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-   -   Helmets (https://www.bikeforums.net/road-cycling/1294066-helmets.html)

TakingMyTime 05-23-24 08:24 AM

Helmets
 
For an average rider like myself (300 - 400 miles a month), is a $300 helmet going to make that much of a difference over a $82 helmet? What exactly are the advantages of the $300 helmet? They are both rated highly. My guess is the ventilation? For the record I've never owned a helmet that cost over $110.

Iride01 05-23-24 09:06 AM

No, the independent testing of helmets for protecting your head has shown that there are ones that protect well and those that don't protect as well at all the different price levels.

Regardless, I'll believe that between all of them whether rated good or bad, they protected well enough. So get what you want. Or look up what some of the better rated helmets are and choose from them. Though the independent testing is a little behind and won't have some of the newer models included in their most recent tests.

eduskator 05-23-24 09:22 AM

It's all to answer with that level of detail. What's the exact brand and model of each? What exactly are you looking for, ventilation, aero gains or a mix of the two? And are they both MIPS?

PeteHski 05-23-24 09:32 AM

The more expensive helmets are usually lighter and have better ventilation and or aero. Protection ratings vary independently of price to some extent. Fit is King with helmets and again the more expensive helmets often have more sophisticated fit adjustment systems. But you might find that a cheaper model just happens to fit your head better.

NVFlinch 05-23-24 09:48 AM

(Said in my best fake New Jersey accent) Wassa matter, you got a cheap head?

Do yourself a favor and consider safety and helmet rating first. I did and got a highly rated helmet for not that expensive. Check out the Virginia tech helmet safety ratings at: https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/bicyc...t-ratings.html

Be SURE your new helmet has MIPS.

zandoval 05-23-24 10:41 AM

Just get that head covered. Helmets are a disposable item. One fall, one hit, one knock around and ya trash um. Spending allot of money on a helmet would probably cause you to keep a helmet that should be disposed of.

If you dont have a helmet then get one. A decent WarMart helmet can be had for 20 USD. Even in California.

I am not a mandatory helmet guy. But I am still around because I wear a helmet...

By the way, I have a big head and this one fits: Amazon: Bike Helmet, Basecamp Bicycle Helmet with Rear Light & Detachable Magnetic Goggles Lightweight Cycling Helmet

seypat 05-23-24 10:45 AM

Try to find last year's model of the helmet you choose on clearance.

Nachoman 05-23-24 10:51 AM

Personally I found that spending around $150.00 gets you MIPS plus light weight plus lots of ventilation.

urbanknight 05-23-24 08:31 PM


Originally Posted by TakingMyTime (Post 23247414)
My guess is the ventilation?

Pretty much. Aerodynamics and fashion/brand reputation are also factors. Living in the San Fernando Valley I'll spend a bit more for ventilation, but sometimes ignorance is bliss when almost every helmet available today is better ventilated than the one I had 30 years ago.

BTinNYC 05-23-24 09:38 PM

A $20 helmet saved my noggin. My new helmet was five times that, has better ventilation and looks cooler.

downtube42 05-23-24 11:34 PM

I had to borrow a helmet for a ride recently; it was a Lazier with more vents than my helmet. But what I really appreciated was the better sightline from how it sat on my head. When down on the drops, I didn't have to tilt my head quite so much to see down the road. That was a real quality of life enhancer on a 300km ride.

Just saying, vents and looks aren't the only thing that matter.

SoSmellyAir 05-25-24 05:39 AM


Originally Posted by PeteHski (Post 23247473)
The more expensive helmets are usually lighter and have better ventilation and or aero.

This is generally true but the level of ventilation afforded by a $300 helmet still cannot match that of the Ram Air helmet shown below:

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...580052263b.jpg

easyupbug 05-25-24 06:38 AM


Originally Posted by NVFlinch (Post 23247492)
(Said in my best fake New Jersey accent) Wassa matter, you got a cheap head?

Do yourself a favor and consider safety and helmet rating first. I did and got a highly rated helmet for not that expensive. Check out the Virginia tech helmet safety ratings at: https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/bicyc...t-ratings.html

Be SURE your new helmet has MIPS.

As NVFlinch posted worth the review if you value your head.

TakingMyTime 05-25-24 07:09 AM

Thanks for all the input. Basically it boils down to Safety rating, style and weight. You pick the price.

Sy Reene 05-25-24 08:36 AM


Originally Posted by TakingMyTime (Post 23249042)
Thanks for all the input. Basically it boils down to Safety rating, style and weight. You pick the price.

Style and weight for sure. the Va Tech stuff is, IMO, a bunch of marketing hoopla with inconclusive test methodologies.

