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Help me Build a Wheelset

Old 09-02-20, 09:15 PM
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Cycle_Buhda
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Help me Build a Wheelset

Iím looking to build a wheelset over the winter. Any recommendations on a dynamo hub, light, rear hub and rims (rim brakes, running 700x38c tires). Undecided on budget but approaching this as an investment.
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Old 09-03-20, 03:06 PM
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Brakes, rim or disc?

Through axle or conventional hub?

If conventional, 130 or 135mm in back?

If I was building up a new wheel set, even if I was planning to use rim brakes, I would probably get disc hubs so could be used in the future on a disc bike.

I have a couple SP dynohubs and also have a Shimano. I prefer the SP over Shimano. I have no experience with Son hub.
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Old 09-04-20, 12:26 AM
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If you can afford it, get a SON hub. I usually use Hope hubs in the rear
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Old 09-06-20, 11:32 PM
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Velocity Dyad rims, SS Sapim double butted spokes, chromed brass nipples, SON front hub, rear hub; 130mm - Ultegra or 135mm Deore.
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Old 09-07-20, 09:55 AM
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I suggest at 12mm through axle disk hub with an adapter for quick release on a rim brake rim. Forward compatibility. I have this with an SP hub, Iím sure SON makes one as well.

I have both a SON and an SP dyno hubs. I canít tell the difference in riding and function. Time will tell about longevity.
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Old 09-11-20, 06:43 PM
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Astral Rims are quite nice and made in the US: Solstice are quite lightweight while Radiant would be more sturdy and a bit aero if you care about such things. https://astralcycling.com/collections/road-rims
Velocity Quill rims would also be a good choice.

You really can't go wrong with a Shimano hub for the rear. DT Swiss or White Industries hubs are also good choices.

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Old 09-12-20, 10:48 AM
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For the dynamo, Son is nicer, SP is cheaper. I have both, and as XXLHardrock mentioned above, they both work the same. I expect the son to last longer, but you never know. I don't agree with the recommendation to get a disk/though axle hub for a rim brake bike, but I already know from experience that I hate disk brakes on road bikes, so I won't ever need a hub like that. I also have shimano and sturmey archer dynamos, which are both fine for commuting, but neither would be my first choice for a long-distance bike.

For the rear hub, I like the shimano or campy cup and cone. VO Grand Cru is a nice, reasonably priced cartridge bearing hub.

Velocity rims mentioned above are a great recommendation. They have several models that would work with 38's. Alternatively, CR18 value is impossible to beat if you're looking to save some money. I have several wheelsets with mavic rims that have worked out great for me, but some people don't like them and they are in receivership right now, so maybe not the best choice at the moment.

I buy my lights, dynamos, spokes and mavic rims from Germany, either rosebikes.com, Bike24.com or bike-components.de depending on what else I'm getting in the order.

Despite having several bikes with dynamo lighting, I got a new long-distance bike last season and went with B&M AA battery lights because they're 100% as good as dynamo lights until I'm riding in the dark for more than 5 hours in a row, at which point I need some combination of lower power and more batteries, neither of which are that big of a deal. Then the 99% of the time that I'm riding when it's light out, it's super easy to swap wheelsets, and I don't have unnecessary lights on the bike.
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Old 09-12-20, 10:54 AM
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In addition to the axle and brake type questions, how much do you weigh? What is the maximum additional weight you'd carry on the bike besides yourself?

I have a set of Velocity Cliffhanger rims with a SON dyno hub up front and a Phil Wood in the rear. It's a very solid setup.
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Old 09-12-20, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Cycle_Buhda View Post
Iím looking to build a wheelset over the winter. Any recommendations on a dynamo hub, light, rear hub and rims (rim brakes, running 700x38c tires). Undecided on budget but approaching this as an investment.
I see a lot of people skipped over your "rim brake" specification. What frame would these wheels be going on, and is the ability to re-use these wheels on some future bike a part of your investment?

All of my current bikes are in the "C&V" (Classic and Vintage) category, and since I don't know what standards will dominate in the next 10-20 years, I figure any guesses at "future-proofing" would have a good chance of being wrong, anyway. So I just build my wheels to the bikes I have.

