dual650c

Warning... grab a cold one, sit down in a comfy chair, loosen your belt, and don't blame me if you kill yourself laughing at this. ba dum bum!!!

Been off the bike for a while... general health issues (including some since resolved joint issues) as well as other interests interfering with ride time.

However, I've been in contact with a friend overseas who has invited me to "ride an epic brevet" with him about 8-9 months from now. He's running the event so I'm definitely "in" if I commit to it.

Here's the question... as if you couldn't see it coming...
Just how ridiculous is it to even consider attempting a 1200km brevet with minimal riding done last year (under 1000km) (overseas no less and "ah no speaka de local lingo" at all)? Baggage drops will be minimal, hotel accommodations/quality just above that, and drinking the local water, well, Montezuma's Revenge is minor compared to what happened to me the last time I was there....

Basically, I am guaranteed a spot without pre-qualifying via an ACP Super Randonneur Series or even just a 1000km. My longest "brevet-like/semi-comtinuous" ride ever has been a solo 450km on semi-rolling terrain and it took me a week to recover but that was over 4 years ago. I've just turned 61 if that figures into your response calculus.

My bike's in better shape than I am (it's a short wheel-base recumbent, btw). I could commit to a 4 or 5 day a week training schedule if I decide to do this... and, obviously, the sooner I decide commit or pass this one up the better.

So, thoughts?

Machka 

Many years ago, I rode a Super Randonneur series, and a whole bunch of other long distances, between April and August.

Then in November, I burnt my left foot to the bone. Couldn't even move for 5 weeks. Just standing up caused agonising pain. Upper body strength work was out of the question too.

Mid-December I started hobbling around a little but not much.

January, I worked on the walking ... even went to physio to learn how to walk properly again.

Late-January, I started riding my stationary bike with a soft slipper on my burnt foot. At first, all I could manage was about 5 min.

Mid-February, I stuffed my still-bandaged foot into a cycling shoe and went out for a short ride.


.
.
.

July, I rode my first 1200 km randonnee ... the Rocky Mountain 1200.


Now I was in my early 30s, and had been quite fit before the accident, but I was basically starting from scratch 6 months earlier.

So ... yes, it's possible.

I would, however, strongly encourage you to ride a 600 km randonnee before you go ... even just a month or so before you go.

In fact, I'd encourage you to ride a whole Super Randonneur series before you go. I know that some events don't require the series as a qualifier, but nevertheless, it is a good idea to ride it anyway 1) to help you get in shape; 2) to give you some idea of what you're getting into; 3) to help you sort out nutrition and hydration on the longer rides; 4) to give you some experience with night riding, fatigue management, etc.


I have ridden four 1200Ks and a 1000K, but I've been out of the really long distances for a while. Last year, we attempted a Super Randonneur series and did the 200K, 300K, 400K and about 400 km of the 600K. Illness and still being slightly out of shape took it's toll on my on that 600K. Those are tough rides for me.

This year, I would like to ride a 1000K and have my eye on one ... but ... we'll see. First I want to ride that SR series. Then I'll decide if I'm ready for more.

Carbonfiberboy 

Start riding today and worry about committing later. Definitely plan on riding a SR series.

StephenH

Check elevation profile and try to make sure you're riding similar terrain in your training.
I've ridden one 1200k. I had issues come up that never came up on 600k's, so it is a different animal.
Riding 600k's and similar will help you get used to getting up the next morning and riding when you're already tired and/or didn't get enough sleep.
Several times, we've ridden 600k's on weekends, then rode another 200k or 300k the next day, good training there.

dual650c

Good responses all. Thanks.
Expected terrain - 300 miles of rolling hills with a single long climb, the rest is nothing significant.
Local training terrain - pretty much bone flat.... shrug. whaddya gonna do? Just ride and hope for the best, I guess.