Ogsarg 05-25-24 11:51 AM

Whatever you do, make sure it fits and is comfortable. Different people have different shaped heads. I found Smith helmets fit me well but cant tolerate a Bontrager for a second.

I recently purchased a Kask cause I wanted something not made in China (there are very few) and I love it. Expensive, but extremely comfortable and the ventilation is far better than any other helmet I've tried. I had a 20% coupon that made it easier to justify.

As someone else mentioned, look for sales on discontinued models or less popular colors.

PeteHski 05-25-24 02:56 PM


Originally Posted by Sy Reene (Post 23249102)
Style and weight for sure. the Va Tech stuff is, IMO, a bunch of marketing hoopla with inconclusive test methodologies.

What do you think Virginia Tech is marketing? You may question their test protocols, but they appear to be independent and not selling any helmets.

SoSmellyAir 05-25-24 02:58 PM


Originally Posted by Sy Reene (Post 23249102)
Style and weight for sure. the Va Tech stuff is, IMO, a bunch of marketing hoopla with inconclusive test methodologies.

Thus Sy Reene begat the VA Tech. x MIPS conspiracy. :p

Maelochs 05-25-24 03:40 PM

I deleted my "Where's the popcorn" comment but I am keeping an identical version ready ..... this could go nowhere ... but it could be a good one.

Sy Reene 05-25-24 03:52 PM


Originally Posted by PeteHski (Post 23249307)
What do you think Virginia Tech is marketing? You may question their test protocols, but they appear to be independent and not selling any helmets.

They're not selling helmets, but they're surely selling something

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...ddb7648e63.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7ab168c0f9.jpg

SoSmellyAir 05-25-24 04:06 PM


Originally Posted by Sy Reene (Post 23249351)
They're not selling helmets, but they're surely selling something

Do you feel the same way as you do about VA Tech.'s bicycle helmet testing about, for example:

1. The Insurance Institute of Highway Safety (IIHS-HLDI)?
2. Underwriter's Lab (UL Solutions)?
3. The Michelin Guide (MICHELIN Restaurants – The MICHELIN Guide)?
4. Moody's Ratings (Ratings.Moodys.com/ratings-news)?
5. Energy Star ratings (Homepage | ENERGY STAR)?

And if you answer yes to all of the above, are there any certification or ratings entity that is not selling something?

Koyote 05-25-24 04:13 PM


Originally Posted by Sy Reene (Post 23249351)
They're not selling helmets, but they're surely selling something

You’ve offered an insinuation, but no evidence to suggest that the ratings are not valid. You haven’t even given a speculative suggestion of how Virginia Tech would profit from publishing invalid results.

It’s fine to not understand how university research works… All the protocols, checks and balances, and etc that are in place to ensure it’s validity. But when you post this sort of nonsense on the Internet, you really only embarrass yourself.

PeteHski 05-25-24 04:27 PM


Originally Posted by Sy Reene (Post 23249351)

They appear to be encouraging helmet manufacturers to exceed the minimum safety standards by competing for their highest ratings, which can only be positive. A bit like Euro NCAP vehicle crash test ratings.

Sy Reene 05-25-24 04:38 PM


Originally Posted by PeteHski (Post 23249381)
They appear to be encouraging helmet manufacturers to exceed the minimum safety standards by competing for their highest ratings, which can only be positive. A bit like Euro NCAP vehicle crash test ratings.

Are you sure there's no licensing fee to use their logos and star ratings?

Sy Reene 05-25-24 04:47 PM


Originally Posted by Koyote (Post 23249367)
You’ve offered an insinuation, but no evidence to suggest that the ratings are not valid. You haven’t even given a speculative suggestion of how Virginia Tech would profit from publishing invalid results.

It’s fine to not understand how university research works… All the protocols, checks and balances, and etc that are in place to ensure it’s validity. But when you post this sort of nonsense on the Internet, you really only embarrass yourself.

If we get into the test protocols, and how these originally came out when MIPS was being introduced, there are simply in my mind, more questions than answers.
MIPS' selling point, is primarily I believe based on reducing concussion incidence from rotational impacts, with the MIPS liner providing some rotation give that can prevent that. However, then why have a test protocol that eliminates all of the pre-existing mitigators of rotational impact when testing a helmet, such as:
1. Humans (most) have hair.. this moves
2. Humans have necks, the heads on top of them bend and rotate
3. Humans have a scalp/skin -- which slides a bit over the cranium underneath
4. Humans often wear helmet liners or thermal caps for sun protection and/or insulation in cold weather.

