Daspydyr 

Psnaz, that is a cool video, but it also supports OP comment to an extent. Some of those scenes give all riders a really bad rap and is dangerous all around. Like OP says, there are situations and there are situations.
Whether you are fat or skinny tired, illegal and stupid is bad for the industry.

Dannihilator

This....

lineinthewater

It's almost impossible to avoid certain busy roads, plain and simple. I think given the option, with everything else being equal, almost every road cyclist will choose a nice country road over a 3-lane congested cluster-$#%@. I say this not because it worries me riding such roads (I ride them all the time), but because it is simply more enjoyable. Personally, I not only ride for sport, I often take care of errands enroute - which tends to force me into congested areas. I probably save several hundred dollars a year using my bike instead of a car - never mind the health perks.

I'm always amazed how motorists sit in their mobile leather chairs, and constantly judge and/or bi*** & moan about cyclists. Guess what? If more people joined us on the busy roads, there would be less fat-a$$es in this country, wider bike lanes (that actually fit cyclists and allow normal traffic flow), and an appreciation for people that take motorized traffic off the road.

MadMechanic

I enjoyed that video, but again... why do road bikers come across to me as stoned? Look at this video and the Eyes of this dude. and am I absolutely dumb? I am a connoisseur of all things 2-wheeled, but I have never understood the draw in weaving into the sociologically dumb un-skilled world of the average road....with dumb F* drivers on a BIKE, other than on a motorcycle which is still REdicilous. I know.... and I have stated repeatedly that it's not every road.....obviously there are many roads that are completely safe "in a sense" that people find themselves on. In this video Lucas talks about Blind spots and vacant areas in an extreme way. Half of the video features road bikers grabbing the anatomy of CARS.. and TRUCKS....... for momentum..... Yes I would say that is extreme but that goes against everything people have said in this thread about road biking. Sure I see the draw if you are in NYC or LA and want to say F* traffic if you have the luxury of living in a downtown suite, but other than that... this type of thing is delusional. No sane person can argue otherwise.

-Evidently someone deleted this originally. I love open discussion

samburger

I mean if you think it's stupid then that's fine, we're all entitled to our opinions. But what they're doing is perfectly legal, so I guess I'm just not seeing what the problem is. The same argument could be made for runners, skateboarders, longboarders, really any sport that can be performed on the road. But I guess anyone who enjoys a dangerous sport that you don't is any idiot.

MadMechanic

This is true but what percentage of any other "extreme" human-powered; wheel driven.. sport.... involves idiot society drivers more often that Road biking? Runners, skateboarders, and longboarders stick mainly to the trails, the sidewalk, park, and the parking lot's.......

Daspydyr 

I guess it would be wrong to say that I ride my MTB along known Roadie routes and try to knock riders over who have bike brands that end with Os.

samburger

Longboarding, the only sport I love as much as mountain biking. Maybe not as much traffic, but easily stupider & more reckless drivers. Longboarders are drawn to the same mountain roads as sport bikers, performance car drivers, & drifters.

MadMechanic

To be honest I have no clue what you are trying to convey here Daspydyr, I hope someone gets it. And to be quite clear I do not choose MTB over any 2-wheeled craft. It is not a race or a culture, only a device to carry a person. Same with road bikes which do make sense in certain situations. I could care less about obscure sub-culture bs and more about practical use. That is what this thread was intended to discuss.

MadMechanic

Agreed' but I never see many longboarder's in 4-lane situations...I am sure someone living in such a "long-boarder friendly" area will correct me.

pablosnazzy

Daspydyr, i'm not singling you out, i'm just quoting you because you said what others are saying rather nicely, so i'm using you as the spokesperson.

but it's not stupid or dangerous, (not as much as you think) because they are skilled and know their limits. riding a mountain bike seems dangerous and stupid to people who don't ride, but to we who ride the trails and huck big things and know our limits, we know what we can do and it's not dangerous or stupid (as much as others think).

there is an inherent danger in everything, but much of it is mitigated by skill. the guys riding "Crazy" in traffic seem crazy to you, but to them, they know what they are doing.

Lucas might seem crazy, but the guy knows what he is doing, he would be dead 50 times over if he didn't. MadMechanic, the guys you talk about might seem crazy to you, but they apparently know what they are doing.

samburger

No such thing. Well, maybe certain parts of BC where police have actually helped longboarders make it down mountains more safely by supervising blind corners, but I've only heard of that happening maybe once or twice. Like I said, not as much traffic but it's more than made up for by seriously dangerous conditions coupled with equally dangerous motorists flying around corners & hogging both lanes around hairpins. Especially when the 'boarders don't wear bright clothing...the only way to fly down a mountain @ 60mph & be even harder to see than a bicycle, is by being on a skateboard.

But seriously, from what I've heard from friends that live in longboard-concentrated areas, longboarders are regarded as the only thing more annoying & scary than road bikers on twisty mountain roads. We go anywhere between a sluggish 20mph to a scary 80mph & bust out massive & seemingly unpredictable slides that can potentially cause us to stop much more quickly than motorists are able to. I try to avoid feeding this stigma by sticking to parks & neighborhood roads, but I'm also 100 miles south of the nearest mountain so I don't have much temptation.


This.

It's impossible to predict exactly how a motorist will react to what you do on the road, but with skill & experience it isn't hard to make an educated guess. It's the exact same with driving...how do you know that a driver won't pull out on front of you from a side street when you're driving down the highway at 60mph? You don't, but experience teaches you signs to look for that help you determine how much of a risk that person is. It's no different with road biking.

