Brian Ratliff

Faster is faster. The races I do, I routinely win or lose by hundredths of a second if not thousandths (an inch or two at 40mph).

wphamilton

Are you addressing me? I didn't label anyone a "poser", unless you mean people who buy high end racing bikes and don't race them are posers. I did say they probably don't care about racing or racers, I don't think that makes them posers either. So I don't follow your question.

I've heard many people talk about the feel and other intangibles. I've never had anyone tell me what you've heard, that they bought a high end bike to emulate racers. Maybe there is a cultural thing going on, between here and Oregon?

B1KE

Great advice and very good observation. Thanks for contributing.

Domane

No different than those who label people calling them Fred's because of their bike equipment or riding attire. Seems there is a lot of labeling that goes on in the biking community mostly to make certain people feel superior to others. The best thing that could happen is for all these labels to be dropped and just enjoy riding the bikes.

B1KE

Agreed, we can thank marketing for separating us into divisions based on wealth. brand of bike and affordability. Sad but true.

Brian Ratliff

You are changing words around. You did not use the word "poser", you used "seeking cachet" and "emulate racers", which amounts to the same thing. IOW, they are "posing" as something they are not. This is not what most of these people are doing.

Nobody wants to emulate racers. They do aspire to the racing culture and they admire the personalities that make up that culture, even if they don't partake. They want to challenge themselves and they want to compete against others; this is the essence of racing and the reason why they buy racing bikes.

gregf83 

I'm 55 and in the races I've been in there's no shortage of $6k+ bikes, some bought some sponsored. For those who are competitive and mature (read older) $6k isn't a particularly big expenditure, particularly compared to other far more expensive hobbies.

I get that not everyone who buys a $6,000 bike needs one. Wanting is sufficient in my book and the OP asked what the difference in bikes was not who could afford them.

RR3

I own at least one bike that cost more than $6000 and was not built for racing....it has a 42 inch wheelbase and weighs 19 pounds with all SRAM Red components. Road racing bikes do not have corner on high end. There are plenty of old farts who have no aspiration to race and for whom $6000 is nothing.

wphamilton

I misunderstood you then. When you said they aspire to ride like the racers, and to train like them, I took that literally to mean emulate them.

Aspiring to perform as well as them, or as closely to as possible, I can see that if that's what you meant.

Brian Ratliff

These are called "boutique bikes" and there is a whole other segment of bike forums dedicated to hating on people who buy these types of bikes. bbbeans comment is spot on about the types of people who feel superiority over others.

gregf83 

2 lbs saved for a 160 lb rider going up a 2 mile long hill can easily save 6 seconds which can be the difference between staying with the group and being dropped. The net result will be much bigger than 6 seconds if you lose contact with a group. Even 2 seconds at 20kph is a 10m gap which is huge in the middle of a race.

gregf83 

There's also no shortage of older guys who are trying to 'hang on' as there bodies slowly degrade. I ride with lots of guys who had impressive results when younger and are not quite ready to give up and go touring. They look for any edge they can get. And/or they appreciate nice things

sam_cyclist

You're completely ignoring the context of my post. I was replying to someone who claimed that a $6K bike can save a 1) few seconds 2) on a long climb 3) in a race. If you a) don't care or b) don't notice that you've saved 5 seconds on a long climb, or c) don't do a lot of climbing, or d) don't race, then that "advantage" is meaningless. You've basically burned $4K on nothing.

A $200K supercar can get to 60 mph in 2 or 3 seconds. A $20K Honda requires 7-9 seconds. But does that performance difference matter on a trip to the grocery store? On a 200 mile drive with a 65 mph speed limit? Of course not.

Even for forum members who race, how often do they race in tour style races with 40 minute climbs? That's right, never.

The bicycle is about prestige, bragging rights, etc.

As far as "pinnacle" of racing technology, that's almost laughable. Carbon rims are ridiculously loud and for all intents and purposes, incompatible with rim brakes, providing a terrible braking surface, even in ideal conditions.

Lazyass

The only difference is when you're riding a mid range bike it's not as embarrassing when a guy on a bike he bought for $600 on CL drops you like a sack of potatoes.

sam_cyclist

You are splitting hairs to the point of absurdity.

OP wants to know what separates $6K+ bikes from $2K bikes. The answer is, about 2 or 3 lbs. Whether that's "important" is another issue. If you've just spent $7K to $13K, the answer had better be "yes." In other words, a rational conversation about the topic is basically impossible if you've already spent the dough.

sam_cyclist

Well, then, you haven't answered OP's question. Unless your answer is: "the owners are willing to spend more." Which I agree with. The bicycle affords a sense of emotional gratification and prestige primarily, and may save a few seconds on a very long climb.

Brian Ratliff

You do realize that most racers have a beater bike they use for commuting, as a rain bike, or for times when they just feel like a change of pace, right? Don't feel too bad about people dropping you on obsolete equipment. Use it as inspiration to train harder.

Brian Ratliff

Yea... "buying speed" is a real thing. It costs a lot, and you can't buy much, but sometimes it's just enough to make the distinction between having fun hanging onto the pack with friends and riding alone off the back.

Lazyass

If one is having trouble hanging onto a pack with their friends then increasing their fitness level is probably the best bet. I doubt getting dropped on rides is why people buy very expensive bicycles, though some may use that excuse to justify it in their own minds. Most people do it because they simply want to have a cool bike. Nothing wrong with that, but let's be honest here.

pdedes

chicks dig expensive bikes.

sam_cyclist

High end bikes are generally lighter, yes. It has not been my experience that higher end shimano component groups shift better. I have tiagra 10. I also test rode 105 10, 105 11 and ultegra 11 multiple times. I did not notice a difference in shift quality among these groups.

I test rode high end spesh roubaix bikes but didn't feel like the ride was especially plush. Maybe a hair more "comfortable" than alu.

I don't think you get more "attention to detail." You get more carbon, which is lighter. But you also have to be more careful with torque, and these components can shatter rather than bend.

Several of the carbon bikes I test rode also had odd creaks and noises which was very annoying.

Carbon wheels are LOUD. And they brake poorly.

The industry gives you a fractionally lighter bike. But for me, it's not worth it. I don't want noisy, poor braking rims. I don't want to have to use a torque wrench every time I adjust a seatpost or saddle, or install pedals on carbon crank arms.

Plus, if I want to save some weight, I can buy a pair of lightweight wheels, and save a pound and a half off the bike for only $350 or less.

Take it the other way: if your bike is heavier by a few pounds, it will be a superior training bike, since you will have to work a little bit harder. But training for a race is really not an objective for 99.99999% of bicyclists.

Even for those who purchase $6K+ bikes, the majority will never enter a sanctioned race.

Brian Ratliff

Everyone knows this. Universally. Unfortunately, nobody's figured out how to make it easy, especially given the time and energy constraints some people are under. But people still want to have fun on the weekend...

(and let's be honest here... if you are using the phrase "let's be honest here", none of your sentences should start with "I doubt that...")

RR3

You make no sense to me. My 2015 Felt AR with Zipp 404 wheels is not destined for racing. Been there done that decades ago. There are plenty of slower, older club riders in my area on $10,000 bikes with zero interest in racing or aspiring to that snotty ilk and furthermore, not all $6k bikes are race bikes. Sorry, you are just flat wrong.

You stated the following rubbish ....

pdedes

so there are two reasons for a person to acquire a high end bike. 1. it's a veblen good. 2. it's a tool for performance

Lazyass

Did I hurt your feelings or something? Holy cow you people can get dramatic in a discussion about the price of milk.