Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

The Strava Thread

Old 06-14-18, 11:53 PM
  #526  
logical
______
 
logical's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 129
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
They took out the dark theme like a year ago. Have you never updated?
logical is offline  
Old 06-18-18, 11:02 AM
  #527  
robertorolfo
Senior Member
 
robertorolfo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Queens, NY for now...
Posts: 1,029

Bikes: 82/82 Lotus Unique, 86 Lotus Legend, 89 Basso PR

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 583 Post(s)
Liked 33 Times in 23 Posts
Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
I was talking about Strava with one of the guys at my LBS, he a very KOM-centric sort of roadie guy. One of the only things we share in common is regularly losing leaderboard positions to 17-year-old kids that ride for the California Juniors teams. Whaddaya gonna do, right? Anyhow, his summation of Strava goes something like this: "Strava hasn't even been around 10 years, and you'll see most of the local KOMs are all weather based. Some guy gets the lucky tailwind, or better, has a paceline to pull him into that tailwind. If you expanded it out over time-- say 100 years into the future-- every Strava KOM will be unattainable. Because it will be held by a guy that had a leadout man and a 30mph tailwind."
That's why the only way to really race is in an actual race. Virtual racing is nonsense and rife with cheating. Although, now that I think about it, real racing is as well.
robertorolfo is offline  
Old 06-18-18, 11:11 AM
  #528  
DrIsotope
Non omnino gravis
 
DrIsotope's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: SoCal, USA!
Posts: 6,743

Bikes: Nekobasu, Pandicorn

Mentioned: 99 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3595 Post(s)
Liked 162 Times in 121 Posts
Originally Posted by robertorolfo View Post
That's why the only way to really race is in an actual race. Virtual racing is nonsense and rife with cheating. Although, now that I think about it, real racing is as well.
Yeah, that's the rub, innit? Is drafting a city bus for 2 blocks a greater or lesser infraction than blood doping? I have to kind of think it's not as bad. But there is all manner of less-than-honest behavior going on in pretty much any competitive activity.

I was talking with my wife about this very topic out on a ride this past weekend, after a 17-year-old member of the local Juniors racing team took one of my KOMs. She said, "Just get hopped up on drugs. It's not real racing. There's no one to answer to." She said it jokingly, and it is funny... but she's also not wrong. I'm sure there are plenty of doped riders on Strava, both chemically and mechanically. How long until we see the first Zwift doping scandal?
__________________
DrIsotope is offline  
Old 06-18-18, 12:46 PM
  #529  
rubiksoval
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Music City, USA
Posts: 2,909

Bikes: Felt AR

Mentioned: 48 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1688 Post(s)
Liked 69 Times in 41 Posts
Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
How long until we see the first Zwift doping scandal?
We already have with Tom Danielson going out and crushing a ton of KOMs the week after he was sanctioned. For the second time...

And Strava said no-go to flagging his rides with a "convicted doper" reason. I tried it a few times.
rubiksoval is offline  
Old 06-18-18, 02:45 PM
  #530  
furiousferret 
Senior Member
 
furiousferret's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Redlands, CA
Posts: 5,821
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 631 Post(s)
Liked 44 Times in 25 Posts
At some point Strava is going to have to de emphasize KOM's and find other carrots to make it more appealing. People complained about it years ago, but I think Age Group and Yearly KOM's should have their own status, with the caveat the first 1-3 months of each year aren't highlighted. That way it prevents those rides on the first where you're flooded with icons.
furiousferret is offline  
Old 06-18-18, 04:36 PM
  #531  
robertorolfo
Senior Member
 
robertorolfo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Queens, NY for now...
Posts: 1,029

Bikes: 82/82 Lotus Unique, 86 Lotus Legend, 89 Basso PR

Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 583 Post(s)
Liked 33 Times in 23 Posts
Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
Yeah, that's the rub, innit? Is drafting a city bus for 2 blocks a greater or lesser infraction than blood doping? I have to kind of think it's not as bad. But there is all manner of less-than-honest behavior going on in pretty much any competitive activity.

I was talking with my wife about this very topic out on a ride this past weekend, after a 17-year-old member of the local Juniors racing team took one of my KOMs. She said, "Just get hopped up on drugs. It's not real racing. There's no one to answer to." She said it jokingly, and it is funny... but she's also not wrong. I'm sure there are plenty of doped riders on Strava, both chemically and mechanically. How long until we see the first Zwift doping scandal?
Yeah, spend enough time in sports (or even video games, for that matter) and you will see there are all sorts of scumbags and losers out there that would sell out their own mothers in order to get a "win." At least some of the skill sports are a little better on the amateur level, because doping alone isn't enough to overcome other deficiencies. And then I guess you have stuff like car and motorcycle racing, if you consider that a sport.
robertorolfo is offline  
Old 06-18-18, 07:08 PM
  #532  
DrIsotope
Non omnino gravis
 
DrIsotope's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: SoCal, USA!
Posts: 6,743

Bikes: Nekobasu, Pandicorn

Mentioned: 99 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3595 Post(s)
Liked 162 Times in 121 Posts
Originally Posted by rubiksoval View Post
We already have with Tom Danielson going out and crushing a ton of KOMs the week after he was sanctioned. For the second time...