Riding a full SR series as part of training? - will/would have to leave the state to get in an official 600km.
I just live in the wrong place. Again, whaddya gonna do? It is what it is (I hate that phrase but sometimes it's appropriate.)

sort out nutrition and hydration on the longer rides - I'm actually more concerned/worried about what will be available to eat, period, on the ride. My stomach's neither particularly sensitive nor ironclad, but I certainly won't be acclimated to the local cuisine during the event and roadside restaurants ... well, who knows what will actually be available? As I said, bag drops will be spotty/minimal from what my friend has said (subject to change however) so restocking will be carry all food with me (ala touring rides) or stop at a roadside establishment (and who knows what that means over there?). I'm just not knowledgeable about the area and my friend hasn't responded concerning such details yet. We'll see.

Lastly, as far as exerting myself and then "repeating it" the next day, sorta been there done that in non-cycling endurance efforts when I was younger (ex., 130 mile "march with full military backpack" over 4 days, and a similar event - 200 miles over 4 days, did a 200 cross-country ski event over multiple days, etc.). It's all in the mind, well, mostly, unless an absolutely event-ending physical disability occurs.

unterhausen

with dedication, you have enough time to train. It does sound like your long distance cycling experience may be a little lacking, hard to tell from here. If I were doing it, I definitely would want to ride a series. You don't say where you are or how far you would have to travel to do that, most of us do have to travel some to complete a series.

I am not sure what to say about eating. I have adopted a liquid diet, but that might not help you if the water is of questionable quality

I have never done a 1200k without being in pretty good condition, at least for me. Flat can mean winds, so there is that to consider.

Steamer

Consider doing a couple extra long permanents (300K or 400K), or your own informal 600K.

Machka 

OK ... where are you at right now with distance? What distance can you comfortably ride? Can you hop on the bicycle and ride how many km right now and feel good enough to do the yard work after?

It is kind of hard to give advice without knowing where you're starting.

pdlamb

Sounds like you might want to add a water purifier to your load. You're going to have to drink!

dual650c

Where am I right now cycling/physical fitness wise? As I said, I've been mostly off the bike for a while (20-30 mile rides at most once or twice a month over the last year/year and a half). I know I can do 2 back-to-back days of metric centuries in under 5 hours with little residual discomfort - but that is such a short distance, it's probably all but meaningless wrt 1200km training. So, I believe that I could probably knock out a 200km in 9-10 hours but would need a couple days recovery to be without any soreness.

Water purifier? Why didn't I think of that!?!?!? Great idea. Also looked at some youtube videos of "overseas" long distance brevets and noted people drinking bottled water/carbonated beverages/beer (not my preference, but it could work, I guess). So, there are at least three definite possibilities to consider that I hadn't thought of.

I could ride "official" 200-400km brevets within the local RUSA area (less than an hour's drive) but would need to drive at least 5 hours to "go further" officially brevet-wise. Realistically, there are relatively low-traffic, out-and-back routes for 100-400kms that are rideable right from my door, so I don't need official events to train for those distances.

The mostly likely venues for "official" 600km brevets for me would be either Dallas or Houston areas but I think they're scheduled too early for me ramping up from basically nothing/where I currently am. I could be wrong about that. I was kinda thinking to hit a single 600km ride about 6 months from now, an 800km ride 7 months on and then just "making the jump". Between the 800 and the 1200 rides, I was thinking of "maintenance rides" of 200 or 300... But, that's a rough rough rough "plan" (really just sticking numbers into a spreadsheet and looking at a calendar without any clue of whether or not I can make particular distance goals on that "schedule" - and including backing off distance-riding > 200km for 2-3 weeks prior to the 1200 event).

I could probably put a 600km solo training route together myself using MapMyRide or something similar without too much trouble - actually, writing that just brought a general idea for such a route to mind.

This is still mostly in the thinking out loud stage still, but now I am feeling more like it's possible than not.

Additional comments, thoughts, suggestions definitely welcome and appreciated.

StephenH

So what you need to do is leave your state and go ride the heck out of somewhere else every once in a while. Find a 600k in some more rugged country, fly out and do it.


