Father and Son
06-07-22 | 11:28 AM
#26
Sunshine
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 18,731
Likes: 10,283
From: Des Moines, IA
Bikes: '18 class built steel roadbike, '19 Fairlight Secan, '88 Schwinn Premis , Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara Trionfo
Actually, no, my disagreement with him was in suggesting that the child's head would be slammed into the ground like a watermelon if such a fall occurred. There's pretty much no good data to support the notion that the bike seat/helmet combination isn't adequate protection from the consequences of such a fall. And, as you suggest, there may be other factors like the fact that the bike/trailer combination is a bigger target for car impact and perhaps harder to steer that may set off whatever marginal increase in hazard that height might entail.
Obviously, a child on the bike is higher than a child in a trailer, and therefore has further to fall. My contention is that we're really comparing two very safe ways to transport children, and I don't think there's any good reason for someone to get cringy when they see a parent using either method properly.
BTW, if you notice, neither the Consumer Reports or the AAP is suggesting bike seats are unreasonably dangerous, and both are offering standards for preferred features on the bike seats.
Obviously, a child on the bike is higher than a child in a trailer, and therefore has further to fall. My contention is that we're really comparing two very safe ways to transport children, and I don't think there's any good reason for someone to get cringy when they see a parent using either method properly.
BTW, if you notice, neither the Consumer Reports or the AAP is suggesting bike seats are unreasonably dangerous, and both are offering standards for preferred features on the bike seats.
What was said was
If they are over the back tire, then their head might just be a watermelon being slammed to the ground.
This is really just a goofy argument since the higher someone is from the ground, the further they have to fall which clearly means the more likely they are to be injured. And the less protected someone is from the ground, the more likely they will be injured when falling.
Again, I only responded to the fall comment and not other safety concerns between the two forms of transport since the fall comment was what you took issue with.
And yes, I have not seen a report that states either mode of transport is viewed as dangerous.
...I have seen a report that states one is safer than the other when the bike falls though.
06-07-22 | 11:34 AM
#27
Sunshine
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 18,731
Likes: 10,283
From: Des Moines, IA
Bikes: '18 class built steel roadbike, '19 Fairlight Secan, '88 Schwinn Premis , Black Mountain Cycles Monstercross V4, '89 Novara Trionfo
The WeeHoo looks like fun. Does it stay upright when you are fully stopped?
I still have my burley after almost 30 years. I still remember pulling my two kids in it giving me a real good leg workout going up hills. Nowadays, I use it just to wheel around big bulky items ( like relocating a skunk I caught in a live trap).
I still have my burley after almost 30 years. I still remember pulling my two kids in it giving me a real good leg workout going up hills. Nowadays, I use it just to wheel around big bulky items ( like relocating a skunk I caught in a live trap).
The short time we used a Burley trailer, we used to pack it full of books- like a dozen of them so she could just grab one at any given time. It was always funny to clean that thing out after a family ride- a dozen books, a couple sippy cups, a few small bowls of dry cereal or whatever, and who knows what else.
06-07-22 | 12:54 PM
#28
Tragically Ignorant
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 15,593
Likes: 9,109
From: New England
Bikes: Serotta Atlanta; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; Giant OCR A1; SOMA Double Cross Disc; 2022 Allez Elite mit der SRAM
What was said was
IF they are over the back their then their head MIGHT be slammed like a watermelon. He didnt say 'would', he said 'might'. You then went to town and demanded proof based on his saying something might happen.
This is really just a goofy argument since the higher someone is from the ground, the further they have to fall which clearly means the more likely they are to be injured. And the less protected someone is from the ground, the more likely they will be injured when falling.
Again, I only responded to the fall comment and not other safety concerns between the two forms of transport since the fall comment was what you took issue with.
And yes, I have not seen a report that states either mode of transport is viewed as dangerous.
...I have seen a report that states one is safer than the other when the bike falls though.
IF they are over the back their then their head MIGHT be slammed like a watermelon. He didnt say 'would', he said 'might'. You then went to town and demanded proof based on his saying something might happen.
This is really just a goofy argument since the higher someone is from the ground, the further they have to fall which clearly means the more likely they are to be injured. And the less protected someone is from the ground, the more likely they will be injured when falling.
