Well, up to a point. For me, that point is reached when riders fail to pick the fights they can win. Not moving over when alerted to an approaching vehicle that out weighs you by some quantum factor is, to me, non-sensical. Riders can get single file and still occupy three feet of lane if there is no shoulder. Besides, we need all the friends we can get.

Not to mention in a lot of places it's against the law to ride two or more abreast with traffic behind. I don't want to start an A&S style flamefest, I'm just pointing that out.

Then it would be illegal whether or not the car was present. Any groups that I ride in, are in single file. They say car back, but no one moves or really does anything. If you are taking the lane it is because you want the driver of the car to pass you with plenty of space.

Exactly! Especially since riding two abreast is illegal, and vehicle drivers seem to know that point of the law very well and have been known to call the cops.

Entire organized rides have nearly been cancelled on that one point alone ... because some riders were riding two abreast the previous year, because some driver called the cops on them, the police are reluctant to give the ride organizers a licence to hold the ride.


Another reason to yell, "Car back" is in case someone decides to pull out and pass someone else or swerve to miss a pothole or something. Some of the roads I ride, the vehicles whistle by your elbow when you're riding the edge of the ditch, if you suddenly moved over into the lane to pass or avoid something, you'd be roadkill.

Sometime it is important to know how big the object we're all trying to avoid is, and where exactly it is located ... especially when riding in a large group, and especially when riding at dusk, dawn, or the middle of the night when it isn't as easy to see.

I disagree. When the "hazardous object" signal is given, everyone still has to look up ahead to see both where the riders in front are going (splitting around an object or moving together to pass an object), and at the same time try to locate the "problem". Having to decipher what KIND of signal was given is unnecessary and delays reaction time, which is a bad thing.

Having just one signal seems to work fine over here, so I can't see why Canada would be any different.

- - -

Riding two abreast is technically illegal here as well, but in spite of that, both the police and our road administration recommend two abreast for larger groups of riders, since that forces a safe and proper passing (we take up space, acting more like a car or bus) and also halves the overtaking distance (and, probably, time).

On many country roads there is no space to pass in the same lane if riders are several abreast but plenty of room to pass (not squeeze by) if they're riding single-file. And going fully into the opposite lane could mean trouble for whatever reason (poor sightlines, somewhat heavy traffic in the other direction...) If you can help make passing faster and safer, why not do it?

However, if there is another lane going in the same direction and there are no laws about riding two or more abreast - might as well stay in a formation.

I ride on 50 mph two lane country roads with no shoulder. If I were driving a farm tractor the driver of the car would have to wait until it is clear to pass. Why should a driver of a car be allowed to squeeze past me? If there are poor sightlines or heavy traffic, the driver can wait until it is safe to pass. Believe it or not driving at 20 mph for a few seconds never hurt anyone.

And really, whether or not they need to use half of the oncoming lane or the full oncoming lane it doesn't matter. Encouraging the driver to use only part of the lane means if a car does approach head on, guess who gets killed when the driver makes a split second decision to save his life over that random cyclist next to him? If it isn't safe to pass, then DON'T PASS.

He shouldn't. But a bike is a lot narrower than a tractor. So there are often situations in which the road is wide enough that it is possible to safely pass a cyclist and leave plenty of room while doing so without going into the oncoming lane or taking up only a very small part of an oncoming lane for a very short time. Road widths do vary after all.

I know that. You're talking to a fellow cyclist here, whose biggest pet peeve might be impatient drivers - not to a JAM! If it were up to me, I'd place cyclists in the middle of the lane by default and have them treated as a full-sized vehicles.

However, we don't live in the world of my dreams, and I see no point in further aggravating impatient drivers when it is not necessary to do so. Especially when it's illegal. There is the whole trouble with the police that Machka mentioned. I agree that laws prohibiting riding two abreast regardless of the circumstances are bad laws, but they exist and why give a$$holes a chance to legally harass you? If you wanted to prevent the motorist from passing unsafely, you can still do it, by legally riding close to the middle of the lane single-file.

In situations I'm thinking about, they don't need to use the oncoming lane at all if the cyclists are in single file. I can also think of situations when it IS safe to use a part of the oncoming lane and NOT safe to use the whole oncoming lane. And yes, I can think of a situation when it doesn't matter how much of the oncoming lane you use to pass. But you're trying to say that the first two types of encounters never occur. They do.

