Leonard1818

Hello! First post, but been lurking for a bit.

Over the last 3 days I went up to my local bike shop to test ride and buy a bike. Being a total noob to bikes, I was at the mercy of their opinion and advice. I rode a Trek DS 2 or 3 but didn't love the front shocks. I then rode a Verve but wasn't too keen on the wider tires or the more upright riding position.

I ended up with a Trek FX 4 Sport based on how it felt (beautiful bike) but now I'm wondering if I bought one too small. They sized me on the Dual Sport and told me flat out that I was right in between the 17.5 and 20" and could go either way (a large gap in my opinion). The 20" I could straddle but could hardly lift off of the ground. The 17.5" I could lift a couple of inches. When I place my elbow at the seat and extend it toward the handlebars, I'm only about .5" off of touching them.

I'm 5'9"ish. According to the Trek website this *is* right there between the sizes on their chart.

Now I'm wondering if I should have ridden a 20" just to test it out and/or if they were just trying to offload the last 17.5" FX they had.

I don't know their return/exchange policy so I may be hosed. But I bought this bike to keep and ride for a long time (hence spending the $$ on it).

What do you more tenured riders think?

Thanks in advance.

Skipjacks

Go test ride the 20" and see. If it feels better/more comfortable/more efficient then the larger bike is the right size.

If it's a relatively new bike the shop is likely to work with you. They may charge you a little to do the exchange if they can't sell the 17" bike as 'new'.

But they may be willing to buy the 17" back for 90% of what you paid and then resell is as 'almost new' for 95% of retail, then sell you a new 20" for normal retail. Or something like that.

Leonard1818

I appreciate your input. I may go up and just talk to them about it. Problem is, I had them install stuff like a messenger-tray thing on the back and bottle holder so I think they'd be more reluctant to swap all that stuff over and return a bike... Plus, they don't even have a 20" FX S 4 in stock to test ride.

I've read that if you're in between it's usually better to go smaller because you can adjust for a bit bigger but you can't adjust a bigger bike to be smaller. That somewhat makes sense and is maybe why they went the direction they went with it.

raqball

If the bike shop is reputable and the staff is knowledgeable then I doubt they's steer you wrong just to make a sale. There are some bike shops out there that will, but I choose to believe they are in the minority.

Chances are they've sized you up to the proper bike. How do you feel when riding it?

Leonard1818

They were really nice and helpful. Then again, they're the only shop in town. There are 2 other shops in neighboring towns -- both under the same owner! Ha!

I tend to agree though, I hope they wouldn't put me on something that was wrong for me just to make the sale. Having 2 other shops, it would probably be easy for them to get the right size if they thought that was an issue.

To answer your question honestly, I don't know exactly how it feels riding it...I haven't put more than 10 miles on it yet. I mean, it's far better than the crappy walmart whatever bike my wife bought me at a garage sale that was certainly too small. It's more controlled than the 23" Raleigh C30 that my father-in-law gave me to try out.

I just took it out for some miles and my upper back hurts like heck but that's probably b/c I was hit by a dump truck 10 years ago and it does like to flare up. I'm using muscles I don't typically use, surely.

I just re-measured myself and I'm a solid 5' 9" without shoes -- maybe even a hair less. I also looked at my pants and for what that's worth, I wear a 30" inseam.

Thanks for weighing in!

raqball

When you purchased it, did they do a fit? Should have entailed raising or lowering the seat, moving the seat forward or back, checking leg positions and adjusting the handle bar position / angle.

If they did all that then I assume you are indeed on a properly sized and fitted bike. But you are correct that in your instance where you are in between sizes, it's best to go with the smaller frame.

Leonard1818

yes, they did fit me on the first bike I rode (the dual sport) by adjusting the seat, measuring me for the handlebars (but those didn't seem to need adjustment), and having me straddle the bike and lift it. They held it steady while I pedaled backwards to watch me (which I think is for seat adjustment purposes), etc...

Once they did that stuff, that's when they said 17.5 and we didn't even look at 20" from there on out so I was never really sized on a 20".

Looking around the forums, it looks like a lot of people that are 5' 8", 5' 9", and even up to 5' 9.5" w/30" inseam are on a 17.5" FX bike. Some folks 5' 10" seem to prefer a 20" but again, I didn't even ride one of those to find out how it felt. Didn't even know to ask once they said 17.5, it was gospel (being a n00b).

raqball

I'd say you have the correctly sized bike but what I say is meaningless as you'd need some saddle time to see how it feels to you. A larger bike will also have different geometry (I assume without looking at the FX sizing) which could put you at a further reach to the bars and cause incorrect riding position, arm fatigue, numbness ect.