There's no law that says you can't make up your own 600k perm and ride it several times, for that matter (work in all the hills you can find, even if you have to drive a couple of hours to get to it.) (And consider making it two perms 350k/250k instead of one long perm). And riding into a headwind for a hundred miles will toughen you up a little even if it's flat. If you have any 24 hour races prior to the big event, check into them as well.

unterhausen

I think back to back 200k's are probably a pretty good simulation of a 1200k. Most people do a 1200k as 400k, 300k, 300k, 200k

dual650c

Must be nice to have enough money to just do that.

Machka 

OK, so you're starting from the beginning.

You say you know you can do 2 back-to-back days of metric centuries in under 5 hours, but you haven't done that in at least a year and a half so you don't know what you can do. So that's where you need to begin.

This weekend go out and do a 75 km ride and a 50 km ride.

Next weekend do a 100 km and a 50 km.

The following weekend go back to the 75 km and 50 km rides.

The next weekend do your back-to-back 100 km rides.

The weekend after that go back to the 75 km and 50 km rides.

And the week after, do a 200 km.


During the week, in between those rides:
-- take 1-2 days off to rest ... go for a walk, do yoga, go canoeing or something
-- do a recovery/easy ride on 1 day
-- work on intervals and/or hill-repeats on 1-2 days to build up speed and strength



That will give you a good idea of where you are right now while providing you with something of a base to work from.

Rowan

Again, no mention has been made of bike fit. 450km in a day a while ago is different from 1200km in eight months' time.

How confident are you that the bike you have or plan to use is up to the task, fit-wise. Undoubtedly, you will find out as you ride through an SR series. You don't identify the 1200 being referred to, but very rarely are 1200s open to all-comers who haven't completed an SR series prior, and perhaps even a 1000 thrown in as well.

It might be handy to know where the 1200 is being held, and specifically whether it is an officially registered LRM event.

Having said that... yes it is possible to do a 1200 in eight months' time from scratch. But you need to ride, and do lots of riding in the meantime.

pdlamb

It's fairly easy with a long weekend (assuming you have a functional car). Drive 8 hours, find a cheap motel or campground to spend the night, get up and ride a hilly 600k Saturday-Sunday, sleep over Sunday night, and drive home. Unless you're living in the Florida Keys, I can't think of a place in the U.S. where you couldn't do that with, for example, one extra day off over Memorial Day.

kingston 

While I'm sure it's possible, I don't think you'll be able do it. If long distance cycling was that enjoyable or important to you, you would have done more of it in the last 61 years. OTOH, if you follow something like Machka's training plan, you can probably pull it off. Good luck!

dual650c

Well, just came back from my first 100km in over 6 months. Speed was a bit up and down over a flat course - completed the route, a flat out and back, in just over 5 hours and I feel pretty good. Knees are a bit sore but that was expected. I'll probably go ride the same route tomorrow just to see how the knees hold up and then take 2 days off (SuperBowl weekend, ya know.). If things go well, I might try a 150km on Wednesday.

My bike is a Bacchetta Corsa dual 650c with a carbon seat. The fit was worked out over 20km between 2and3 years ago and it's still fine. I did make a minor adjustment to the seat recline angle at the turn-around point, actually laying it back slightly more than previously for aerodynamic steamlining purposes. Shrug... It works and is what I'll be riding for the foreseeable future. My only "regret" for the trip might be that it's not using dual 26 inch wheels which are more available overseas and wider/more comfortable than what I can fine in 650c.

As far as "going out of state", let me clarify. I don't see any benefit to the costs involved at this point whether it's just gas costs, an overnight campground or even the brevet entry fee - however "minimal" those might be in total. I might consider it if/when I get to a distance at or exceeding 400km and want to check out my fitness and/or performance over rolling hills. But it definitely won't be a regular thing, not even once a month.

The costs of the 1200 event itself will be challenging enough for me on a very small, fixed, retirement income (flights, passport[~$100 right there!], hotel, ground/rail transportation, food etc. probably totaling in the $1500-$2000 range - oh and "overseas" medical/medical evacuation back to the US insurance!!! Had to use that once while on a ski trip the the Alps decades ago). But it IS a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity... so I may/will have to scrimp to actually participate but I can't waste any money beforehand training-wise.