Rather, the test protocol is strapping a helmet strongly to a somewhat tacky, hard, and bald immovable head form. Given that Va Tech at least for other sports, seems to actually test those helmets with bendable neck forms, this seems very strange. With VaTech's test methodology, it does support MIPS, as it MIPS does introduce a slip plane to a test object that has none of the normally naturally-occurring ones that aleady exist.

Sy Reene 05-25-24 04:51 PM


Originally Posted by SoSmellyAir (Post 23249365)
Do you feel the same way as you do about VA Tech.'s bicycle helmet testing about, for example:

1. The Insurance Institute of Highway Safety (IIHS-HLDI)?
2. Underwriter's Lab (UL Solutions)?
3. The Michelin Guide (MICHELIN Restaurants – The MICHELIN Guide)?
4. Moody's Ratings (Ratings.Moodys.com/ratings-news)?
5. Energy Star ratings (Homepage | ENERGY STAR)?

And if you answer yes to all of the above, are there any certification or ratings entity that is not selling something?

Not that I think their test methodologies are always really that great, but Consumer Reports disallows any use of its ratings in marketing.

Koyote 05-25-24 04:59 PM


Originally Posted by Sy Reene (Post 23249397)
Are you sure there's no licensing fee to use their logos and star ratings?

You’ve demonstrated how bs works: suggest something with no evidence and hope some gullible fools will believe it.

If you’re going to make an assertion, the onus is on you to demonstrate its veracity. Until then, there is nothing to suggest that the first paragraph at this site - particularly the last sentence in that paragraph - is false.

PeteHski 05-25-24 05:45 PM


Originally Posted by Sy Reene (Post 23249397)
Are you sure there's no licensing fee to use their logos and star ratings?

I have no idea how their research is funded, but they don’t appear biased toward any particular helmet manufacturer, which is all I would be concerned about as a consumer.

PeteHski 05-25-24 06:12 PM


Originally Posted by Sy Reene (Post 23249402)
If we get into the test protocols, and how these originally came out when MIPS was being introduced, there are simply in my mind, more questions than answers.
MIPS' selling point, is primarily I believe based on reducing concussion incidence from rotational impacts, with the MIPS liner providing some rotation give that can prevent that. However, then why have a test protocol that eliminates all of the pre-existing mitigators of rotational impact when testing a helmet, such as:
1. Humans (most) have hair.. this moves
2. Humans have necks, the heads on top of them bend and rotate
3. Humans have a scalp/skin -- which slides a bit over the cranium underneath
4. Humans often wear helmet liners or thermal caps for sun protection and/or insulation in cold weather.

Rather, the test protocol is strapping a helmet strongly to a somewhat tacky, hard, and bald immovable head form. Given that Va Tech at least for other sports, seems to actually test those helmets with bendable neck forms, this seems very strange. With VaTech's test methodology, it does support MIPS, as it MIPS does introduce a slip plane to a test object that has none of the normally naturally-occurring ones that aleady exist.

Okay, so you have basically made up your mind that their test protocols are deliberately biased to favour MIPS and therefore you don’t believe any of their helmet ratings and it must all be a marketing scam. That’s fine, but I’m not that cynical.

The way I use their ratings is to simply filter out all the lower rated helmets. There are now so many 5 star rated helmets to choose from at different price points that I think it makes no sense to look at any of the lower rated ones - unless you have a better source of independent crash testing which conflicts with these ratings.

Sy Reene 05-25-24 10:11 PM


Originally Posted by PeteHski (Post 23249449)
Okay, so you have basically made up your mind that their test protocols are deliberately biased to favour MIPS and therefore you don’t believe any of their helmet ratings and it must all be a marketing scam. That’s fine, but I’m not that cynical.

The way I use their ratings is to simply filter out all the lower rated helmets. There are now so many 5 star rated helmets to choose from at different price points that I think it makes no sense to look at any of the lower rated ones - unless you have a better source of independent crash testing which conflicts with these ratings.

I actually don't think anything is deliberate to favor MIPS, but when MIPS came out, the test methodology wasn't updated in order to isolate and prove out the incremental benefit that MIPS claimed. On the other hand, the existing methodology they kept using is going to naturally favor MIPS. Put another way, the MIPS helmets' design is more likely to succeed in the test setups that existed. Maybe comparable, but reminds me a bit of how a number of years ago, tires got wider than their nominally specified widths, and low and behold, those tires would win the rolling resistance reviews.

Sure, I'd probably buy into the idea that on a relative basis, certainly you should pick a 5-star vs a 3-star and not be any worse off. I do note that they seemed to have upped their review volumes. They now label what you see as 2024 edition (can't find historical editions it seems?), and already have 233 models tested only 5 months into the year. That is impressive. Not sure when they dropped actually indicating the date of each test; I'd prefer to be able to see that.


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