Didn't mean to bring up a sore subject. Ya, things will get better I'm sure.

What you gonna do - - stuff a WRX mill in the Forester?

Who close this? Back open.

Can't help but respond.

I encourage you to do your own research. Just cause you go to a shoe store DOES NOT mean they know their stuff. sucks but true

Go to Best Buy to learn about home audio...okay. Go to dedicated forum, enlightenment!

Go to local bike shop to learn about bikes...okay. Go to dedicated forum, enlightenment!

Go to local Subaru dealer to learn about Forester...ehhh. Go to dedicated Forester forum, you know...


There are hidden agendas and those who just do not know. Of course there a random good advice in stores. However, you will get far more out of your own research than any of those places.

Regardless of what you do for footwear...I would suggest some short runs on a treadmill in socks or bare feet. Only about 0.5 mile or less to start. Over course of a month or two going to 2-3 miles.

This will help automatically train your brain for better form. Even if you want to wear super motion controlled rocker bottomed z-coiled custom orthotics in place sneakers, the TM running in socks will help. It is kind of like a short cut to reading POSE running and trying all that crap. I am not a fan of POSE either, just kind of like whatever.

in summary, barefoot on a TM for a couple months will help you in whatever direction you should choose.

also look at some slomo videos on youtube of people who have corrected their running form. with or without sneakers, the videos are cool.

actually, beyond wrx sti parts. planning on 400-450 awd hp hehehe

6 cyl. Porsche? Does it spin the right direction?

no, just planning a highly modded engine. the turbo will be some of the biggest gains. i plan to take apart the engine and do as much blue printing that can be done by the ave person without special machinery...which isnt a ton if i am learning correctly. but i want full control of project. i do not want a turnkey engine. i want the balanced crank to put in, etc. i want to feel like i created it as much as possible. there is a lot that i simply cannot do though

^^ Very cool. Yes there is much that you can do w/o a machine shop at your disposal. Have fun with that.

Yeah, but a Forester? Only weirdos drive Subarus, right D?

My brother has a forester with the STi drive train - but it has an automatic - can you say TURBO LAG.

Never - D drives a Subaru and is a weirdo - try harder

I had this typed up before and then the topic got closed. And now it doesn't make any sense! My car sucks. I didn't do enough research. Moral of the story is don't buy a Toyota (or anything else for that matter) without actually looking into it.

Anyway, some good points by mx waaay back in post #122.

1) In a perfect world, we'd all be barefoot at a young age. It would probably help to strengthen weak tendons and ligaments in even those who were born with bad biomechanics, helping their biomechanics to become less bad. I'm sure this is at least partly why more Kenyans and Ethiopians are able to get away with running barefoot than Americans (that and I bet there are less flat foot genes being passed on in those cultures). Yet other than a few exceptions, the ones who are able to enter the road racing circuit still go with shoes. Even well-known elite barefooters like Zola Budd and Lorraine Moeller eventually picked up shoes, citing that as they get older, the cushioning helped to extend their career.

2) Agreed. I've got nothing, other than for the most part, I log most of my running miles on the road and track.

3) The foot *should* be perfect by now. And in some cultures, it is pretty perfect. But in modern day developed countries, we've been shod long enough to re-introduce bad biomechanics back into the population. In ancient times, if your biomechanics were bad, you got injured, didn't catch food or were eaten by a predator, and didn't reproduce. No such problems now, so all it takes are a couple mutations to pass on bad genes. Reverse natural selection, if you will.

4) Agreed on that point too. That's something shoe companies need to address, but don't because it's not economical. Unfortunately, shoes are kind of selective. Back in the 70's, running was a self-selective sport, since only those with good biomechanics were able to hit big miles, since running shoe technology was fairly primitive. Right now, people with wide feet are limited to a few models that come in wide sizes, and even then, they don't fit anyone. Hopefully this will be better addressed in the future.

6) 5 needs no comment, so on to point 6. I have not. I've run trails in racing flats and XC spikes, but that's the closest I've gotten. Flats are fast because they're light and low to the ground, and they feel fast anywhere. One of my trail running friends tells me the same thing (about VFFs). And I agree, you feel fast and light on your feet in minimal shoes. It's fun! I'm limited to 25-30 miles per week in flats though, and the rest has to be done in regular trainers, or I end up with problems. After years and years of doing this, I can't really increase that. I'm sure that if I dropped my mileage significantly and eliminated speedwork for a while, I might be able to gradually work up, but I guess I'm not ready to make that sacrifice. I'm also not sure that the most fun way over a trail is the fastest, but that's a different argument entirely.

7) If they work well for you, no need to change!

8-10) As I stated above, part of it depends on your goals. Asian foot binding is done on young girls whose bones are still soft and their bones are forced to grow to fit the binding, but the other points still stand, so I agree, your biomechanics can probably be changed, at least to some extent. And if you're looking for the purest, free-est running experience, it may be the way to go. I don't, however, think it's the way to go if you're focused on performance. Very few elite runners are worried about changing their form (Dathan Ritzenhein being the sole exception, and fueling the debate since his coach, Alberto Salazar, thinks he can run faster with more efficient form, but he's also hit his longest string of injuries since messing with his form). And not all elites have textbook perfect form...I can name a ton of world-class heelstrikers. And almost all of the ones with perfect form are the ones who were born with good biomechanics. What it comes down to is most of them are so focused on performance that they can't afford to try to make the transition, and they're already so efficient and fast at running how they are, that trying to change at this point has a good chance at slowing them down (or may injure them in the process).

