Stage 3, should Mayo have been attacked while down?
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Just to confirm my account of the race, here is Tyler's diary entry on the subject. Apparently, the peloton was "attacking" Mayo 30 kilometers before he crashed
-murray
Tuesday's stage from Waterloo to Wasquehal didn't make any liars out of those who predicted carnage by the conclusion of the day. I don't know if I've ever ridden in a peloton as agro as the one that headed into the first section of pave. The fight for position started 40 kilometers in advance of the cobblestones. Which meant we were going all out for nearly an hour before we reached the pave. I can't believe there weren't more crashes given what the fatigue rate must have been by the time the bunch was hurdling single file across the dusty section of cobbles.
At least five GC contenders were caught in or behind the major crash of the day that wound up complicating Iban Mayo's Tour de France ambitions. I really felt for him after the stage. With a year's worth of training and sacrifice invested in readying for this race, he lost nearly four minutes due to an obstacle. That's tough to take when you've conditioned yourself to compete in an event of endurance.
At least five GC contenders were caught in or behind the major crash of the day that wound up complicating Iban Mayo's Tour de France ambitions. I really felt for him after the stage. With a year's worth of training and sacrifice invested in readying for this race, he lost nearly four minutes due to an obstacle. That's tough to take when you've conditioned yourself to compete in an event of endurance.
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The situation last year was completely different. In that situation Lance was attacking a small isolated group of top GC contenders who had already dropped the rest of the field. (forget about the one rider up the road ahead of them he was not a GC contender so he didn't count into the equation.) It was not like anyone there had their team with then so it was basically "mano a mano" at that point. When he "fell", due to a fan's interference, Lance was ahead of the rest of them and pulling away. It was only fair to wait because he was beating them anyway. This year Mayo was not doing that at the time so why should you hold up the whole 180 riders or so just because maybe later on he might have a chance at the GC?
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The whole "unwritten rule" concept seems to be changing in the last few years as fans see riders showing sportsmanship and then interpreting that as an unwritten rule.
In my years of following bicycle racing, there are a few unwritten rules that have seemed constant.
1. You do not attack in a feed zone. This has of course been broken, but infrequently.
2. You do not attack when your opponent is answering the call of nature. This has of course been broken with humorous side effects but infrequently.
There are no doubt many others, but these are the two that are most pronounced.
It is considered unsportsmanlike to attack when the leader of a GT gets a flat in a relatively neutral area, like a flat stage. Say Lance got a flat on stage 7 and T-Mobile, Euskaltel, Phonak, and Liberty went to the front and proceeded to start a 4 team TTT to the finish to put time into Lance. Insert any of the main contenders for GC or Green for Lance. That would create a tsunami of controversy that would have journalists(and Bikeforums.net ) in a feeding frenzy for weeks. But if all the main contenders are halfway up the Ventoux in a pack of 10 and the yellow jersey gets a flat, what do you think they are going to do, sit up? Not likely. They will keep racing although they may not attack. What if in the same situation the yellow jersey clips a wheel and crashes? Most likely, the riders will keep racing, although they may not attack.
When Jan rode off the road a few years ago, Lance literally sat up and looked around like he was out touring and you could almost have written a caption to that photo that said, "Well I better wait and see if my buddies ok." He did not have to do that and I don't think his actions should be interpreted as adherence to some unwritten rule.
When Lance crashed last year, there was more uncertainty among the riders around him as to what to do, but they eventually decided to just keep racing and not attack. I think that was because they were sticking to an unspoken/unwritten code of honor.
Mayo got caught in a bad spot. The peloton couldn't slow down even if USPS had wanted to. And once Euskaltel and Credit Agricole didn't close the gap in a timely fashion, the bunch just started racing again. Too bad.
In my years of following bicycle racing, there are a few unwritten rules that have seemed constant.
1. You do not attack in a feed zone. This has of course been broken, but infrequently.
2. You do not attack when your opponent is answering the call of nature. This has of course been broken with humorous side effects but infrequently.
There are no doubt many others, but these are the two that are most pronounced.
It is considered unsportsmanlike to attack when the leader of a GT gets a flat in a relatively neutral area, like a flat stage. Say Lance got a flat on stage 7 and T-Mobile, Euskaltel, Phonak, and Liberty went to the front and proceeded to start a 4 team TTT to the finish to put time into Lance. Insert any of the main contenders for GC or Green for Lance. That would create a tsunami of controversy that would have journalists(and Bikeforums.net ) in a feeding frenzy for weeks. But if all the main contenders are halfway up the Ventoux in a pack of 10 and the yellow jersey gets a flat, what do you think they are going to do, sit up? Not likely. They will keep racing although they may not attack. What if in the same situation the yellow jersey clips a wheel and crashes? Most likely, the riders will keep racing, although they may not attack.
