bunch. It's okay, you'll get over it.
To answer your questions, yes, I do wave a certain cars when we pass. It is common for Jeeps, Corvettes, motorcycles and other similar vehicles to wave at each other. You know, sort of like fellow bicyclists might want to wave because they ride a bike. If you don't want to, then don't. For me, I'd rather live life happy and wave at the world. I never said they owe it to to me, or anyone else. You need to learn how to read and you can also skip you ride today as you got enough exercise by jumping to conclusions.
03-13-16 | 04:45 PM
#64
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According to the dynamics of supply and demand, opinions are now going for less than 2cents.
03-13-16 | 04:46 PM
#65
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From: Middletown NY
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03-13-16 | 05:27 PM
#68
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Cyclist vs Biker
Back in August of last year [MENTION=116878]Viking55803[/MENTION] started this thread”Bike Riding vs Cycling.”
Sometime later was this thread, ”Good Article About Judgement & Snobbishness Among Cyclists,” and my reply.
…On a more serious note that is sure to offend some here, from a newbie to cycling's point of view, whenever someone that I meet refers to themselves as a "cyclist", they usually say so in a snobbish sort of way and look down their noses at anyone who does not distinguish themselves in the same manner. Then these "cyclist" will go out on our club ride, ride 3-4 abreast, cross the yellow line, hold up traffic, run red lights and ignore stop signs (you got to get KOM!).
These same people hate when you can ride at their level and refuse to get dropped but will never offer a word of encouragement. I think the term "snobs" is very fitting in these cases. Mind you, not all "cyclists" are snobs, but too many are and it hurts our sport.
Then, I meet people who "ride" bikes, friendly, helpful, generous and considerate of others, They follow the rules, share experiences and offer advice, congratulate you when you out climb them. They don't care what you call them, they enjoy the comradery of a common bond. Whether it is road, mountain or a cruiser ride down the street, they are just happy to be out there enjoying themselves and glad that no one called them late for dinner!
Some might even see themselves in my description, others, hopefully not… Rant off, not directed at only one in particular, just using a very broad brush.
These same people hate when you can ride at their level and refuse to get dropped but will never offer a word of encouragement. I think the term "snobs" is very fitting in these cases. Mind you, not all "cyclists" are snobs, but too many are and it hurts our sport.
Then, I meet people who "ride" bikes, friendly, helpful, generous and considerate of others, They follow the rules, share experiences and offer advice, congratulate you when you out climb them. They don't care what you call them, they enjoy the comradery of a common bond. Whether it is road, mountain or a cruiser ride down the street, they are just happy to be out there enjoying themselves and glad that no one called them late for dinner!
Some might even see themselves in my description, others, hopefully not… Rant off, not directed at only one in particular, just using a very broad brush.
…While moving along I took a break from the sensations to daydream a bit. I was thinking about how the way most folks refer to cycling - riding a bike or biking - are just inadequate words to describe how I think or feel about what I am doing. Riding a bike seems to be more about getting from here to there, while cycling seems to be about being on the bike.
It doesn't really matter where I go, how far I go, or how long it takes me as it does about the experience itself. Of course, the cliche' comes to mind: it's not about the destination, but he journey, but sometimes cliche's are apt, and I think cycling embodies that in a way few other activities do… for me that's what cycling is about.
It doesn't really matter where I go, how far I go, or how long it takes me as it does about the experience itself. Of course, the cliche' comes to mind: it's not about the destination, but he journey, but sometimes cliche's are apt, and I think cycling embodies that in a way few other activities do… for me that's what cycling is about.
… So in considering your post, my first thought was I think I see the distinction you are drawing, but then thought it seems to hint a bit of elitism…I am a real cyclist; the others are just riding their bikes, though I presume that was not the intent.
So for example, are the subscribers who post to C&V, or Bicycle Mechanics and rave about parts and models real cyclists? Or are cycle commuters who slog through urban environments constantly on the alert for danger, real cyclists? Or Advocacy&Safety and Living Car Free subscribers who advocate on behalf of cycling, really cyclists?
Not that this matters of course, as you said, and I’m not being argumentative; just reflecting on your thoughtful post. I would suggest a definition of a cyclist as one who claims to being a cyclist. For me I make that claim by describing that I live a cycling lifestyle. IMO this is distinctive, and a virtually “alternative” lifestyle.
So for example, are the subscribers who post to C&V, or Bicycle Mechanics and rave about parts and models real cyclists? Or are cycle commuters who slog through urban environments constantly on the alert for danger, real cyclists? Or Advocacy&Safety and Living Car Free subscribers who advocate on behalf of cycling, really cyclists?