And Strava said no-go to flagging his rides with a "convicted doper" reason. I tried it a few times.

Yeah, but I more specifically mean Zwift-- where people have actually found a way to make money:

"The winner in Flanders, 27-year-old Dutch racer Anna van der Breggen, took home $1,415. The winner of the CVR Zwift World Cup, Carey Conabeare, a 42-year-old professional gardener from the UK, pocketed a cool $7,800."
__________________
DrIsotope is offline  
Old 06-19-18, 04:43 AM
  #533  
kbarch
Senior Member
 
kbarch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 4,289
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1095 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
Yeah, but I more specifically mean Zwift-- where people have actually found a way to make money:

"The winner in Flanders, 27-year-old Dutch racer Anna van der Breggen, took home $1,415. The winner of the CVR Zwift World Cup, Carey Conabeare, a 42-year-old professional gardener from the UK, pocketed a cool $7,800."
This is one thing I never understood - the notion that amateur racers are in it for the prize money - it's laughable. Now, $7,800 is a lot more than gets handed to winners at any of the little local races I've ever been to (where 1st prize is hardly more than the entry fee), but it's still nominal when you think of the cost and trouble it takes to win it. But what do I know? Maybe just the idea of a money prize is enough to make some people do crazy things.
kbarch is offline  
Old 06-19-18, 07:42 AM
  #534  
redlude97
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,190
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1669 Post(s)
Liked 23 Times in 19 Posts
Guys here will claw each other's eyes out over a slice of pizza on a prime lap that they won't even eat because they're on a diet. It's not really about the prize money lol
redlude97 is offline  
Old 06-19-18, 09:21 AM
  #535  
DrIsotope
Non omnino gravis
 
DrIsotope's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: SoCal, USA!
Posts: 6,743

Bikes: Nekobasu, Pandicorn

Mentioned: 99 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3595 Post(s)
Liked 162 Times in 121 Posts
Originally Posted by kbarch View Post
This is one thing I never understood - the notion that amateur racers are in it for the prize money - it's laughable. Now, $7,800 is a lot more than gets handed to winners at any of the little local races I've ever been to (where 1st prize is hardly more than the entry fee), but it's still nominal when you think of the cost and trouble it takes to win it. But what do I know? Maybe just the idea of a money prize is enough to make some people do crazy things.

The two women in the example are a world-class professional racer, winning $1400 at the Tour of Flanders, and a gardener from the UK who won $7800 for riding without moving. Amateur racers might not be in it for the money or the acclaim (as there is none of either to be had) but this is professional gaming mixed with exercise. People are absolutely going to find a way to cheat.
__________________
DrIsotope is offline  
Old 06-19-18, 03:35 PM
  #536  
furiousferret 
Senior Member
 
furiousferret's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Redlands, CA
Posts: 5,821
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 631 Post(s)
Liked 44 Times in 25 Posts
Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
The two women in the example are a world-class professional racer, winning $1400 at the Tour of Flanders, and a gardener from the UK who won $7800 for riding without moving. Amateur racers might not be in it for the money or the acclaim (as there is none of either to be had) but this is professional gaming mixed with exercise. People are absolutely going to find a way to cheat.
My first Smart Trainer read about 20 watts higher than it should and I crushed it in Zwift Racing. I was top 5 in a 200 person race, and usually got on the podium in others. It was a small enough discrepancy and my form was good enough that I wasn't sure; but after testing them side by side its was consistently 18 watts higher. Now I have a Neo that's about 10 watts lower than my power meter.

Zwift Racing is fun, but I was far from the only guy with a inaccurate PM, and about half the server lies about their weight (tbf I'm 140 in Zwift, 144 irl). Some PM companies (cough Stages) I just don't trust outright. Many have a bad pm every once in awhile. My teammate does close to 400 @ 5.6 w/kg in our Worlds Climb, and I drop him at 300 @ 4.6. Swears up and down his PM is dead accurate.
furiousferret is offline  
Old 06-19-18, 04:19 PM
  #537  
colombo357
Senior Member
 
colombo357's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Murica
Posts: 2,216
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 92 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
I was talking about Strava with one of the guys at my LBS, he a very KOM-centric sort of roadie guy. One of the only things we share in common is regularly losing leaderboard positions to 17-year-old kids that ride for the California Juniors teams. Whaddaya gonna do, right? Anyhow, his summation of Strava goes something like this: "Strava hasn't even been around 10 years, and you'll see most of the local KOMs are all weather based. Some guy gets the lucky tailwind, or better, has a paceline to pull him into that tailwind. If you expanded it out over time-- say 100 years into the future-- every Strava KOM will be unattainable. Because it will be held by a guy that had a leadout man and a 30mph tailwind."