Again, I only responded to the fall comment and not other safety concerns between the two forms of transport since the fall comment was what you took issue with.
And yes, I have not seen a report that states either mode of transport is viewed as dangerous.
...I have seen a report that states one is safer than the other when the bike falls though.
Why you seem to need to do this inaccurate but nitpicky nonsense about my posts approximately every month or so, I don't know. Why you always put words in my mouth I didn't say I don't know. You ALWAYS get what I say wrong, and this is no exception. I literally criticized his post for getting all cringy about his uninformed speculation of what "might" happen and he stated in that post that he based it on nothing other than his imagination. How is quoting him saying "might" a refutation of that? You're just being goofy. The first thing I said to him was "Sorry, but I don't think uninformed speculation on what might happen is really useful here."
I acknowledged the recommendation of one over the other and addressed it, all before you stepped in to correct me or whatever it is you think you're doing. Show me where I "demanded" anything of him.
TL/DR: Nice scenario you got there--too bad none of it happened the way you said it did.
Last edited by livedarklions; 06-07-22 at 12:57 PM.
06-08-22 | 10:56 AM
#29
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2022
Posts: 6
Likes: 1
OP here... Many thanks to all. Extremely useful! I think we are okay to at least 'test the waters' with my current set-up (no one seems to think the bike will just crumple and fall apart under the weight - which was my main worry)... And now I have wealth of new info on both cargo bikes and WeeHoo's, etc. Both will be very likely candidates in the next year or so...
Just on the point of safety, I found that useful also. He clearly has further to fell from a seat, but will be wearing a helmet and I will be going slowly... At least for now, I'd like him close to me, in easy talking and touching distance, rather than out behind me. Data-aside, I *feel* he is more vulnerable out there and so low down.
I have also read that exposure to emissions is FAR worse at lower levels, i.e. exhaust height (for obvious reasons), so having him quite a bit higher is also much safer/healthier in that regard.
Thanks again, Josh
Just on the point of safety, I found that useful also. He clearly has further to fell from a seat, but will be wearing a helmet and I will be going slowly... At least for now, I'd like him close to me, in easy talking and touching distance, rather than out behind me. Data-aside, I *feel* he is more vulnerable out there and so low down.
I have also read that exposure to emissions is FAR worse at lower levels, i.e. exhaust height (for obvious reasons), so having him quite a bit higher is also much safer/healthier in that regard.
Thanks again, Josh
06-10-22 | 02:17 PM
#30
Tragically Ignorant
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 15,593
Likes: 9,109
From: New England
Bikes: Serotta Atlanta; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; Giant OCR A1; SOMA Double Cross Disc; 2022 Allez Elite mit der SRAM
OP here... Many thanks to all. Extremely useful! I think we are okay to at least 'test the waters' with my current set-up (no one seems to think the bike will just crumple and fall apart under the weight - which was my main worry)... And now I have wealth of new info on both cargo bikes and WeeHoo's, etc. Both will be very likely candidates in the next year or so...
Just on the point of safety, I found that useful also. He clearly has further to fell from a seat, but will be wearing a helmet and I will be going slowly... At least for now, I'd like him close to me, in easy talking and touching distance, rather than out behind me. Data-aside, I *feel* he is more vulnerable out there and so low down.
I have also read that exposure to emissions is FAR worse at lower levels, i.e. exhaust height (for obvious reasons), so having him quite a bit higher is also much safer/healthier in that regard.
Thanks again, Josh
Just on the point of safety, I found that useful also. He clearly has further to fell from a seat, but will be wearing a helmet and I will be going slowly... At least for now, I'd like him close to me, in easy talking and touching distance, rather than out behind me. Data-aside, I *feel* he is more vulnerable out there and so low down.
I have also read that exposure to emissions is FAR worse at lower levels, i.e. exhaust height (for obvious reasons), so having him quite a bit higher is also much safer/healthier in that regard.
Thanks again, Josh
Pssst...here's the big secret--no one really knows how all of the safety factors weigh out, and that looks like some pretty good reasoning you've done.
