Amodelkmino

PLACE YOUR SIGNATURE AT WWW.KYLLINGEN.COM AND SUPPORT A GREAT RIDER IN TOUGH TIMES

imnotclever

Flight stub/ schedule/ payment?
Hotel charges?
credit card statements, i.e. you don't go to Mexico and not buy something.

It can't be that hard if he WAS telling the truth. Was that is...

jotog

I know the rules at my work and I abide them for so much le$$.

VT Biker

Everyone on this board does.

In all seriousness, Rabobank could have decided to fire Rasmussan on the grounds that he was too thin and as scaring off potential customers to Rabobank. Since pro cyclists really are nothing more than paid spokespeople, they are retained only to the extent they are providing a net benefit to the sponsor. We may not like the idea that these athletes are the same as somebody on a late night infomercial, but they are.

And just like Nike was able to suspend Michael Vick (and stop paying him) even though he is innocent until proven guilty, Rabobank can do the same thing.

NPGScorpio

Agreed. I have to account for my whereabouts to my employer 5 and sometimes 6 days every week. And those whereabouts always have to be the same place.

adamfresno

Thank you for educating me and other posters...The fact that there might not be a due process does not mean people are fools for being upset or to like to see it another way.

VT Biker

The problem is that these Tours cannot be replayed. If we were to have waited for due process with Rasmussan, we would have finished with him parading through Paris, and now like Landis, waited for over a year to get the final result of the race.

That is what will kill these tours. If we never really feel confident that the winner will remain the winner, then the interest will die. Fast, quick, and punitive action needs to be taken (not from a criminal standpoint, but from a participation standpoint) in order to try to correct the injustice quickly enough to give better odds that the winner at the end remains the winner.

Now I grant you (you were already going to respond I am sure) that now with Contador, it looks as if the flames are starting to grow around him, and he may be stripped as well. However, this process with WADA and the German judge will take a long time at this point, since ASO cannot just kick him out. But, given time, if riders realize that any suspicious behavior will be grounds for dismissal from their invitation to ride the Tour, it will provide a greater disincentive to doping amongst the teams and riders.

Keith99

Hotel? You realize his wife is Mexican don't you? If he was training it is perfectly easonable that he would have bought nothing himself. Actually I would expect someone who had planned a hoax to have more good evidence than someone in his situation who was not up to anything.

Except for the traces of travel of course. Even if all he can remember is the airline in question one would think evidence of travel could be found.

Keith99

That comes down to fact vrs. form. Yes as to form he was tossed by his own team. But under how much preasure? If in fact threats were made, which has been reported from some sources then he was not tossed by his team, at least not of their own free will.

Keith99

^^
Reading those posts I would be inclined to think the write thought Rasmussen was clean. Right now I'm actually leaning the other way. But just leaning. I do not think things are clear at this point. I actually hope it is the team finally got upset because he was lying to everyone, including them. Not because I hate Rasmussen, but because any alternative I can think of is worse.

Bacciagalupe

Oh c'mon.

He won't have hotel charges. But he will have phone records, credit card purchases, ATM slips, etc. The guy is not Donald Trump traveling with an entourage that spares him the indignity of handing over cash to a waiter....


Yeah, well. Unlike some other riders, Contador has apparently openly stated he is willing to take a DNA test to indicate he was not working with Fuentes.

While anything is possible and the OP data has not all been thoroughly examined (or heck, he could've used another doctor), that does not seem like the action of a guilty man.

And while the situation obviously breeds cynicsm, busting a few riders does not license anyone to throw about wild accusations with the slightest (or no) provocation. Evidence first, accusations second.

pedalada

Strictly speaking I'm not sure what Ras did amounts to an "infraction", if I understand it correctly riders get 3 warnings on filing their whereabouts and Ras only got 2? This is not to say that Rabobank like any other commercial entity can not dispose of one of their employees/riders any time they want. Its pretty important to the topic for people to understand that Ras never turned a positive result or conclusively broke a rule proportionate to being sacked while leading the TdF.

I'm not a big Ras fan but thats just how it looks.

Smoothie104

Contador saying he is willing to give a DNA test may mean

a. he is willing, but he knows he won't have to

b. he is willing becuase he knows none of his blood is there, because he uses a different blood chemist to prepare for his big races

VT Biker

I go with option (c):

Claim youl will give your DNA to the authorities, in the hopes that by acting as innocent as possible, it decreases the incentive and pressure on authorities to investigate. It is the "play dead" approach. Once they actually demand his DNA, he will suddenly claim that his lawyer is advising him not to due to an invasion of privacy...blah...blah...blah...