HerrKaLeun

Guideline if you have longer than average legs and arms, to go larger. If you want to sit more upright, go smaller. but it all depends.... that is one advantage of LBS, you can test ride and you did.

gilpi

Not being able to lift the bike between your crotch is generally (but not necessarily) an indication that it's a bit too big for you.
Can you post a picture of the bike with you sitting on it?

speshelite

As a more experienced rider and shopper I would never limit myself to a single brand. I've test ridden a number of trek road and off road bikes over the years, but never found one which felt right (at least not recently), even if sizing was approximately accurate.

Call the shop and see if an accommodation can't be made, such as a return with a "restocking fee" if the bike can be sold as new. I'm not a huge fan of lbs's but I admit I would be annoyed as a shop owner or employee if a buyer attempted a return in your case.

It's in your interest to call them and have an honest polite conversation about your concerns regarding sizing. Who knows what sizes they have now though, or how long you might have to wait until the 18's arrive.

Again, I tend to side with the consumer but IMO you failed the "due diligence test" by not trying different sizes and brands in this case. It might not be a pleasant call to make or conversation to have, but it's in your interest to do so.

At worst, you could sell it on craigslist as a literally new bike at a small loss. But you might not have to. Call the shop first or drop by and talk to them.

I would certainly be nonplussed to be hearing your type of "complaint" if I worked at the shop (since it's not a complaint about the shop but begging for an accommodation since you failed to perform due diligence) but they might be cool with it.

timgriffin2

I have a Trek 7.2 FX with a 17.5" frame - I'm 5'8" with a 30" inseam so fairly close in size to you I'd say. I feel that the 17.5" is as large as I'd want to go - and sometimes it feels a little large to me even.

Leonard1818

I suppose I did not do a good job in my initial post of conveying my novice level and upfront admittance to this during my first (second, and third) contact with the LBS. I absolutely inquired about other brands. They seem to be a Trek and Cannondale shop. As soon as I asked about another brand or "Do you carry other brands?" I was told Trek, Trek, Trek.... was what I want. ...and for all I know, it is. I was even offered an anecdotal story about how he used to sell some other brand and Trek was the main competition but now he's selling a superior bike and such.

I'd argue that when you walk in as a total novice -- ignorant to it all, in a realm you don't know anything about, there's little "due dilligance"... it's one of those "you don't know what you don't know" kind of things. I'm at their mercy to advise and size me. In fact, that's exactly what I asked for. To second guess their best judgement at the time would not only be insulting, but would be the opppsite of why I'm consulting with them to begin with.

Im only second guessing it here on these forums as a "second opinion" type of thing.

Speaking solely from a shopping perspective, it must be worth reiterating that they are the only bike shop in town. There is no other. The one in the next town over is owned by the same people (and staffed by the same guys). The next town after that is the same story. You have to go quite a ways to get outside of their market. And assuming I want to drive an hour to go look at bikes, I'll probably still end up at the LBS for service...

I see what you mean about not wanting to limit yourself to one brand (due to sizing options), but circumstances and total ignorance to the sport don't give me a lot of choice or even the knowledge of my options. How do I know I'll get better advice an hour away?

I'm sure my place of purchase would work with me no matter what I requested, however. We are a small town and I believe they hold those types of values. I want to think they would like to see their customers be happy and come back a lot.

As scolding as it was, I appreciate your input on the inquiry. I don't think I'll be selling my new bike on Craigslist just yet. I'm going to ride it and enjoy spending time with my family and being outside. If the opportunity arises to ride a larger bike without sounding offensive to the advice I sought of them, maybe I'll take a larger one out for a spin.

raqball

This is one of the rudest posts I've seen here on BF. You should be ashamed of yourself but I assume you are not. Instead of typing more I'll just click the report post button.

OP don't sweat people like this. You did fine for a 1st time buyer. We have all been there before.

AU Tiger

Good grief! That was a little harsh, don't you think?

Reading his last post would completely lay to rest much of what you accuse him of. Far from being a difficult customer, it sounds like he's doing his best to give the shop the benefit of the doubt and be respectful of their advice. He's here asking for advice; there's really no reason to berate him that way.

ModeratedUser17082018

Lots of people buy bikes and then wonder if they bought the right size or type. I say give it some time and enjoy it. You'll learn a lot and maybe enjoy a lot.

