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New hubs?

Old 09-10-18, 12:08 PM
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New hubs?

I own a decent steel road bike (Fairdale Goodship). The weak link was the wheels, so I had my LBS rebuild with good rims and spokes. However, now I am regretting the Fairdale hubs, which are low end. Any opinions of whether I should just suck it in (I ride only around 40 miles of per week (recreationally)), buy better wheels and keep the old ones around for spares, or have the wheels rebuilt again around better hubs? I can afford any of these options but I hate wasting money. I don’t care about the Fairdale logo, it’s just the quality of ride and efficiency that concerns me. I am not experienced enough to know what I might be missing.

Thanks

Last edited by MDS61; 09-10-18 at 12:10 PM. Reason: Typos and more typos
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Old 09-10-18, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by MDS61
I own a decent steel road bike (Fairdale Goodship). The weak link was the wheels, so I had my LBS rebuild with good rims and spokes. However, now I am regretting the Fairdale hubs, which are low end. Any opinions of whether I should just suck it in (I ride only around 40 miles of per week (recreationally)), buy better wheels and keep the old ones around for spares, or have the wheels rebuilt again around better hubs? I can afford any of these options but I hate wasting money. I don’t care about the Fairdale logo, it’s just the quality of ride and efficiency that concerns me. I am not experienced enough to know what I might be missing.

Thanks
It's always good to have a spare set of wheels, just in case you have a problem with one.

What is the problem with the hubs? I'm surprised a shop would sell a re-build around a low-end hubset.
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Old 09-10-18, 12:20 PM
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the hubs have no effect on ride quality, assuming the bearings are still good, they will be no different than the majority of mid tier and lower hubs which use off the shelf industrial sealed cartridge bearings. They might just weigh a bit more than a higher end up. You won't start getting noticeable differences in hub performance until you start spending in the $500 range for the hubs
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Old 09-10-18, 12:27 PM
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Thanks for the quick reply

There’s nothing exactly wrong with the hubs, but I figure there is a reason that most people would consider it suboptimal to connect $100 rims via butted spokes to knockoff hubs. And I agree that the bike shop should not have recommended this idea when I was an impressionable noob.

Now that I am an impressionable advanced beginner, I am looking at Colorado Cyclist’s build of Easton rims over DA hubs. Just over 700 bucks for the wheel set after discount code.
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Old 09-10-18, 12:29 PM
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Thanks redlude

That is great guidance.
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Old 09-10-18, 02:31 PM
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wheels are a great place to drop weight and improve the ride.

they are also mysterious and misunderstood by many. Unfortunately, there are a lot of poor designs that masquerade as good options and people are sucked in for the look or price.

A quality 28h wheelset that is handbuilt with j-bend butted spokes is going to be excellent for your riding needs both now and later(if you ride more frequently).
A low spoke 20h front/24h rear(or 16/20) with proprietary bladed spokes or straight pull that arent readily available for replacement will be lighter and less serviceable.

If your current wheels spin true and are silent(not gritty), then chances are there is no benefit to buying new wheels. Instead, buy some quality tires to reduce rolling resistance. $75 will get you a set of really quality tires that are faster than the Ultra 2 which come on the Goodship.
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Old 09-10-18, 03:23 PM
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Thanks Mstate

That sounds right.
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Old 09-10-18, 06:34 PM
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Old 04-20-19, 07:07 PM
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Postscript

I am the OP. Postscript: I finally bought new wheels with HED Belgium Plus rims over DA hubs, despite excellent advice from this thread that I put scarce funds elsewhere. Now I get a pinch flat every 2 out of 3 rides instead of every 50th ride. Any bump of more than 2 cm seems to cause. I have increased the pressure to 90 psi in rear wheel, well above that recommended by HED, and am still getting flats.. My flat fixing technique has improved, but that is not the area in which I had planned to specialize. I have checked for rim strip damage, thorns, tire damage and have not found an answer. I am on the heavier side at 205 pounds. However that does not seem so far from the mainstream as to explain this. Any ideas? I do like the wheels when I am able to ride on them. Would it damage the rims if I try 100 psi? Thanks.
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Old 04-20-19, 08:02 PM
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There’s almost no pressure you can put into your tires that won’t blow the tires before it does anything to the rims. In other words, tire pressure depends on tire width and rider weight, and not whether the rims can take it. HED Belgium’s are stout rims that’ll take anything you dish up - they simply don’t factor into pressure calculation. For comparison, I’m 180lb and I run my 25mm tires at 100 psi. IMO 90 psi is too low for a 205lb rider on standard (23-25mm) tires
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Old 04-20-19, 08:09 PM
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I am also a clyde (well, a mega-clyde) and I run at or close to the max pressure the tie can hold (tire manufacturer recommendation.) I can pinch-flat a tire---well, you know, you are doing it too.