Not that this matters of course, as you said, and I’m not being argumentative; just reflecting on your thoughtful post. I would suggest a definition of a cyclist as one who claims to being a cyclist. For me I make that claim by describing that I live a cycling lifestyle. IMO this is distinctive, and a virtually “alternative” lifestyle.
This summer was a thread on the Fifty-Plus Forum, ”Bike Riding vs Cycling” with 105 replies, that IMO was a good discussion of the topic as in the article, and subject of this thread.
Sometime after that thread ended, I thought about this seemingly trivial distinction that makes me think a rider is a "real" cyclist. I watch the way they pedal. Without being judgmental about it, a cyclist has a fluid rotary pedaling motion, whereas I think "bike rider" when I see someone pedaling in a piston-like fashion. Now since pedaling is the foundation of bike riding, I think that style and form makes the distinction. Of course then, while an E-bike rider is a "bike rider" they are not cyclists. No moral or “snobbish” judgment here, but a more "objective" one, FWIW.
Sometime after that thread ended, I thought about this seemingly trivial distinction that makes me think a rider is a "real" cyclist. I watch the way they pedal. Without being judgmental about it, a cyclist has a fluid rotary pedaling motion, whereas I think "bike rider" when I see someone pedaling in a piston-like fashion. Now since pedaling is the foundation of bike riding, I think that style and form makes the distinction. Of course then, while an E-bike rider is a "bike rider" they are not cyclists. No moral or “snobbish” judgment here, but a more "objective" one, FWIW.
03-13-16 | 05:41 PM
#69
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From: Southwestern Ontario
I used to wave at passing cyclist, most don't wave back. I can't understand the concept of we all ride but are prejudiced against each other. Seems to me that this philosophy isn't that far away from racism. I hope those "elite" cyclists recall that once upon a time, we were all beginners and it should be those that are experienced teaching the beginners their wisdom but not their arrogance.
Amazing! "Waving" threads (which this one has degenerated into) are typically moronic, but this takes the cake. With reference to another of your posts below (#56), I'd suggest that it is you who needs a good therapist.
03-13-16 | 05:52 PM
#70
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As far as bikes, I used to do a route near my house where several teams trained. When I had on regular bibs and jersey, I got no waves. When I had team kit on, everyone waved.
03-13-16 | 06:10 PM
#71
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From: Middletown NY
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Soooo ... let's see if I understand: the fact that I can't be arsed to "wave" to other persons -- who with idiotic grins on their faces appear to think that the mere fact that 'we' are both riding bicycles somehow puts us in some kind of 'relationship' (eeeewww!) -- riding a bicycle is somehow tantamount to "racism"?
Amazing! "Waving" threads (which this one has degenerated into) are typically moronic, but this takes the cake. With reference to another of your posts below (#56), I'd suggest that it is you who needs a good therapist.
Amazing! "Waving" threads (which this one has degenerated into) are typically moronic, but this takes the cake. With reference to another of your posts below (#56), I'd suggest that it is you who needs a good therapist.
Whenever I feel the need to talk things over with a good therapists, I can choose from three of my daughters, two are Psychologists and the other a Psychiatrist. It's all about perspective and maybe even as simple as your domestic locale. I know in the cities, no one wants to make eye contact or God forbid, utter a word to a stranger. I live in the country, very rural and mountainous with a laid back lifestyle and no attitudes. Toe-may-toe or toe-mot-oh, it's still a fruit, like you.
03-13-16 | 06:14 PM
#72
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03-13-16 | 06:19 PM
#73
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From: Middletown NY
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Oh enlighten me, you made this personal with your first comment. I can't explain why, but maybe it was because you saw yourself in my generalization
03-13-16 | 07:10 PM
#74
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From: Middletown NY
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I went back and reread some of my comments and can understand some people getting offended. Please understand that was not my intention, I was merely trying to show how some cyclist come across to a beginner.
To all that disapprove of my comments, I offer a sincere apology. It doesn't change what I learned through observation but I never wanted to rattle anyone's cage either, so please accept my apology, forgive if you can and let's move on.
To all that disapprove of my comments, I offer a sincere apology. It doesn't change what I learned through observation but I never wanted to rattle anyone's cage either, so please accept my apology, forgive if you can and let's move on.
03-14-16 | 04:30 AM
#75
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Note that this is "Bike" forums, not cyclist forums. Buncha bikers you all are! 