I too was between bike sizes and went with the smaller size. After some initial misgivings, I'm totally over it and l love my light, responsive bike.

When I'm out and in the zone, I completely forget all the doubts I had. Let us know when you get there .

gilpi

I still say post a picture of you sitting on the bike or riding it, I bet it is not too small

badger1

+1 (all).

Wanderer

I thought Trek had a 30 day return policy**********?

Wanderer

FAQ | Trek Bikes
https://www.trekbikes.com/faq/

Can I return an item under the Unconditional Bontrager Guarantee? .... Bikes can be returned within 30 days if in new and unused condition. When you pick up ...

MRT2

As much as bike shops are generally friendly places looking to help you, it is a rare bike salesman who will tell you what he has in stock doesn't fit you. Bike shops are under pressure from the bike companies to push one brand over another. This is especially true of shops that carry the big 4 which are Trek, Specialized, Giant, and Cannondale.

The good news is, you probably aren't far off. So you might be able to make it work. But don't believe for a second that going with a bike that is slightly too small is any better than a bike that is slightly too large. It isn't true. A too large bike will be hard to control and will stretch you out too much when you ride. A bike that is too small will leave you with scrunched up without enough room to fully extend your arms, back, and legs. While you can somewhat remedy this problem with a longer stem and seatpost, the results are not optimal. If a salesman told me I was in between sizes, and they didn't stock or have access to a bike that fit me perfectly, I would probably keep looking. It might be that the perfect size hybrid for you is an 18.5" or 19" frame, and if I were you, I would do a little research and find a model in that size, then find a bike shop that carries it. Even if that shop is 40 minutes away, it might be worth it.

Bike brands do compete on price and quality, but small differences in sizing can make a big difference. Trek sells some fine bicycles, and the FX line is as close to an industry benchmark as I know exists. But it isn't the only make around. In addition to the big 4, there are Kona, Raleigh, Jamis, Marin, Bianchi, Fuji, Fairdale, and Surly among many others. I understand the desire to jump in and it might be that Trek is, indeed the best for you, but without trying some other competing brands, it is hard to know for sure if the Trek fits you best. Do a little quick research into other models.

Finally, I will tell you that for years, based on recommendations of bike salesmen, I was riding a bike that was too small for me. I can tell you that I had an epiphany a number of years ago when after being told by bike salesman I needed a medium bike, in a hybrid 17.5" to 18", or about a 52 or 53 cm in a road bike, I walked into a small bike shop and the owner looked at me and my 18" bike, put me on a trainer, and told me my bike was too small for me. It was an eye opener, and I eventually bought a bike from this shop a full size bigger than what I thought I needed.

fietsbob

Standing over the bike, ahead of the saddle ... flat footed.

One hand on the saddle, one hand on the bars , lift the bike straight up underneath you ,,,

How high did you get, ? distance under the tires ..




...

Leonard1818

Wow -- thank you all! I had a reply pecked out on my phone to our angry friend (it wasn't bad or mean like they are) but then I was told by the forum that I could only post 5x in 24 hours and unfortunately, I wasted one or two of those on back-and-forth with that person.

Nonetheless, you all pretty well said exactly what I was thinking in reply. I can see that they are the exception to the community, not the norm. I'm very glad that's the case.

I'm sorry that I brought out the bad side of one of the members -- that surely wasn't my intention. I'm glad to hear everyone has "been there" (there = being a newbie) and I'm glad they did not derail the discussion too badly.

I noticed again today that about 6-7 miles into my short ~12-14 mile ride, my upper back started hurting HORRIBLY between my shoulder blades. I had the same problem when I rode yesterday (and to a lesser extent the day before) but thought I'd give it another shot before I mentioned it or took action over it. It calmed down overnight last night and the night before and felt OK in the mornings. However, again today I literally had to turn around and head home because it was so uncomfortable in such a short distance.

I went back to my local shop and talked to one of the guys that was there as I was buying the bike. I explained that I've not put a ton of miles on the bike but that my upper back is in really bad shape after just ~7 miles of riding. I'm 33, ~5'9"-5'10", 185lbs. I'm a bit on the heavy side but I have been exercising (rollerblading) daily (weather permitting) for the last 4 months -- enough to lose 30 lbs, so I don't think I'm in *horrible* shape.