Are lightness or aerodynamics criteria for this build? I'm always happy to go down that rabbit hole.
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Old 09-20-20, 12:08 AM
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I have used both SP and Shimano dynamo hubs, 30,000+ km on either. Both are extremely reliable, but SP is nicer and (unlike SON, which I have no experience of) not much more expensive.
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Old 09-29-20, 02:25 AM
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I would suggest looking for centerlock disc brake hubs for a minor level of future proofing (and they can be used with the 6-bolt standard through an adapter) and you can get covers (Shimano or SON) to make them practically invisible. As others have mentioned SP or SON are the prime choices here though the higher end Shimanos are not bad either.
Rims depends on where you live but I have had good experiences with H+SON TB14's and Archetypes, though the latter not as a rim brake. They have both held up well in heavy-duty commuter use or rando bike that sees the occasional rocky singletrack. They are very pretty rims IMHO but definitely not the cheapest.
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Old 09-29-20, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by JaccoW View Post
I would suggest looking for centerlock disc brake hubs for a minor level of future proofing (and they can be used with the 6-bolt standard through an adapter) and you can get covers (Shimano or SON) to make them practically invisible. As others have mentioned SP or SON are the prime choices here though the higher end Shimanos are not bad either.
Shimano dyno hub bearings can be replaced without wheel disassembly.

SON bearings require disassembly, but are rated for 50,000 km and tend to reach it.

There were too many reports of Shutter Precision bearings failing in as little as 4000 miles for me to be comfortable buying one. E.g. Shutter Precision hub bearing replacement

I used a SON28 which is low drag, attractive, and offers good low sped output.

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Old 09-29-20, 03:59 PM
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If you were really worried about future-proofing a dynohub, the best choice would be 12mm TA disc with a QR adapter.
The SON is shockingly expensive though.

I'm seriously thinking about getting an Onyx for my next wheelset because they don't make any noise. I have Hope rear hubs now and sometimes they are too loud. Starting a gofundme so my recumbent riding friends can help me pay for it.

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Old 09-30-20, 01:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Drew Eckhardt View Post
Shimano dyno hub bearings can be replaced without wheel disassembly.
That's the theory at least, in practice I have only seen a handful of people attempt it. And you have to be very careful not to damage the connector wires. Then again, Shimano does often sell complete replacement internals.
When I looked at it in the past the general consensus was that it wasn't a reasonable pro.
SON bearings require disassembly, but are rated for 50,000 km and tend to reach it.

There were too many reports of Shutter Precision bearings failing in as little as 4000 miles for me to be comfortable buying one. E.g. Shutter Precision hub bearing replacement

I used a SON28 which is low drag, attractive, and offers good low sped output.
I have heard of the SP hubs failing. I have one on a fully wired bike that is producing some flickering light (audible flashes of more light than before, not darkness). B+M says it can't possibly be the light itself so they are pointing at the SP hub. I will have to rule out the wiring and the hub but luckily I have plenty of dynamo wheels.
If it does turn out to be the hub I might consider switching over to SON.
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Old 09-30-20, 07:17 AM
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For me, the difference in cost between an SP and a SON is not a lot if you consider how long the hub will last. I have never had any trouble with my SP hubs, but they aren't cheap enough to take a risk.

I would like to buy some shimano internals, I thought the hubs weren't considered serviceable by shimano. Is there actually a source for them?
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Old 09-30-20, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by unterhausen View Post
If you were really worried about future-proofing a dynohub, the best choice would be 12mm TA disc with a QR adapter.
The SON is shockingly expensive though.

I'm seriously thinking about getting an Onyx for my next wheelset because they don't make any noise. I have Hope rear hubs now and sometimes they are too loud. Starting a gofundme so my recumbent riding friends can help me pay for it.
Shimano hubs are silent too! Not as sexy as onyx of course!

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Old 09-30-20, 07:09 PM
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I'm too lazy to repack them periodically and I had a Shimano cassette body break in half and almost ruin my PBP. So I'm somewhat reluctant to use them
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Old 10-01-20, 05:09 AM
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I looked at a Shimano exploded diagram, it does look like one side has cup and cone bearings. I also watched a youtube video of someone taking a Shimano apart. Bottom line, I decided that if I tried to do anything on my Shimano dynohub, I would likely regret it. So as long as it keeps working, I am not touching it.

Most of my rear hubs are Shimano steel axle XT or Deore hubs with quarter inch ball bearings. Every few years I put a bit more new grease into the bearings and on one hub had to put a new freehub on it. But since the rear hubs are free of tiny little wires, I have much less fear of working on the rear than on a dynohub.
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Old 10-01-20, 05:41 AM
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Both sides of a shimano dynohub are cup and cone. It's just that you have to do some radical surgery to get the NDS off and most of us are reluctant to do that.
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Old 10-01-20, 07:02 PM
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Spokes: Sapim or DT swiss double butted spokes with brass nipples (aluminum are lighter but corrode and seize up too easily, not good for touring and self-supported endurance riding).

Rim: I have used Sun CR18 rims (700c box type profile) for their durability and value. For my next build I'm using a Pacenti Brevet rim (650b).