A lot of riders are built like bike riders--huge legs, slim bodies, low overall weight and low weight for height. Those guys can run tubeless at 50 psi and enjoy the plush ride. If I run 28s at 75 the tire flops all over the place---I run 28s at 90-100 psi and 23s at 115-140 depending on the tire.
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Old 04-20-19, 11:50 PM
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You liked the price you paid , initially , now you want the parts attached to the frame different from original,?

not uncommon..

cheaper wheels helped make the selling price what you were willing to pay..



brand unknown out here

https://shop.fairdalebikes.com/colle...rdale-goodship






...

Last edited by fietsbob; 04-21-19 at 02:56 PM.
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Old 04-21-19, 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by MDS61
I am the OP. Postscript: I finally bought new wheels with HED Belgium Plus rims over DA hubs, despite excellent advice from this thread that I put scarce funds elsewhere. Now I get a pinch flat every 2 out of 3 rides instead of every 50th ride. Any bump of more than 2 cm seems to cause. I have increased the pressure to 90 psi in rear wheel, well above that recommended by HED, and am still getting flats.. My flat fixing technique has improved, but that is not the area in which I had planned to specialize. I have checked for rim strip damage, thorns, tire damage and have not found an answer. I am on the heavier side at 205 pounds. However that does not seem so far from the mainstream as to explain this. Any ideas? I do like the wheels when I am able to ride on them. Would it damage the rims if I try 100 psi? Thanks.
I'd go up a tire size if there's room. Pinch flats should be rare if you're using the right tire size and pressure for your weight.
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Old 04-21-19, 05:06 AM
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One would expect that new components, especially wheels, arrive ready for service. Sometimes this is not the case. For me, a new set of custom wheels arrived with the valve hole showing a sharp burr from the drilling operation. This resulted in damage to the tube around the valve leading to leaky tubes. After damaging several tubes, close inspection revealed the problem. This was cured by peeling back the rim tape and sanding a bit of a chamber to the rim at the valve hole. As further insurance I also cut a postage stamp sized piece of rubber from an old tube, cut a tiny hole for the valve stem to pass through, and glued the patch on the tube to bolster the rubber at that point. I now bolster all tubes this way and no more valve damage. This may not be your problem but I would inspect the rims carefully as there is certainly a problem somewhere.
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Old 04-21-19, 08:56 AM
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Fietsbob, That is unfair. I believe I am still using the original skewers. As to the rest of you, thanks for the useful guidance. I will look into all suggestions.

Last edited by MDS61; 04-21-19 at 09:01 AM. Reason: Replied to general thread where meant to reply to particular comment.
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Old 04-21-19, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by MDS61
I am the OP. Postscript: I finally bought new wheels with HED Belgium Plus rims over DA hubs, despite excellent advice from this thread that I put scarce funds elsewhere. Now I get a pinch flat every 2 out of 3 rides instead of every 50th ride. Any bump of more than 2 cm seems to cause. I have increased the pressure to 90 psi in rear wheel, well above that recommended by HED, and am still getting flats.. My flat fixing technique has improved, but that is not the area in which I had planned to specialize. I have checked for rim strip damage, thorns, tire damage and have not found an answer. I am on the heavier side at 205 pounds. However that does not seem so far from the mainstream as to explain this. Any ideas? I do like the wheels when I am able to ride on them. Would it damage the rims if I try 100 psi? Thanks.
HED Belgium Plus rims are only rated by HED to a max pressure of 90PSI.

Get thee a larger tire at a lower pressure. Especially since you are pinch flatting. Hopefully you're only pinching the tube and not damaging the rims with these flats. They've gone up to now $165 each:

https://store.hedcycling.com/belgium...rake-clincher/
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Old 04-21-19, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Litespud
There’s almost no pressure you can put into your tires that won’t blow the tires before it does anything to the rims. In other words, tire pressure depends on tire width and rider weight, and not whether the rims can take it. HED Belgium’s are stout rims that’ll take anything you dish up - they simply don’t factor into pressure calculation. For comparison, I’m 180lb and I run my 25mm tires at 100 psi. IMO 90 psi is too low for a 205lb rider on standard (23-25mm) tires
HED Belgium plus is rated at 90 PSI max. HED rims are lightweight, and to get their rims to be lightweight, that means their bead hook is relatively thin, rim bed is also thin. That's why they're rated at 90 psi.