Still considering the pros and cons... I hope the physical stuff is less of an issue than I originally feared.

Chris Pringle

Where in the world is this brevet that you keep talking about?

A 1,200 Km brevet/randonnée is totally doable in 8 months but it will involve training at least 4 times per week combining distance days, hard intensity days (e.g., big hills) and interval days. I totally agree with the suggestion of doing at least a 600 Km brevet near you in the late spring and no later than 4 weeks before your big ride, even if the S.R. series is not required. You definitely want to learn from that experience before venturing into an overseas 1,200 Km brevet. Oh, and do not underestimate jet lag which can set you back tremendously even if you've trained really hard for months. Allow one day per hour change for your body to adjust and to get a couple of rides locally.

kingston 

My guess is Uzbekistan or India.

dual650c

It IS on the EurAsian continent but, other than that, I'm not going to say. My friend is the organizer and I'm being offered a "special exemption" to participate without the normally required qualifications. I'd rather not stir anything up for him from other (potential) riders/participants. Let's let it go at that.

Edited to change "given" to "offered".

Machka 

Gotta be one of these: https://www.randonneursmondiaux.org/3...ndar_2017.html


There's nothing secret in the Randonneuring world.

Machka 

OK, if your knees are bothering you after the 100 km ride, I'd suggest just doing 50 km today. Don't over do it or you could incur an injury which will take you out of the game entirely.

I would also double check the fit of your bicycle. And are you a masher? What's your cadence?

I would also delay your 150 km ride for another week or two.

You've got some time ... build up gradually.

dual650c

Noted your and others' advice... All appreciated and taken into account according to my own pigheadedness and experience(s). As noted above, I've got a pretty spot on bike fit after 20km ridden 2-3 years ago. Cadence... well, we're starting back at scratch. Today's cadence was inconsistent. When I was riding 3-5 times a week, I was in the 90-95rpm range.

Here's my draft plan with a "dropdead decision date" to notify my friend that I will likely participate of Feb 28th...
Currently incorporating all/only local(out my door) rides but that's easily modifiable to change locale/terrain as I think it becomes appropriate and/or just plain desirable. I even came up with 2 "very long-distance" routes out my door - a 600km and an 800km.

I'm not relying on ANY official RUSA/ACP brevets as part of this training plan - none. My reasons for that are totally personal and not a reflection on anyone else or RUSA. I might participate in a couple, but I'm simply not planning on it. Otoh, I might get a wild hair up my butt and go ride an out of state RUSA brevet/permanent route (as someone suggested) unofficially to change things up/check my ability to handle rolling hills - but I won't pay $$ just for the privilege to do it officially.

Links to the "quick draft training plan" - 2 Excel files...identical except for formatting.
https://1drv.ms/f/s!AvC7p4tHbX40gYRQC6ZgknGT6aL2zw

Of course you're technically correct... So, go right ahead pointlessly trying to solve a mystery that isn't really a mystery if it makes you feel good. I haven't mentioned a specific date other than a vague period (8-9 months out) or even a general locale other than "on the EurAsian continent". So, be my guest.

Rowan

Well, I am sorry, but I am a stickler for the rules when it comes to this sort of thing. Be honest, or don't do it. Why should you get a free passage into an event just because you are mates with the organiser, when others have to work their butts off to get there?

Qualifying through SR series is one of the cornerstones of training for LD events like this, especially for anyone who hasn't been doing LD stuff for decades, or even a few years.

Not only that, but riding in SR events helps support the sport through financial contributions to peak bodies, as well as organisers who go to a damn lot of effort to assemble these events. For you to flip them off the way you apparently intend to, does not sit well with me.

Frankly, I've changed my mind. I don't think you will make the end of the 1200 within the time limit. I don't think you have the ticker to do the training sufficiently well enough, and well... even more importantly, I think you are on the road to Cheatersville.