Hub: I have always built my own dynamo wheels typically on a Shimano hub. I like the model marketed as having "ultegra-quality bearings". For my next build I am going for lighter weight and have bought an SP hub, 28 holes for brevet riding. I will build a 2nd wheel with 32 spokes for light, but fully self-sufficient touring, (both on 650b x 42mm tires and I weigh 155lbs/ 70kg). If budget were no concern I would go with a SON.

Front Light: I have a Schmidt Edelux II light that is great. I like the low profile of the light and really good beam pattern on the road. Only thing I would have done differently is buy the inverted one for easier mounting underneath my front rack. Another great option is the B&M IQ-X (100 lux and a good beam pattern).

Rear Light: Just pick one you like from B&M that suits the mounting options on your bike build (seat post, fender, seat stay, or rear rack). Their lights are affordable, lightweight, and durable. One thing to consider is if you get one of the very small lights they offer without a built-in reflector, this technically isn't road-legal in Europe. I saw and heard of people at bike inspection at PBP being told they needed an additional light with a reflector. The person who inspected my bike didn't say anything to me about mine, but I also had a back up battery light for such a big ride anyway.

Finally, make sure to use an anti-seize spoke thread compound by Park, Wheelsmith, Stans, etc. This is possibly the most important part. I'd take a properly treated and built wheel made of lower grade components over an improperly built wheel made of the highest grade components.

As for rear hub, I'm still deciding for my next build. I have ridden a Shimano Deore hub until the cones were pitted after probably 15 years and many thousands of miles. I now have a 2nd hand ultegra hub on that bike. For my new bike I'm leaning toward Shimano because of quality and value. I have blown through two very lightly used hand-me-down Velo Orange touring hubs and I would not buy one of those. In one the freehub bearing wore out, on the second, one of the hub bearings wore out. Both were less than 5 years old and had fewer than 5,000 miles on them. I like the idea and design of their touring hub that you can remove the freehub body without tools, but I do not trust the bearings they source for those hubs, especially at that retail price. A Shimano hub is cheaper with far better bearings. Also, I like the silent Shimano hubs for very long rides.

Don't worry about future proofing the build, just build for the bike you have in mind and RIDE, RIDE, RIDE.

Let us know what you end up putting together.


Don't worry about future proofing the build, just build for the bike you have in mind and RIDE, RIDE, RIDE.

Let us know what you end up putting together.
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Old 10-01-20, 08:06 PM
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I agree about future-proofing, it's not super important to me. I do sometimes worry about the future of good rim brake rims, however.

OTOH, 12mm TA has taken over, so maybe buying 12mm TA with a QR adapter isn't such a bad idea.
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Old 10-02-20, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by ROT_01 View Post
As for rear hub, I'm still deciding for my next build. I have ridden a Shimano Deore hub until the cones were pitted after probably 15 years and many thousands of miles. I now have a 2nd hand ultegra hub on that bike. For my new bike I'm leaning toward Shimano because of quality and value. I have blown through two very lightly used hand-me-down Velo Orange touring hubs and I would not buy one of those. In one the freehub bearing wore out, on the second, one of the hub bearings wore out. Both were less than 5 years old and had fewer than 5,000 miles on them. I like the idea and design of their touring hub that you can remove the freehub body without tools, but I do not trust the bearings they source for those hubs, especially at that retail price. A Shimano hub is cheaper with far better bearings. Also, I like the silent Shimano hubs for very long rides.
Can't beat the value of a Shimano cup-and-cone hub, but you do need to keep up on the maintenance. Most people aren't interested in repacking hubs, which is why cartridge bearing hubs are so popular. Before shimano started enforcing sales territories I bought an LX rear for around 25 dollars, so cheap I bought an extra just in case I ever need any spare parts. I also have a VO touring rear hub that has about 5k trouble free miles, but now you have me worried that I need to get a new set of bearings. I actually bought it when they were closing out 10 speed freehubs so I have an extra one of those too.
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Old 10-02-20, 10:30 AM
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there is no real reason to get new bearings if you keep up with maintenance. And if you don't keep up with maintenance, they probably won't help much. I would carefully inspect the cassette body when you replace your cassette though. If I had done that, I'm sure I would have noticed the giant crack all the way around before I did. Axle was holding it together.
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Old 10-05-20, 04:43 PM
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To my way of thinking, half the reason to have an expert build your wheels is to get said expert's opinion on what to actually build.
I suppose I might eventually get a set of wheels put together, but haven't a clue what ought to be used for quality performance, and that's a pretty good reason to avoid the exercise.
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Old 10-06-20, 05:06 AM
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I just learned that Onyx will put a custom graphic on the hub for free. I'm going to have them print my motto, "Epic is not a synonym for stupid"
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