OP, if I were you, I'd look to use 28c tires at 90 psi (if those will fit your frames). Also, run your fingers thru the rim hook just to make sure there is not rough spot that could puncture the tube (very lightly sand down any rough spot using fine grained sandpaper). On a related note, you would have been better off getting the Zipp 30 Course wheelset as they are a tad heavier and built more for the CX/gravel applications (which works out great for clydes on the road). I use these Zipp Course 30 wheels, with 25c tires, and I weigh under 130 lbs, and I use 80 psi for the rear, 75 psi for the front. Any lower psi then the tires feel a little squirmy underneath. You being 205lbs need to go to 28c tires and pump it up to at least 90-100psi for the rear. "Plush" is nice,.. but not when you're getting pinch flats and squirmy feeling!

Last edited by aclinjury; 04-21-19 at 10:57 AM.
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Old 04-21-19, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by MDS61
I am the OP. Postscript: I finally bought new wheels with HED Belgium Plus rims over DA hubs, despite excellent advice from this thread that I put scarce funds elsewhere. Now I get a pinch flat every 2 out of 3 rides instead of every 50th ride. Any bump of more than 2 cm seems to cause. I have increased the pressure to 90 psi in rear wheel, well above that recommended by HED, and am still getting flats.. My flat fixing technique has improved, but that is not the area in which I had planned to specialize. I have checked for rim strip damage, thorns, tire damage and have not found an answer. I am on the heavier side at 205 pounds. However that does not seem so far from the mainstream as to explain this. Any ideas? I do like the wheels when I am able to ride on them. Would it damage the rims if I try 100 psi? Thanks.
You mention your “flat fixing technique”. You made no specific mention of your tire/tube installation technique so I will bing this up: are you verifying that the tube is not pinched under the tire bead before inflating? How soon after installing the new tube have you been getting these flats? Have you analyzed the punctures location and size in order to come up with a cause? If I were to take a guess I would say that you might be getting snakebite type punctures from bits of inner tube trapped under a tight tire bead. Any chance this could be the cause of the frequent flats?
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Old 04-21-19, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by aclinjury
HED Belgium plus is rated at 90 PSI max. HED rims are lightweight, and to get their rims to be lightweight, that means their bead hook is relatively thin, rim bed is also thin. That's why they're rated at 90 psi.

OP, if I were you, I'd look to use 28c tires at 90 psi (if those will fit your frames). Also, run your fingers thru the rim hook just to make sure there is not rough spot that could puncture the tube (very lightly sand down any rough spot using fine grained sandpaper). On a related note, you would have been better off getting the Zipp 30 Course wheelset as they are a tad heavier and built more for the CX/gravel applications (which works out great for clydes on the road). I use these Zipp Course 30 wheels, with 25c tires, and I weigh under 130 lbs, and I use 80 psi for the rear, 75 psi for the front. Any lower psi then the tires feel a little squirmy underneath. You being 205lbs need to go to 28c tires and pump it up to at least 90-100psi for the rear. "Plush" is nice,.. but not when you're getting pinch flats and squirmy feeling!
My bad - I looked up the specs for these rims and saw no mention of a psi limit.
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Old 04-21-19, 01:41 PM
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HED seems to be equivocal on this matter. The 90 psi limit is documented, but elsewhere they say that higher pressure won’t damage the rim, but will add no benefit. Likely you are correct t that I picked the wrong rims (or more precisely a strain Colorado based house recommended the wrong rims) so HED guidance does not consider my case. Alas 28c tires will not fit my frame.

Thanks,

Michael
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Old 04-21-19, 01:48 PM
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Hmm. I try to be careful and on a couple of occasions an LBS has fixed. But it’s possible.
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Old 04-21-19, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by MDS61
The 90 psi limit is documented, but elsewhere they say that higher pressure won’t damage the rim, but will add no benefit.
Use the pressure you need to prevent pinch flats. Hed says it won't damage the rims.

FWIW, this is the first complaint I've seen/heard about these rims, and I've built 11 wheelsets using them for heavier(225# or greater) riders.
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Old 04-21-19, 03:36 PM
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Thanks, Noodle Soup

Your experience gives me confidence.
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Old 04-21-19, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by MDS61
Your experience gives me confidence.
There's nothing wrong with those rims. They are some of the best aluminum rims made today.
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