Feelings on under $3000 CF or Ti Hardtail Market
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,605
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
Feelings on under $3000 CF or Ti Hardtail Market
What is out there that is impressive in exotic frame material hardtails? I can see the Scott Scale 30 as being a sub 24 lb trail type competitior.
The Fantom Pro Ti is in this market with Ti, 100mm Sid, LX/XT, Juicy 7, and 1800 gram precision bearing wheels. But at 22.5 lbs - what other bikes are an interesting build for the HT rider who wants to be under $3000?
And of course, there is the ever present question; are there many who want to ride HT at this price point? Or has the market gone completely FS?
The Fantom Pro Ti is in this market with Ti, 100mm Sid, LX/XT, Juicy 7, and 1800 gram precision bearing wheels. But at 22.5 lbs - what other bikes are an interesting build for the HT rider who wants to be under $3000?
And of course, there is the ever present question; are there many who want to ride HT at this price point? Or has the market gone completely FS?
__________________
https://www.bikesdirect.com
"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." – Mahatma Gandhi
https://www.bikesdirect.com
"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." – Mahatma Gandhi
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Socal
Posts: 4,318
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Your current Ti Fly at $2099 is a very attractive price point, as evidenced by the quick sell out of the popular sizes. I was 2 days too slow on that one. I am trying to wait for the fall shipment... but even at the current price, it's a close call with the $1699 aluminum version. If the price goes up, I would have to fall back to aluminum for sure.
#4
Peloton Shelter Dog
What is out there that is impressive in exotic frame material hardtails? I can see the Scott Scale 30 as being a sub 24 lb trail type competitior.
The Fantom Pro Ti is in this market with Ti, 100mm Sid, LX/XT, Juicy 7, and 1800 gram precision bearing wheels. But at 22.5 lbs - what other bikes are an interesting build for the HT rider who wants to be under $3000?
And of course, there is the ever present question; are there many who want to ride HT at this price point? Or has the market gone completely FS?
The Fantom Pro Ti is in this market with Ti, 100mm Sid, LX/XT, Juicy 7, and 1800 gram precision bearing wheels. But at 22.5 lbs - what other bikes are an interesting build for the HT rider who wants to be under $3000?
And of course, there is the ever present question; are there many who want to ride HT at this price point? Or has the market gone completely FS?
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 2,146
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I think $2000 tends to be the cut off point for great hardtail being greater than FS with middle of the line components. At $3000 i feel like i could get the FS without sacrificing on the components.
Example:
your $2100 Ti hardtail (the $1700 is probably a better comparison) has top of the line everything ( well most things) but for even $2400 on a stuntjumper FSR comp i get X-7 shifters and other lower end (but still very good) components.
So at 2000 I would still look HT because you get better stuff by the time you hit $3000 even the expensive FS bikes have XT type components which with a rear shock is greater than a HT with XTR IMO
Example:
your $2100 Ti hardtail (the $1700 is probably a better comparison) has top of the line everything ( well most things) but for even $2400 on a stuntjumper FSR comp i get X-7 shifters and other lower end (but still very good) components.
So at 2000 I would still look HT because you get better stuff by the time you hit $3000 even the expensive FS bikes have XT type components which with a rear shock is greater than a HT with XTR IMO
#7
Peloton Shelter Dog
#9
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,693
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
29ers might be a better option for higher end hardtails. Look at the 29er section in MTBR. Most of the guys are on hardtails or even fully rigids and still sink a lot of cash into their bikes. They're also very open to "exotic" steels and Ti.
I don't think that you'll capture the Jones and Merlin market, as a lot of that is about brand image, but 29 inch wheels make a hardtail a little more viable IMO.
I don't think that you'll capture the Jones and Merlin market, as a lot of that is about brand image, but 29 inch wheels make a hardtail a little more viable IMO.
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 165
Bikes: 2008 Wilier Le Roi
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
What is out there that is impressive in exotic frame material hardtails? I can see the Scott Scale 30 as being a sub 24 lb trail type competitior.
The Fantom Pro Ti is in this market with Ti, 100mm Sid, LX/XT, Juicy 7, and 1800 gram precision bearing wheels. But at 22.5 lbs - what other bikes are an interesting build for the HT rider who wants to be under $3000?
And of course, there is the ever present question; are there many who want to ride HT at this price point? Or has the market gone completely FS?
The Fantom Pro Ti is in this market with Ti, 100mm Sid, LX/XT, Juicy 7, and 1800 gram precision bearing wheels. But at 22.5 lbs - what other bikes are an interesting build for the HT rider who wants to be under $3000?
And of course, there is the ever present question; are there many who want to ride HT at this price point? Or has the market gone completely FS?
es
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,892
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
who or whatever is in my way at the time. That and I like plowing through things now. doing the HT thing for years and finally breaking that race FS bike makes me now appreciate 5+ inches of travel.
I still ride the HT from time to time and even race on it depending on the trail but for all day comfort....nothing beats a FS 5+" trailbike.
I still ride the HT from time to time and even race on it depending on the trail but for all day comfort....nothing beats a FS 5+" trailbike.
#12
one less horse
#14
Peloton Shelter Dog
#15
Moar cowbell
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: The 509
Posts: 12,481
Bikes: Bike list is not a resume. Nobody cares.
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 6 Times
in
5 Posts
I'm dying to know the outcome to this question - - and then figure out how else to tap into that "more money than good sense" market.
__________________
RST Suspension | Canfield Bikes | 7iDP Protection | Maxxis | Renthal | Hayes | VonZipper Optics | GoPro
Originally Posted by Mark Twain
"Don't argue with stupid people; they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience."
#16
Peloton Shelter Dog
Depends on your MTB needs. A typical MTB ride for me: 10 miles on the road, 10 miles in the woods (I ride to and from my riding terrain) and I don't ride very technical terrain. I also use the bike as a road bike with snow tires when the roads are wintery. So perfect for me. But were I a more hard core MTB dude, I'd get a full suspension.
There's a place for hard tails - lots of hard core racers - and less hard core MTBers like me - want one, for a number of reasons.
There's a place for hard tails - lots of hard core racers - and less hard core MTBers like me - want one, for a number of reasons.
#17
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Boulder, Colorado
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
I have two, admittedly older, hard tails -- one carbon and one ti. I just can't grok a reason to buy a hard tail if you have the money for a good FS bike -- they go uphill faster, they go down hill faster. The only disadvantages are weight, cost and maintenance/complexity. I figure at $2500, you are looking at about a 20 lb. HT and a 27 lb. FS. I know 7 lb. sounds like a lot, but on a rocky climb, you are lifting the weight of you plus the bike on each rock with the HT, the FS bike is only compressing the suspension. I came to this realization following my dad on his FS Titus on climbs that maxed out my novice ability. He got winded on the climbs, but he never fought to stay upright. I was fighting to stay on the bike and to climb -- way too much effort.
I will concede that the HT wins on smooth dirt, but throw in a rocky section on climb on a fire road and I would rather be on the FS.
I will concede that the HT wins on smooth dirt, but throw in a rocky section on climb on a fire road and I would rather be on the FS.
#18
Peloton Shelter Dog
What I find puzzling are these studies that show racers are consistently faster on full suspension, yet largely race on hard tails.