06-11-22 | 03:55 PM
#31
ignominious poltroon
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 6,027
Likes: 5,377
Hello all,
A quick but important question... I am 118kg and my son in 22kg, so together we are around 140-145kg (or 320 pounds max). I have a decent but pretty standard Marin mountain bike, with hybrid wheels/tires.
So my Q is, will my bike (and wheels) safely support my son and I, as we ride around London? Not planning to go off-road!
Thank you!
Josh
A quick but important question... I am 118kg and my son in 22kg, so together we are around 140-145kg (or 320 pounds max). I have a decent but pretty standard Marin mountain bike, with hybrid wheels/tires.
So my Q is, will my bike (and wheels) safely support my son and I, as we ride around London? Not planning to go off-road!
Thank you!
Josh
Flimsy wheels would be the least of my worries.
06-11-22 | 04:42 PM
#32
Senior Member
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 3,160
Likes: 2,367
From: San Francisco
Bikes: addict, aethos, creo, vanmoof, sirrus, public ...
wheels/spokes are mostly likely the primary failure point, along with kickstand for loading and unloading.
i use a yepp next maxi for my 4 year old, but our total weight is lower. 20kg bike 87kg for me and she’s around 18-20kg i think. so maybe 125-130kg total with backpacks, locks, school stuff etc. zero issues with a couple years of urban riding. london is very flat, so you have a big advantage there
i would not in a million years ride around the city with a kid in a trailer. zero confidence that a car would see such a low seat behind me - i’d know she was back there, would a car merging across the bike lane or pulling out of a parking spot give me that extra 3 feet of space?
i use a yepp next maxi for my 4 year old, but our total weight is lower. 20kg bike 87kg for me and she’s around 18-20kg i think. so maybe 125-130kg total with backpacks, locks, school stuff etc. zero issues with a couple years of urban riding. london is very flat, so you have a big advantage there
i would not in a million years ride around the city with a kid in a trailer. zero confidence that a car would see such a low seat behind me - i’d know she was back there, would a car merging across the bike lane or pulling out of a parking spot give me that extra 3 feet of space?
06-14-22 | 03:29 AM
#34
Blamester
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,067
Likes: 138
From: Ireland
Bikes: Peugeot teamline
Like another poster said the wheel won't fail dramatically unless you hit something.
You will know when you ride it how it feels.
And if the wheels can't handle the weight neither will the brakes.
The effect on the handling maybe a worse negative.
Take a slow ride see how it goes.
You will know when you ride it how it feels.
And if the wheels can't handle the weight neither will the brakes.
The effect on the handling maybe a worse negative.
Take a slow ride see how it goes.
06-14-22 | 04:18 AM
#35
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2021
Posts: 2,090
Likes: 513
I remember the first time I saw a dad riding with his kid on a seat behind him. It kind of freaked me out, I was delivering food at the time and crashed fairly often when carrying something or other. Now that ive gotten older and traveled to vietnam where people carry 200+ lbs of stuff on terrible bicycles (not even exaggerating) and reading about the resilience of kids, my worry of seeing kids riding with parents seems silly.
06-14-22 | 11:00 PM
#37
Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 15,400
Likes: 8,319
From: Seattle area
Bikes: Bikes??? Thought this was social media?!?
PeriScope Scout - Co-Motion Cycles
Sorry, don't seem to be able to import the image on the linked page.
But it is a tandem with 26" wheels, upright bars and a huge range of seattube lengths for stokers
Complete bike starting at $3495.00 USD.
Sorry, don't seem to be able to import the image on the linked page.
But it is a tandem with 26" wheels, upright bars and a huge range of seattube lengths for stokers
Complete bike starting at $3495.00 USD.
__________________
Vintage, modern, e-road. It is a big cycling universe.
Vintage, modern, e-road. It is a big cycling universe.
Last edited by Wildwood; 06-14-22 at 11:03 PM.
07-12-22 | 01:56 PM
#38
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,498
Likes: 646
From: Toronto
Bikes: Sekine 1979 ten speed racer
Try something like this.
https://road.cc/content/news/mum-yea...s-viral-294295
“Mum of the year” cycles uphill with bike trailer..."
https://road.cc/content/news/mum-yea...s-viral-294295
