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Will NEVER do Business With Wiggle/Chain Reaction Cycles Ever Again (Very Long)

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Will NEVER do Business With Wiggle/Chain Reaction Cycles Ever Again (Very Long)

Old 05-14-19, 09:16 AM
  #26  
bakerjw
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My rule of thumb is to never buy expensive stuff from overseas. If is expensive and returns are involved, it gets hairy.
The USPS is the one that screwed up to begin with.

The only exception to my rule was a Devilbiss GTI Pro Lite spray gun from England. Shipped DHL for free and was at my house the next day. I had to show people the shipping invoice to prove that I wan't lying. Best damned spray gun that I've ever used too btw.
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Old 05-14-19, 09:39 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by Oso Polar View Post

Wiggle Returns c/o Air City Post
153-63 Rockaway Boulevard
Jamaica, NY 11434

PS. Address, as you can see, is in Jamaica, NY. Always was in Jamaica, NY during last few years. So, I'm a bit surprised where Washington, D.C. address came from?
It makes no sense. The return shipping label was a USPS label for a package to be delivered to UPS Innovations Returns, and listed Washington D.C. and a D.C. zip code. Yet, the initial tracking that went with that label showed it was going to Jamaica, NY, so when I was trying to track the wheels down I couldn't even tell where the hell Wiggle was actually sending them to within the US. In the end, the last scan was out of 153-63 Rockaway Blvd. in Jamaica and I guess that's the last scan I'll see until it takes 4 weeks to make an 8 hour flight over the pond. No sign of it ever having been in or going to Washington, D.C.
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Old 05-14-19, 10:00 AM
  #28  
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After all that, I'd never do business with USPS again! (Though they do a really good job delivering my utility bills )

Seriously though, how many $3000 wheelsets do you think it's ok pre-emptivly to refund, only to be left holding an empty box?

You have no other wheel set? How is that their problem?
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Old 05-14-19, 10:15 AM
  #29  
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There was a long multi-page thread outlining your issues and attempted solutions regarding the wheels and your attempts to remedy the situation. What happened to the thread? I was curious about how things progressed.

Last edited by velopig; 05-14-19 at 10:35 AM.
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Old 05-14-19, 10:47 AM
  #30  
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Sometimes shipping is a crap shoot. I've almost never had a bad experience with USPS. OTOH, UPS has, at times, driven me crazy. They've done things like leave a package at the front door of my house (which has no path and is un-useable---think 1760 house), left a package at the back door of my garage which I can't see from my house but is in full view of the street, left a package in the middle of my driveway 10 ft from the street (back of the house, where the entrance is, is about 50 ft. from the street), and more. Bear in mind I have complained and I have always specified that packages should be left on the back porch. And, I have had the UPS hand off to the post office somewhere in transit for reasons unknown. This usually delays the package by a couple days. I've come to the point where I buy most of my online stuff from Competitive Cyclist and one of the big reasons is customer service. They have actually assigned an employee to my account and he stays on top of my orders. Returns are free and if there is a return they will ship me the item I want the day I contact them. And, on two occasions they have actual sent stuff overnight with no charge.
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Old 05-14-19, 11:35 AM
  #31  
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Wow- a whole lot of delivery complaints are being blamed on a retailer.

The situation sucks for sure.
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Old 05-14-19, 11:42 AM
  #32  
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Vendor has no control over what subs the original carrier uses. Especially in international shipping the last mile is done by the local postal service or some other entity that is available.

Has always been that way and with better logistics nowadays they use idle resources a 3rd party carrier may have.

You want free or cheap shipping, that requires them to use the to them most economical method.
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Old 05-14-19, 04:13 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by HerrKaLeun View Post
Vendor has no control over what subs the original carrier uses. Especially in international shipping the last mile is done by the local postal service or some other entity that is available.

Has always been that way and with better logistics nowadays they use idle resources a 3rd party carrier may have.

You want free or cheap shipping, that requires them to use the to them most economical method.
That may be true, but in this case, to send the wheels within the US from me to the US return depot, Wiggle most certainly made a conscious decision to use two shipping companies; the return label had a destination of "UPS Innovation Returns" yet the parcel was required to be dropped off at USPS, where it would then knowingly be handed off in some fashion from USPS to UPS. And like I said, all that did was facilitate finger pointing by both entities while Wiggle sat around doing absolutely nothing when they were supposed to be investigating what was going on and working with the shipping companies, which they absolutely failed to do; that is what I hold Wiggle responsible for. And really, if Wiggle had gotten off their ass and actively worked to solve the problem, maybe it wouldn't have taken 20 days for the wheels to be found at the post office. Forget about the international shipping, Wiggle made a conscious choice to use two shipping companies for transport within the US and then leaves the customer holding the bag when there's an issue.