Doesn't help that we have an annual bike race here, so any segment in the road course, or on any of the road between the event stages and the houses the teams stay at, the top 200-300 positions on the leaderboards are just clogged with pro times. So I lean into it. I routinely play leadout man for my wife-- I take her into segments and break the air for her. She's got something like 70 QOMs.
This is only a "problem" for the select few who can conceivably attain a KOM on a popular segment in the first place.

I'm not one of them, and thus I can use Strava without getting worked up about KOM cheating. The only metric I really care about for myself is power, and I can use that as a measuring stick to gauge my progress and compare my efforts to others on the same day/week.
colombo357 is offline  
Old 06-19-18, 05:27 PM
  #538  
DrIsotope
Non omnino gravis
 
DrIsotope's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: SoCal, USA!
Posts: 6,743

Bikes: Nekobasu, Pandicorn

Mentioned: 99 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3595 Post(s)
Liked 162 Times in 121 Posts
Originally Posted by furiousferret View Post
Some PM companies (cough Stages) I just don't trust outright. Many have a bad pm every once in awhile. My teammate does close to 400 @ 5.6 w/kg in our Worlds Climb, and I drop him at 300 @ 4.6. Swears up and down his PM is dead accurate.
When I replaced my Stages with a power2max Type S, my FTP abruptly dropped by around 40W. Initially disheartening to be sure. I think I'm over it now. Also, no more random spikes to 2,000W. Sad.


Originally Posted by colombo357 View Post
This is only a "problem" for the select few who can conceivably attain a KOM on a popular segment in the first place.

I'm not one of them, and thus I can use Strava without getting worked up about KOM cheating. The only metric I really care about for myself is power, and I can use that as a measuring stick to gauge my progress and compare my efforts to others on the same day/week.
That's the wonder of a KOM. It means nothing, it gets you nothing... but once you have one, you want more, and you don't want to let them go.
__________________
DrIsotope is offline  
Old 06-19-18, 09:45 PM
  #539  
ooga-booga
lead on macduff!
 
ooga-booga's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: normal heights-san diego, ca
Posts: 4,116

Bikes: come and get 'em

Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 417 Post(s)
Liked 26 Times in 25 Posts
meh. once you realize there's always someone faster than you (even with your 30 mph tailwind assist), the dream dies quickly.
the motivation is different for all. whatever gets you out there and keeps you coming back for more. if it's the kom's, so be it.
ooga-booga is offline  
Old 06-21-18, 04:35 AM
  #540  
02Giant 
Home School Valedictorian
 
02Giant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Iowa
Posts: 2,688

Bikes: 13 Orbea Orca 02 Giant Cypress 88 Mongoose ATB

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 761 Post(s)
Liked 26 Times in 17 Posts
Strava Drama
__________________
Excuse me if I, have some place in my mind,
Where I go time to time
02Giant is offline  
Old 06-24-18, 09:13 PM
  #541  
roadcurious
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 18
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by furiousferret View Post
At some point Strava is going to have to de emphasize KOM's and find other carrots to make it more appealing. People complained about it years ago, but I think Age Group and Yearly KOM's should have their own status, with the caveat the first 1-3 months of each year aren't highlighted. That way it prevents those rides on the first where you're flooded with icons.
Yeah I agree they need to add something in between PR and KOM. Like rolling 7 day leaders. Would be fun if you could compete socially as a beginner/intermediate.

roadcurious is offline  
Old 06-25-18, 06:11 AM
  #542  
kbarch
Senior Member
 
kbarch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 4,289
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1095 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by roadcurious View Post


Yeah I agree they need to add something in between PR and KOM. Like rolling 7 day leaders. Would be fun if you could compete socially as a beginner/intermediate.

I agree - rolling 7-day and 12-month leaders make more sense, and it might be cool if one could keep a record of those achievements.

VeloViewer (which uses Strava data) has a Rivals feature (people who have ridden a lot of the same segments with similar times as ones own) but participation is spotty, that is, not everyone who's on Strava is on VV, and many who joined have quit using it/updating it.
kbarch is offline  
Old 08-06-18, 10:44 PM
  #543  
ZippyThePinhead
Slacker
 
ZippyThePinhead's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: North Orange County, in Southern California
Posts: 1,281

Bikes: 1986 Peugeot Orient Express, 1987 Trek 560 Pro, 1983 SR Semi Pro, 2010 Motobecane Le Champion Titanium, 2011 Trek Fuel EX8

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Question for you smart, tech-savvy Strava users: I got an email from Strava saying that someone had responded to an invitation I (supposedly) sent them from Strava. They're using a generic handle on Strava, so I have no idea who this is, but they requested to follow me. Is there some way I can find out who I invited over the years? I looked around, searched, but came up with nothing. Their profile on Strava is totally empty, no name, no riding, no nothing.
ZippyThePinhead is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
miamijim
Classic and Vintage Sales
4
04-04-15 10:17 AM
sloar
Classic & Vintage
33
02-06-15 10:07 AM
badmother
Classic and Vintage Bicycles: Whats it Worth? Appraisals.
0
08-05-12 02:26 PM
FixedFiend626
Classic & Vintage
3
04-17-10 07:29 PM
wez312
Road Cycling
3
08-17-06 10:58 AM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.