Roody

Actually, I heard that when George W. Bush was toying with the idea of sending people to Mars, NASA tried to figure out how they would go about rebooting manned space flight. It turned out that they can't do it because the plans and knowledge have been lost already. They even hired some archaeologists to find the old schematics and drawings, but were unsuccessful. Going to the moon--let alone Mars--is evidently no longer an option for humanity.

sauerwald

I'm not so sure that I disagree - if we had no drivers license requirement, but capital punishment for offenses like drunk driving or exceeding the speed limit, I think that we would be far better off than we are now, with minimal training or competence requirements for a license, and even less enforcement of the law.

Artkansas 

Capital punishment for exceeding the speed limit? The courts would be in gridlock almost as quickly as the traffic.

Artkansas 

Nah, we'll just have to learn again and a lot of people are working on it. We're still doing baby steps and we have to expect to fall down and get up a few times. It's sad that we've lost the Saturn 5, but rockets like SpaceShip One show that more elegant solutions are possible.

gerv 

I have developed a bicycle with an ion-propulsion engine. It starts off slow, but gets up to speed after a month or so. I believe that could get us to Mars and beyond.

Roody

Sign me up!

coldfeet

We need a space elevator, the technology is almost here.

Nightshade

Licensing doesn't solve all the problems of bad drivers on our roads/highways.

Morons are morons and not much can change that!!!

Artkansas 

Sounds like how I ride.

Leisesturm

The Saturn V at lift-off was generating the equivalent of the entire U.S. energy grid. Just to lift 3 men and a moon buggy to low Earth orbit. Space elevators start to look mighty interesting when you know how much energy it takes to put payloads in orbit... and beyond. We are hardly "almost there", however.

I also disagree with Hawking and I am really sorry that someone of his stature has set the movement towards "First Contact" back a bit by voicing primitive fears of self-preservation. I am confident that any alien species that has developed to where they can surmount interstellar distances will also have overcome the need for conquest. It's hardly like we have achieved some utopia on Earth that needs protecting. Being enslaved by aliens that could clean up our air/water/soil and cure congenital and age acquired human maladies would be a 'sacrifice' many would be willing to make.

Besides, what better way to unite humanity and field test us for the next level of existence than the overthrow of an occupying alien army. Independence Day for real.

H

musikguy

What Hawking said was that given enough time, say millions of years or so, the aliens would have evolved to the point that their prime directive would be to gather as many resources as possible to sustain the life of their species. It would be like us running over an ant bed to get the grass cut. Wouldn't matter one bit to them.

I have read recently that NASA is kicking around the idea of 'convincing' people to pioneer to Mars. One way ticket. Apparently it's cheaper and easier to send people one way. They would set up camps and start a new Martian life.

Sounds interesting enough, but on the other hand, the jokes start writing themselves.

BWWpat

You guys made me think of this ^

Leisesturm

Hawking should know better. A sufficiently advanced species will not spread without limit across galaxies. Likely they would terraform local planets and/or construct artificial ones within their own solar system. The only reason for going outside their solar system would be exploration, maybe colonization... maybe. Survival of their species, no.

I imagine there are plenty of people who would sign up without any 'convincing' to go on a one way mission to Mars. NASA may need to revisit their "no sex aboard NASA spacecraft" policy though. Spacefaring people are not usually passive, low testosterone, sub-normal sex drive individuals.

H

Nightshade

This guy ain't talking about cyclist, mate. If anything I'd bet that this guy would ban bicycles from public roads.

Roody

The guy is the biggest kook in government. He not only wants to stop governments from issuing driver licenses, he wants government to quit building roads. He would also get rid of all public schools and outlaw cash, credit cards and checks.

The scariest thing is that the people of Georgia not only let him out of the mental hospital, they vote for him to a representative.

Artkansas 

That's a nice thought. But as they say in Australia, assumptions are the mother of all f**kups. You know how the Americas went downhill after 1492.

But when a big interstellar craft pulls into orbit between Earth and Mars, how you gonna react?

Maybe I should have said small interstellar craft. My space activist friends posit that a craft about 3" in length is probably the ideal balance of mass and roominess for interstellar travel. Of course the crew must shrink, but wouldn't scaling down to that size be a way to go green?

If there are no cars aboard, can interstellar ships be considered to be car-free living?

AdamDZ

Not necessarily. We don't know what kind of space travel technology they might have and how they mastered the physics of the space, what their philosophy and needs are, and their physiology (assuming the have one), lifespan, etc. It may be easier and quicker for them and require less resources to send a ship with half a million beings to another system 1000 light years away than building a whole new planet or terraform another. Terraforming requires a planet of similar mass so the gravity is suitable for the species, there may not be any available in their own system. Also, what if their star is unstable? They may have to get out of their system. They don't have to go to other galaxies though. One galaxy has millions of solar systems.

No one on Earth can tell for sure what "sufficiently advanced species" would do simply because we don't know and never will.

BTW: amazing how a forum thread can evolve

musikguy

You sure about that? What if they grow beyond what their local planets will hold? What if they grow beyond what their solar system will hold? After all, we're talking about millions of years of population growth.
They still wouldn't use other planets resources? No?

Artkansas 

Not to mention the fact that they will be cognizant that their sun cannot last forever.

cooker

So by that logic Franklin should allow pedestrians, equestrians and cyclists to use the freeways. Hopefully some critical mass riders in his state will bike the interstate carrying banners in support of his re-election.

musikguy

Care to rethink your position on this one?

JayButros

...wow, this thread has gone off a bit since I was last here. Space? First contact? Mars colonies?

Yellowbeard

You guys should read some Stanislaw Lem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiasco_%28novel%29

Artkansas 

Boy, I'd forgotten about him. "Chain of Chance" was required reading in one college class.

InkMeister

This is a good topic. It gets at one of the many serious problems with a high tech/high energy society; technology and power are at odds with equality and freedom. Ivan Illich was saying this back in the 70's in great books such as Energy and Equity, Tools for Conviviality, and Deschooling Society (all worth reading, all can be had free online).

Cars are a case in point; it's understandable that the politician under discussion would desire equality, but treating driving as a fundamental right is a very dangerous idea, as the technology of car culture requires discipline, rules, regulations, structure, heirarchy... etc.

I look at how people drive, like its a form of personal expression... and how dangerous and obnoxious it is! But similar behavior on foot (or to a lesser extent, on bicycle) is hardly problematic, if at all.

Also, the expense, socially, economically, and politically, of guaranteeing everyone the right to drive is just unimagineable. Of course, I suspect this particular politician has no intention of providing universal access to cars!

Nick