Daspydyr 

Rocks and dirt don't give a rats rear what you do. They won't swerve to miss you and smack another vehicle. When you create situations to amuse yourself that have the potential to hurt others you need sentanced to a trike with grocery baskets.

Dannihilator

Heck I take part in dirt jumping, street rides, pump track, and long rides on a fixed gear.

Dirt Jumping and Street are much more dangerous than road riding.

With road riding, it all depends on the area you are in. There are obvious roads here that I refuse to go on just because of the amount of traffic they see each day.

3speed

Ooo, ooo, I want a turn.

I bike enough in all situations to own a pretty nice MTB, a commuter, a nice road bike, and a nice grocery getter single speed. I love putting miles on my road bike when the MTB trails are wet.

I also hate those d-bag road bikers who ride in the road on roads that are either really busy or have speed limits above 35 unless it's a road that isn't very busy at all. Those self centered pricks love to block traffic around here sometimes. And you can "blah blah blah, they have a right to the road too, blah blah blah" but no, the roads are not built for bikes. They are built for cars. That's why they have 55mph speed limits and car lanes. Yes, you Can Legally ride a bike in the road if you want to, but that doesn't mean it's not a self-centered prick thing to do on many roads.

One thing many people don't know, and maybe it's just a WI thing, is that you're actually supposed to honk your horn to let a cyclist know a vehicle is approaching. I suggest that everyone encountering a cyclist in the car lane on a busy road holding up traffic or a narrow higher mph road without safe passing should make sure they lay on the horns for a good long time as they pass to ensure the safety of the cyclist you're approaching.

bhchdh 

Lot's of unnecessary invective in this thread. I often ride several miles on higer speed city roads to get to calmer country roads, where the lanes are narrower, with similar speeds and limited sightlines.

prathmann

I don't think it's even a WI thing - there's no such provision in the WI vehicle code in the section on passing bicycles (other documents put out by the DOT do not have the force of law). OTOH, there is an explicit prohibition on unnecessary use of a horn in Section 347.38:
"no person shall at any time use a horn otherwise than as a reasonable warning or make any unnecessary or unreasonably loud or harsh sound by means of a horn or other warning device." Sounds like you're advocating that people violate the vehicle code.

And where are these roads that have "car lanes?" I've ridden my bike around Madison and don't remember any roads that had lanes designated as car lanes.

3speed

Admittedly, I've never looked it up in the laws. It was in our drivers ed book in HS. I suppose maybe it's changed in the past 15 or so years. And I'm not at all advocating that people violate the vehicle code. I'm saying they should make sure they're giving the cyclist a reasonable warning that they're approaching from behind. In any case, all of the standard width road lanes are car, truck, bus, etc, lanes. They are. Get over it. As I said above, there's a reason they're 55mph and, surprise, the width of a car/truck, not a bike. And hey, they're researched, designed, and built for car/truck travel too. For some reason I've never once heard of them doing road testing to make sure it's suitable for cycling use. They do however do that for some lanes. Those are the bike lanes. I'm surprised you didn't notice the difference when you were in Madison, as there are plenty of bike lanes downtown for you to use as a comparison. You'll notice a significant difference between the two.

I'm All for biking, and I'm even for biking on roads that are safe and when it's a reasonable compromise for a biker to be there, but bikes should not be riding in the middle of a car lane, blocking traffic on a busy road, or be riding on a high mph road if it isn't a reasonable area for a car to safely go around them in the other lane. If they do, they're a self centered prick. It's also illegal to impede traffic, even if it's a cyclist. It's just one of those things that the cops never do anything about.

EDIT: Just did a quick google search on the horn honking. While it may not be "law," it looks like many states do advise giving a cyclist a honk to alert them that you are approaching/intend to pass.

prathmann

If that's your rationale then I'd note that streets and highways are engineered and sized for the largest vehicles that will be using them regularly. So by that standard most highways are built for tractor-trailers (semis) and residential streets are built for school buses and delivery trucks. Hope you're not planning on driving a regular car on them.

But actually the idea is that if the streets are built to accommodate the largest vehicles then they can also handle smaller ones such as passenger cars, motorcycles, and bicycles. Still haven't seen any of these "car lanes" you keep talking about.

Stealthammer

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MadMechanic, as I said before: "...you obviously don't get it, but don't let it get you down, you probably never will......
.....Some people are able to "get it" and others never will. No harm, no foul."

You are a "recreational" rider. Enjoy yourself and ride safe, and stay on the MUPs. But realize that everyone is not like you, and some of us don't ride for "recreation" because to us cycling is a sport.

....and the simple and straight answer once again is.... "If you have to ask why, it won't do you or I any good for me to take the time to explain it to you."

Ride Safe, but stay out of traffic.....

Stealthammer

Too f'ing bad dude.

I'd say there is a lot that you've never heard of, so maybe you should do some research. It is legal for bicyles to share the road in all 50 states, so suck it up.
.....and yes, you too should stay on the MUP.....

MadMechanic

L.....o....L....at stealthammer...


so butthurt! its not like I insulted you or your mother as a person.

samburger

This thread is awesome. I might have to start selling donut cushions for all this butthurt.

MadMechanic

I believe you sir....are the only person who has gotten the point of the thread so far. Thank you for reading what I said correctly and not jumping to conclusions

MadMechanic

Lol, Yeah, I diddint intend for it to cause so much butthurt, only to discuss the impractical side. I guess a lot of road bikers are sensitive guys!