^^ I know...when I was there, I was surrounded by Subarus!

Hey, what are you talking about...we're on to cars now!

Just wait 'til he jacks it up with long struts, custom wishbones and puts Gumbo Mudders on it. Gonna be rad. Dude.



You got it - - just hill people and hippies .

I'm pretty sure I was barefoot the moment I was born. Were some of you pre-shoed?



BTW, it was evidently me who accidently locked the thread earlier. I don't know how but there are little glitchy things in the new forum version and I guess I tripped one. My apologies for the confusion it caused. I guess apologies are in order over in the mods' forum for swearing about it.

Why are flu shots a scam? What training do you have in virology, vaccines, or medicine?

That's because you jerks changed the subject! Or maybe I'm the jerk trying to change it back...I don't know...

I don't know about you, but I was born in full running gear! Seriously though, putting kids in shoes rather than having them spend more time barefoot is one of the big issues that you read about on a lot of websites advocating barefoot running.

think about it. who makes them? who promotes them tirelessly? who makes up the agency that promotes them? have you looked at stock charts correlating to the sale of shots? who owns stock in big pharma who makes them? they are not necessary for most.

boy, i'd love to have a product that costs 10 to 14 bucks that the government/CDC emphatically claims nearly everyone in the US (well over 100 million) needs to get.

scam, much....



furthermore, no medicine is without consequence, i wouldn't be taking something that wasn't necessary...putting it in my body.

what if like everyone that got the shot turned to zombies or something. america takes way too many medicines. we create disease and then try to make a medicine for it. big farce

actually, most of our maladies are brought upon ourselves. even the ones you wouldn't have thought. many diagnoses are bogus. more surgeries than not are preventable or unnecessary. ton of bull**** diagnoses out there

you should read divided mind by j sarno

me and my lady in our running/hiking shoes

are those 5 fingers?

certainly not posting in a running thread!


Cool! I'm half contemplating getting a dedicated enduro race bike for next season and saving the 530 for dual sport detail.

I have never had a flu shot.

I don't know much about Foresters but isn't the WRX suspension, etc. a direct bolt on? A true q ship. I'd love to go all Nasser Al-Attiyah with something like that.

this is the one i got. yes from what i read the forester is the same chassis and platform as the impreza sti. most things do bolt on. i want to make a killer power plant. i might not go too crazy with the suspension. i still wanted to have off-roadability. i dont intend to lower it and have low profile wheels.

i am looking at cosworth and crawford for performance stuff.

I need to decide on 250 or 450. i think ktm has a 300. i am leaning towards honda anyhow. they come with steering stabilizers these days! i was considering big bore kit for a 250. i 250 will be fine for my size...but i will be racing in the vet class and i do not want to get beat all the time on the line by 450s. what do you guys think? i got out of mx before 4 strokes...at 135pounds, will i get beat off the line by 450s if i use a 250? opinions?

what is that?

Well the little dude Mike Alessi rode the ktm 350 in last years mx nationals.. He's known as the holeshot king, and I didn't see him pulling many holeshots. He did well the first race, then barely saw him again after that. He's back on the 350 for supercross this season, as is last year Honda rider Andrew Short. Neither did particularly well last weekend in the opening round. But the field is pretty stacked this season. If I were 135 pounds, I would probably go with a 250. I'm a trail rider though, not a track rider. I liked manhandling my bikes, not the other way around

As for shoe store personel knowing what they're talking about.. That's the reason I need to go to the next town over. I was told by some decent runners, that they are good and will check out my walk etc. Around my town I always ask the sales people if they run?. Everyone has answered with: "I ran cross country in high school." None left me with a positive feeling they knew what they were talking about at all.

Wow, the surgeon did a good job covering up the scars from your lobotomy! Hehehe.

Very cool. I love bolt-on stealth mods. I had an '89 Mazda 323 wagon once (only year of the wagon). Wanted to make it a stealth 'faux Subie' with the running gear from a 323 GTX (turbo 4X rally rocket) but was disappointed to find out the parts did NOT interchanged .

I'll say this as nicely as possible: You need to seriously examine where you're getting your information from. By reading one book, a conspiracy theory nonetheless, you're claiming that flu shots aren't necessary? Take a little time and do some of your own research, I know that may be hard for you since you clearly prefer to read and quote other people's work. Look up herd immunity. Look up information about the 1918 influenza epidemic. One good book for that is "The Great Influenza."

When you read about these things, consider the source too. Stop thinking everything is a conspiracy, it's not. People aren't that smart to concoct something like you're claiming.

If you're basing your health decisions on that book you listed, I seriously hope you spent a little more time researching the barefoot thing since you're trying to convince people you're right.

they sure are, i just realized that the best part of the picture was cut out lol.