When Jan rode off the road a few years ago, Lance literally sat up and looked around like he was out touring and you could almost have written a caption to that photo that said, "Well I better wait and see if my buddies ok." He did not have to do that and I don't think his actions should be interpreted as adherence to some unwritten rule.
When Lance crashed last year, there was more uncertainty among the riders around him as to what to do, but they eventually decided to just keep racing and not attack. I think that was because they were sticking to an unspoken/unwritten code of honor.
Mayo got caught in a bad spot. The peloton couldn't slow down even if USPS had wanted to. And once Euskaltel and Credit Agricole didn't close the gap in a timely fashion, the bunch just started racing again. Too bad.
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I read somewhere the leaders were using the rules of Paris-Roubaix. You don't wait if they crash. This was because of the cobbles.
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Don D said it all:
Mayo got caught in a bad spot. The peloton couldn't slow down even if USPS had wanted to. And once Euskaltel and Credit Agricole didn't close the gap in a timely fashion, the bunch just started racing again. Too bad.
It was unfortunate for Mayo that A: the peleton was at full throttle when he went down and B: His team sucks on the flats. Had that been USPS/Phonak/T-Mobile or even CSC they would have caught back up to the main bunch. There was never a situation that more plainly shows that cycling is a team sport!
Mayo got caught in a bad spot. The peloton couldn't slow down even if USPS had wanted to. And once Euskaltel and Credit Agricole didn't close the gap in a timely fashion, the bunch just started racing again. Too bad.
It was unfortunate for Mayo that A: the peleton was at full throttle when he went down and B: His team sucks on the flats. Had that been USPS/Phonak/T-Mobile or even CSC they would have caught back up to the main bunch. There was never a situation that more plainly shows that cycling is a team sport!
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#31
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Originally Posted by wheelman
This begs the question - Mayo will get offers from top teams for the new season, and how will his allegiance to Euskatel remain after this year, knowing that he might have done much better with a stronger squad?
Thanks for all the thoughts. I am much more content that there is no unwritten rule that was broken and this situation did not result in an unethical action on the part of USPS.
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Laggard, you should counter the Molteni with Faema no?
or you could go La Vie Claire for that French Flair. . .
Marty
or you could go La Vie Claire for that French Flair. . .
Marty
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I just watched the coverage of stage 3 again. Mayo was within 30 seconds of rejoining the group when they hit the cobbles. George, Eki and Lance were the 1st 3 riders at the very front, riding so hard that they actually caused a split, taking 25 or so riders with them. In the splintering chase group behind this ATTACK, you can see 3 or 4 other Posties clearly blocking, and trying to disrupt the chase. This was not riding hard to be first to the cobbles, and then ride tempo. It was an all out Blitz on the front, with guys trying to block behind.
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Originally Posted by don d.
I really think this is somewhat overblown. Unless you're Robbie McEwen, these guys just don't keep track of stuff like that.
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Originally Posted by Bruco
But those guys do have a memory. You're probably right inasfar that purely personal animosity will not be allowed to dominate in important race situations. Pro cycling is full of 'scores to settle' etc. Just think about Anquetil vs. Poulidor, Lance vs. Cofidis, etc.
Can you guys point me to a link describing the Lance v. Cofidis story? I would like to read more about that.
Thanks
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Originally Posted by AnniesDad
Can you guys point me to a link describing the Lance v. Cofidis story? I would like to read more about that.
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Well, Phil and Paul just commented about this. They said that the talk around the peloton is that it was Tyler who was at the front instigating the attack. And certainly there were others to take him up on that.
Also, they gave Laurent Fignon's take on the situation as well. He said that at that point the racing had already begun so you couldn't slow it down. He basically said it is much ado about nothing.
So, I guess the forum will start attacking Tyler for this, now. Right?
Also, they gave Laurent Fignon's take on the situation as well. He said that at that point the racing had already begun so you couldn't slow it down. He basically said it is much ado about nothing.
So, I guess the forum will start attacking Tyler for this, now. Right?
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Originally Posted by hollow
So, I guess the forum will start attacking Tyler for this, now. Right?