ok, I'm not going to get into what method is best used to determine proper fit, but I think most people will agree that a proper fit is based on your position while riding the bicycle, vs your position while stopped. (not talking about standover height here, but adjustment of the seat, bars etc.)

I've got a friend who is going to "try" bicycle commuting, and see if it's comfortable for him, but he refuses to adjust the seat to a place where it will be comfortable while riding, because he wants to be able to put both feet flat on the ground, from the seat.

I think a decision like this will quickly end his riding decision, as, at least for me, that type of position makes riding a lot harder.

Thoughts?

Suggestions?

Thanks.

-- James

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.


Explain as best you can, and if he won't do it, then to bad for him.

I once had a friend like that. One day when he wasn't looking I raised his seat a couple of inches. He never noticed and kept on riding.

I agree bad fit can make riding nigh unbearable. At one point in, I believe HS, I was borrowing my dad's bike because mine wasn't working. My dad is about 5'10" I'm about 6'2". I adjusted his seat as high as I could but the smaller frame just didn't let it go high enough. After riding several blocks my legs were cramping in a major way and it was all I could do to keep riding.

I say if you can't convince him now, let him ride once or twice like that and when he starts complaining about knee pain or whatever ends up hurting, refer him to a site talking about proper fit and the complications caused by poor fit, for instance: https://sportsmedicine.about.com/cs/sport/a/bikefit.htm mentions how poor fit can cause pain on the legs and joints.

I've tried many times to suggest to riders proper position. Not fine tune things, but like you said to a newb that wants the seat low enough to have both feet on the groaund from the saddle.

Pretty much, I've just given up. Seems useless like trying to explain that clipless pedals are safer than toe straps.

They have bikes with the seat set back and low so you can put your feet down. I guess that's important for some folks, but I'd imagine such a set up would make it impossible to sprint or climb.

That's not a rational dynamic going on between you two. Your friend is an alpha among you two or your pack of friends. He refuses to obey you because that diminishes his alpha status.


That's more of a proper human interaction dynamic right there. It's subconscious.


There is nothing you could do to convince your friend at this time. He took a note of your knowledge and he'll use it when needed. But, the more you push him, the further away he'll push you, that's just the way people interact.


For future reference, key word above is "obey". You don't want to command your friends or any one else. Simply stating facts and preserving both of your egos is so much more efficient for getting things done.





Why is he doing that? So that you go nuts about it. In the end he's the boss, and you're a follower.

djSlvt,

While I am quite frankly not sure whether I should be astounded at your insight given the amazingly small amount of info you have to work on or to say that you were just guessing (some combination) I am curious why, given your obvious interest in the human dynamic you would word your reply thusly given the initial reaction a beta in this situation would most likely have on its initial reading?

-- James

He needs a crank forward bike or a LWB recumbent. He can flat foot it on both. It does have advantages. I can step off my 'bent while its moving without injury. bk

Many new cyclists, whether they are age six or age sixty, want to have the ability to put both feet flat on the ground. There are a variety of bikes designed for exactly this sort of rider. Check the front inside cover of "Bicycling", as they often have an ad for these bikes.

When I've helped kids learn to ride, I've started them out with the saddle low enough that they can put their feet flat. When they get relaxed on the bike, I raise the saddle a half inch a week. After a few weeks, the saddle is at the correct height, and the kids never notice that the saddle has been raised.

I think we have the same friend. A guy at my workplace is giving commuting a chance and also recently did a 25K charity ride for me. He has an older 10 speed with the seat adjusted at least 4" too low. He's already complaining about sore knees. Go figure. I tried to suggest that he raise the seat a bit so that he only has a slight knee bend in the down stroke of the pedal however his ego won't allow for suggestions. Perhaps his inevitable physiotherapist will have more luck convincing him of proper bike fit.

I'll have to give that a try.

I've got one of these, a RANS Fusion. Most people who try it like it, but they tend to gag on the $1K price tag (-I also have a LWB, but that's another story-).
----
My heart always sinks a bit when someone who professes to be authoritative tries to imply that the rider must change to accomodate the bicycle. It's lousy salesmanship and doesn't help to encourage bicycling in general. Upright bikes are necessary for a few things and possibly best for a few more things but aren't the end-all solution for everyone--expecially people primarily concerned with riding comfort.

US consumers have already shown they're smarter than that: they have left road bikes for MTB's, MTB's for hybrids, and are now leaving hybrids for comfort bikes. They are voting more and more against the classic hunched-over road-riding position.

If one had known of a wide variety of bicycles of ALL types, one could have suggested something that offers a flat-foot riding position..... like a RANS crank-forward bike (Fusion, Cruz, Dynamik and Zenetic), a Lightfoot Surefoot, a Day6Bicycles, or even a recumbent like an Actionbent MantaRay, Sun EZ-1 or Cycle Genius Starling.
~