+1

And the thing is this ... cyclists are riding side by side, the vehicle behind has to wait a moment till it's clear to pass. Vehicle driver is revving behind, annoyed at having to wait, then roars by, almost cutting the cyclists off. Cyclists have to swerve to avoid being hit. Vehicle driver is still angry at having been held up and what he doesn't know is that there are more cyclists ahead. Vehicle driver nearly kills several cyclists up ahead (even if they are riding single file) by passing them so close his mirror grazes their handlebars. "Serves them right", he thinks. Then he either calls the police about the cyclists holding up traffic (and the results are that the ride can't be held again, as I mentioned above) .... or writes a letter to the newspaper that all cyclists should be banned from the roads because they are hazards. More drivers read those letters, agree with them ..... and then when the innocent cyclist who rode legally, obeying all the rules of the road like she usually does, arrives at work on Monday morning she is accosted by her coworkers bad-mouthing all cyclists because they know she is a cyclist too ... she is ridiculed and criticized .... and one day she comes out of work to discover that someone flatted her tire.

All because two cyclists broke the law and annoyed one driver. Thanks a lot.

I wonder, do farm equipment drivers find their massive tyres flat too? They hold up traffic much worse than even a huge pack of riders. They also block the line of sight to a large extent, which people on bikes typically don't.

Oddly, drivers seem much more forgiving of farm equipment than they are of cyclists. I guess they figure the farmer is doing a job, but the cyclist is just out "joy-riding" and therefore should get out of the way of people who have to actually get somewhere.

Now I do have to add that I encountered the experiences I've mentioned above in Manitoba, in the Winnipeg area, but I have not encountered that attitude here in Alberta. The drivers here are amazingly good. And on Vancouver Island I had a twilight zone experience when a large pick-up truck pulled up beside two of us who were riding side by side. I expected the usual caustic comments I got in Manitoba, but instead the guy asked us about the ride and then told us that it was great to see so many cyclists on the road!! Wow!!

Nevertheless it shows cyclists in a good light if we do follow the rules of the road.

And probably it's just me, but when I'm out on a long ride, I'd way rather have the car pass me and be in front of me than sit behind me. Something about having a car creeping along behind just annoys and distracts me.

Considering I have been passed at over 60 mph with inches to spare, I can say that I would much rather have a courteous driver wait to pass me when it is safe and only when it is safe.

And everyone else seems to think I am condoning illegal activities by cyclists. I only ever ride single file. I do take the lane. I have as much right to it as the next guy AND it keeps me safe in the conditions that I typically ride in. YMMV.

It's Jersey, after all.... that happens to me so often I hardly even notice it anymore.

I have to say though, that for most part motorists here seem to respect me and pass with plenty of room. But there's always a few knuckleheads out there. I've been passed with inches to spare when I'm in my car too, especially on the GSP.

It is called the rule of the biggest or heaviest vehicle. Farmers know that their tractor outweighs a car and will pull right out in front of them knowing the car will heed. Car drivers know their car outweighs a bicycle and feel they have the same authority over bicyclests.

If only the laws would protect bicyclists. But that takes this thread even farther from the OP's pointing question.

Pointing towards the ground is to indicate a road hazard to the side where the finger is. Glass, tree branch, Hoffa's corpse, etc.

You should see finger down with two snaps in a circle! </Living Color "Men On Film" reference>

Let's talk about the finger up signal

Finger up signal means "get that banana out of the back of your shorts, it's making everyone around you uncomfortable".

I think one aspect of "car back" that has been neglected is when there is a pace line and the front rider peels off to the left and floats back in a two abreast fashion. I've been told-No I haven't looked this one up-that riding two abreast is technically legal but when a car is passing at 50 mph and decides to buzz the line it could get bad if that is the moment the leader decides he needs a break. And no, it is not good form to look back (swervy moving could crash the group).

Also makes pointing out holes and debris crucial when many people are drafting close behine one another. They can't see road hazards ahead so the finger point/wave/circle/wiggle/etc. becomes a lifesaver.

Actually, I have no issus in Jersey...it is the rides through Philly and the burbs that nearly get me killed.

Now that makes sense!!

When you ride the back narrow farm roads in central Texas with no lines or road markings at all and you are 3 across, you better get single file for the pickumup truck to pass!!!

That's usually reserved for motorists and very rarely used on otrher cyclists.