Ultimately I also just find myself irritated I can't just flat out do a return due to dissatisfaction with the product. I can do this with literally virtually anything else on the planet that is not custom ordered (monogrammed stuff, etc), so why is it that with all these crap UK retailers (they're all the same when you read the fine print) it's unquestionably yours the second you open it? I mean as it sits, I don't even know if I'll even get a refund at all when all is said and done. I mean I can buy a $3000 laptop from Apple, cycle through multiple returns/exchanges no questions asked, but I can't return a single product to Wiggle unless it's defective, and even then, it's gotta be proven to be defective via liaison with the manufacturer? Can't just be unsatisfied with something and return it? Spare me the "why should the retailer take the loss if you don't like something" speech because that's literally the way virtually all retailers that serve humanity operate, and it's just good business practice to do so. Every single person in this thread and on the planet has been glad they've been able to return something when it just didn't work out, so that is indefensible. Amazon didn't get to where they are by having non-existent return and refund policies. Nor did Apple, or any other huge retailer that people like doing business with; in fact they got there by having good policies and good customer service.

Really what it comes down to is just flat out crap service and people who don't know anything or care to learn correct information to do their job well. It's a different answer every time you ask a question depending on who you get, it's reactive and not proactive customer service, it's people not following through leaving you pissing into the wind, it's just ****-canned chat answers that regurgitate information you already stated you know or that doesn't answer the question that is asked whatsoever, it's them being unreliable to deal with, and really just not caring and being pretty cavalier about it. It's an issue of the retailer having absolutely no pride in doing a good job, and as someone who is proactive, who does respond to people at work, who does work hard to solve problems for others, it really rubs me the wrong way. They're just lazy-ass people. There's a reason all the Wiggle returns and customer service reviews are utter crap, and it's because they are utter crap to deal with when something goes wrong.

Last edited by puma1552; 05-14-19 at 04:32 PM.
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Old 05-14-19, 05:02 PM
  #34  
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I believe there is also some fault on the manufacturer. They seem to have acknowledged that to be a warranty problem (subject to in-hand inspection, I assume) and would handle that in the US. but for no good reason they would have you go through an LBS.
And they also caused the problem due to lack of QC. the vendor is always being put in a tight spot since they may have a 1-2% margin to cover their expenses and are the ones yelled at.

good manufacturers just would have sent you a new product instead of having you go through vendors in the first place. Ultimately the vendor is just a pass-through.

I'm generalizing here. wiggle sure could have done better. but ultimately they have send that broken product back to the manufacturer's EU center before you get a new one.
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Old 05-15-19, 01:37 AM
  #35  
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This thread has inspired me to pen a haiku:

Buying from Wiggle
Makes you giggle! But returns
Can give you jiggles
Beautiful, no?
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Old 05-15-19, 01:57 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by puma1552 View Post
Can't just be unsatisfied with something and return it? Spare me the "why should the retailer take the loss if you don't like something" speech because that's literally the way virtually all retailers that serve humanity operate, and it's just good business practice to do so. Every single person in this thread and on the planet has been glad they've been able to return something when it just didn't work out, so that is indefensible. Amazon didn't get to where they are by having non-existent return and refund policies. Nor did Apple, or any other huge retailer that people like doing business with; in fact they got there by having good policies and good customer service.
Amazon and Apple "got to where they are" by abusing its employees and not paying any taxes.

By the way, this is getting worked out in your favor, correct? And it's just taking you a bit longer than you expected?
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Old 05-15-19, 02:26 AM
  #37  
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I’ve bought dozens of items from Wiggle without any problems. Had to return a Castelli jacket once which I sent by Fedex. Got there in a day or two and refund was prompt. I had to cover the shipping but assumed that’s part of the deal when buying overseas.

I’ll continue to buy from online UK retailers but generally items are under $200 to avoid duty & taxes. Have had good success with Merlin Cycles lately.
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Old 05-15-19, 06:32 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Riveting View Post
By not buying from a local LBS with an easy return policy, we gamble, and sometimes lose. How much $$$ is 8 hours of stress worth to us?
Exactly why I asked how much money he was planning on saving by buying from where he did. I am fascinated by the risk/reward analysis people make (or don't make) before making a purchase. The people who really fascinate me are those who will devote so much time to try to save literally a few bucks. Years ago some guy found deal on CO2 cartridges. The per unit cost was relatively inexpensive compared to what you pay at a LBS (but not significantly less than other on-line sources). Catch was that to get the low price you had to by them in something like lots of 100. It may have even been more. The guy was trying to get other BF members to chip in and split up the lot. Blew my mind that someone would go through such effort to try to save what, in the end, was a relatively insignificant amount of money. It was even crazier when you consider that the number of cartridges each person would end up with under his proposal was more than a person would likely use during a long period. It was as if the only thing that mattered was getting the rock bottom price, regardless of actual need.