He was really nice. Without being prompted, he admitted he wasn't there the particular day when they determined what size I should get and wasn't the one who sized me which led me to believe he felt it could be a sizing issue. To be frank, I don't remember who determined the size because I worked with 3 different people. I'm positive that they told me 17.5" because I remember questioning it directly. I also rode 3 different bikes that were gotten down and given to me by someone at the store and they were all the same size (17.5"). However, I'd start with one person, but then they'd have to go answer a question on the phone or something and then another would come up to help. They were all involved -- sometimes 2 people standing there at once, but I did not work with just one person through the whole thing. Perhaps that's part of the problem. I did suggest initially that I make an appointment with a sales person but they told me that wasn't necessary (it is for service).

Nonetheless, the person I spoke to today offered to let me borrow a 19" FX 2 for the weekend to see if that felt better since that's all they have in stock. Alternately, he called one of the other stores in one of the cities over and is going to have a 20" FX S 4 brought down and I can go get it Tuesday and ride it on my paved rail trail that day and see if it feels better.

As of now, I feel good about my local shop. I don't think there was necessarily any intentional misguidance. Based on the level of effort and assistance they are promising today -- I feel as if they want me to be on a bike that is the right size and is comfortable for me. I think they understand my needs/wants and my problem.

Based on my interaction with them today, I'm hopeful that we'll get there. I think the person I worked with today will be the one person to see me through the rest of my interactions which should help far more than bouncing around to a few different people.

I'll be sure to keep you posted (but no more than 5 times in 24 hours ).




(I'll offer this anecdotal story as well: What somewhat prompted me to finally get up and go look for a bike in the first place is that my father-in-law gave me his old bike recently. It's an early 2000's Raleigh C30 "Hybrid" style bike. The only problem is it's a 23" bike (he's about 3-4" taller than me). Even though it was hard to get on, I was so excited to have a bike to ride on the (rail) trail I took it out a couple of times. When I had to stop at road crossings, it was very evident (almost painfully so) that it was too big. My anatomy told me so -- if you know what I'm saying. I can't raise the bike but 1/4" off of the ground when straddling the bar -- and that's lifting up things a bit putting pressure on "the boys". BUT I rode it ~10-12 miles x 2 trips and never had an iota of pain or discomfort while on the bike or afterward. That bike is one of the reasons I was OK with the immediate suggestion of a Hybrid style bike when I went in to get something that fit me better. I figured it would be similar to that one but more forgiving between the legs.

I offer this story up as my reasoning for questioning my bike size and as to why I feel the size may be off.)

raqball

The back pain is probably due to a bad riding posture or just being out of cycling shape. Could fit have something to do with it? Sure.

I think you are on the right track and it sounds like you have a good LBS that want to make sure you are happy and on the properly sized bike. Bike fitting is hard as everyone is different. In my case I am 6' 1" with a 33" inseam and weight about 160lbs. I have long legs but shorter arms in proportion. When I purchased my BMC, my height and legs probably needed an XL but the rest of me said I needed a Large. We went with the large and it's spot on after fitting and adjustments.

Leonard1818

Thanks!

...and I asked him today (more than once) "Am I doing something wrong?" and offered to get my bike and show him how I ride it and how it fits me but he didn't seem interested or concerned that it was something I could be doing. He just said that he sometimes gets that after pretty long rides because he's tense. I would be OK with that comparison if a) it took more than 7 miles for me to start hurting and b) if that huge 23" bike had caused me similar pain. I'd be more inclined to think it's me or my style or posture.

I took the 19" FX 2 out for a quick spin (my family was with me so I didn't have a ton of time) and my observation was that if I balled my hands up and rested my fists/knuckles on the grips, just that slight change in angle seemed to make a world of difference. I told him that when I returned and he said a bigger bike (the 20" FX) will change the riding geometry to be more like that. I'm not sure -- I guess I'll see.

We did talk a bit more about the Dual Sport and the Verve but the Dual sport has a similar riding position to the FX and he said the Verve 3 will have an entirely different geometry as it's called a "Comfort" bike. Admittedly I chuckled at that because my main complaint is DISCOMFORT on short rides but we didn't discuss it much further at this point. If the 20" FX still causes me back pain and discomfort in 10 miles of riding, I may ask directly to test a Verve again. I did ride one briefly and it was just "fine", but the gearing seemed a bit different than the FX, it was noticeably heavier with a wider tire and it didn't feel as fast. However with the way I feel now, I'll take anything that I can go more than 10 miles on in comfort.

We will see how it goes!