Miguelangel

FOr those who have not heard him speak...here is the article based on MR press conference yesterday
https://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007...smussen_post07
I still cant understand how is it that Rasmussen is as guilty as those that came out positive in a test.... I wuld vote to kick out all riders that had two warnings like MR did... ooops we would see the tour participants cut in almost half....
BTW, Ivan Mayo came out positive in a drug test on the second day of rest....

Now the Tour will change forever because of this. There is talk of allowing national teams as well as sponsored teams and making the stages shorter and less challenging.... Comentaries from Spain say these and other changes will allow a bigger number of french nationals to participate.... Maybe the French will finally see a french man standing on the podium...of course we shall never see the likes of L. fignon and company...who knows???

reef58

Maybe he wasn't involved in OP.

Richard

VT Biker

Miguelangel:

are you so incapable of seeing the nuances between Rasmussan's infraction and the infractions perhaps of other riders? Quantity over Quality? Where do I even start?

I. The ASO and the Tour de France Invite riders to ride

The ASO can kick someone out technically if they think the person is ugly, or they think he makes the Tour look bad. The ASO invites, hence, riding in the Tour is a privledge, not a right. Rasmussan can still ride for another UCI team if he wants, he has not lost that right. What ASO did was basically tell Rabobank that their Tour was being ruined by someone who was causing it negative press. Since ASO has the right to kick him out, they did.

II. Rasmussan's evaded testing right before the Tour

Rasmussan did not miss a test 3 years ago, or even 6 months ago. It was right before the Tour. I mean, there is a difference between someone who missed a last fall, and in January versus Rasmussan who evaded testing right before the Tour. And he did not just miss a test from hapenstance. No - he deliberately lied and misled the Danish authorities, his team, the UCI, ASO and the public. Why, if he was clean, would he do that?

III. Rasmussan is not as guilty as others

You seem to state that Rasmussan is as guilty as the others who were actually caught. Well - yes, in the eyes of people like me, they are. However, he is not losing his UCI license, he right to ride, his salary or any other privledge that a guy like Mayo is going to lose now that he was tagged for doping. Now, if your assertion is the public is throwing him into the same pot of water..well sure. But these riders need to understand this. They need to realize that as sponsored riders, they represent companies paying money to advertise. These riders need to be clean in both fact and appearance. And he had to realize that as a potential KOM and GC contendor, he was going to be representing Rabobank more than anyone else. To skirt the rules so blatantly (if clean or dirty) was a direct violation of the above principle. You have to admit, his antics paint him as someone who clearly did not want to be tested before the Tour. Why, if clean, would he jeopordize his career by evading doping testing authorities. You probably will tell me that know one can know, so give him the benefit of doubt. Sorry - fool me once...you get it.

Keith99

Yea, that's it. Get a few more and a Frenchman on the Podium. How many? They would need 24 more.

I now know there is someone I do not like or trust. Jsut need to be sure if it is Rasmussen or the article writer.

VT Biker

Well,

based on the evidence I have read about, it is not like there is a bag of blood sitting around waiting for his DNA in order to match it. Everything described is a chemical / hormone enhancement, which would not really be caught through a DNA match. So what they have instead is a paper trail. I am guessing Contador is probably confident about the DNA issue, because that is not going to catch him and link him to OP like it did Birillo.

reef58

This evidence you speak of. Where can I see it? Or are you by any chance referring to the German guy that proclaimed Contador's victory the biggest sham in sports history. If that is it your threshold of evidence is pretty low. Let's talk evidence when these documents are released. Until then we have hearsay on the order of Jerry Springer.

Richard

VT Biker

Well,

fine - it is not "evidence" from the fact that there are documents produced yet. But this is what the German is claiming for evidence. Regardless, if not actually evidence, Contador is fine, and if this is the evidence the German has, and he presents it, my point still stands, no?

Smoothie104

your right thats what ullrich did... for a while.. hahahaaaa

Smoothie104

Just everyone else on his team, ie the guys he trains and races, and travels and rooms with most of the year...and the Team Manager. But he knows nothing, and never saw anything etc..... Remember, when going into battle, you always give your best weapons the most care.

reef58

I would say if the guy produces evidence that is credible then yes. If I had a goose that laid golden eggs I would be rich. I just can't get all worked up over the little info that has been presented. I am not saying it is not forthcoming, but until then remember the Soler rumor Friday?

Richard

reef58

Did I say he knows nothing or saw nothing? Please point that out. All I said is maybe he wasn't a client.

Richard