Realistically, I didn't expect the OP to answer my question.
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Old 05-15-19, 09:19 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by ridelikeaturtle View Post

By the way, this is getting worked out in your favor, correct?
I've said on at least a couple occasions within this thread that that is as of yet unknown; there's no guarantee a refund is even going to happen.

Originally Posted by indyfabz View Post
Exactly why I asked how much money he was planning on saving by buying from where he did. I am fascinated by the risk/reward analysis people make (or don't make) before making a purchase. The people who really fascinate me are those who will devote so much time to try to save literally a few bucks. Years ago some guy found deal on CO2 cartridges. The per unit cost was relatively inexpensive compared to what you pay at a LBS (but not significantly less than other on-line sources). Catch was that to get the low price you had to by them in something like lots of 100. It may have even been more. The guy was trying to get other BF members to chip in and split up the lot. Blew my mind that someone would go through such effort to try to save what, in the end, was a relatively insignificant amount of money. It was even crazier when you consider that the number of cartridges each person would end up with under his proposal was more than a person would likely use during a long period. It was as if the only thing that mattered was getting the rock bottom price, regardless of actual need.


Realistically, I didn't expect the OP to answer my question.
The savings over the LBS is about $400, or put another way, the LBS is about 100% more expensive. Not insignificant, and enough of a difference where you could buy a higher bracket of wheelset online. A bit different than some guy saving a buck on a CO2 cartridge.

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Old 05-15-19, 09:33 AM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by puma1552 View Post
A bit different than some guy saving a buck on a CO2 cartridge.
And yet you've gone through so much already, including starting a rant. I spent several hundred dollars more than I could have on the touring/commuting wheels I mentioned previously. They got me to work this morning (again), and I will be doing a two or three day tour this weekend. Just depends on the Friday forecast.
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Old 05-15-19, 09:37 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by indyfabz View Post
And yet you've gone through so much already,
It's unfortunate my crystal ball was broken the day I ordered the wheels.
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Old 05-15-19, 10:01 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by puma1552 View Post
It's unfortunate my crystal ball was broken the day I ordered the wheels.
I don't buy a hell of a lot of stuff on line except in cases where I will have access to a brick and mortar location to bring any problems to. (Think REI, which has several stores near me, or L.L. Bean.) And call me crazy, but, in most cases, the more expensive/intricate the item, the less likely I am to buy it on line. I cannot imagine ever buying something like a wheel set from across the pond. A cast iron Dutch oven? Maybe. But certainly not something that could very easily be damaged during shipping or have some defect.

Several years ago I read an article that differentiated between cheap and frugal. One point that was made was that a frugal person, in addition to considering price, assigns values to both time and the avoidance of hassles when making purchasing decisions. The cheap person simply goes for the lowest price. Not calling you cheap. Just throwing out food for future thought in light of the "crystal ball" comment, which comment suggests to me that you either didn't know to consider the "what ifs" and "now whats?"

Last edited by indyfabz; 05-15-19 at 10:04 AM.
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Old 05-15-19, 10:58 AM
  #43  
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If you ever hear from the wheel mfg, please start another thread. Sounds like a weird problem, would be interested to know the explanation.
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Old 05-15-19, 01:34 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by puma1552 View Post
Here's just some of the many negative returns reviews with Wiggle:

https://www.sitejabber.com/reviews/wiggle.co.uk

And if you go to any other sites with tons of positive reviews, and filter for the negative ones, the vast majority of the negative ones are for returns and/or worthless customer service.
Next time buy from merlincycles out of the uk too have bought thousands of dollars worth of stuff from them including 2 wheelsets and never a problem also fast shipping to me thankfully never had to return anything so not sure if that would be a hassle or not
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Old 05-15-19, 06:53 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by gregf83 View Post
I’ve bought dozens of items from Wiggle without any problems. Had to return a Castelli jacket once which I sent by Fedex. Got there in a day or two and refund was prompt. I had to cover the shipping but assumed that’s part of the deal when buying overseas.

I’ll continue to buy from online UK retailers but generally items are under $200 to avoid duty & taxes. Have had good success with Merlin Cycles lately.

Have you checked out the German E-tailers?


Bike24, Hi-Bike, Bike-discount.de, Bike-components.de, rosebikes.com


It is very rare that I need to go outside of those 5 to find what I am after, and at the best prices by a decent amount.


Having said that, I have just ordered a Hiplok Airlok from Merlin Cycles.
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Old 05-15-19, 06:59 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by ColonelSanders View Post
Have you checked out the German E-tailers?


Bike24, Hi-Bike, Bike-discount.de, Bike-components.de, rosebikes.com


It is very rare that I need to go outside of those 5 to find what I am after, and at the best prices by a decent amount.


Having said that, I have just ordered a Hiplok Airlok from Merlin Cycles.
I bought a fancy Lupine bike light from Bike24 and it was a smooth transaction.
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