What's your thoughts on today's MASI frames? Are they even Italian anymore?

The great Masi name is sadly just that. A name. I believe they are along the lines of the ubiquitous al/cf offerings from Taiwan.

If this has changed, I'd love to know, but at Interbike, I don't recall seeing any "Made in Italy" stickers on them. That doesn't make them bad, it just makes them not-from-Italy.

I would never vote in this poll. Obviously Masi frames are not what they used to be, things of Italion beauty but that does not make it a cheap cookie cutter frame either. I would vote for the 3rd option. A decent Asian made frame that is a good value.

Bianchis aren't made in Italy anymore either, but it's still the same company. I don't have any experience with Masi, however.

Bianchi's Reparto Corse models are all made in Italy, and you can't buy the lower-end Asian made frames in countries outside of the U.S.

There is no comparison with Masi.

You risk total trashing by the vintage Masi crowd. From what I can gather there is still one Italian made frame in the Masi line up - Special Carbon which is a steel/carbon frame. My opinion is that the Modern Masi line(for lack of a better description) is a decent value and the fact that they are made in Taiwan which is where most frames are being made does not impact the quality.

The 2002 Gran Crit Masi I have has been a good bike. This frame(up to 2004) was made in Italy. Big deal. The welds and paint on the newer Taiwaneese frames are far superior. Especially the paint on the Italian frames chips off if you look at it sideways. So the Modern Masi will never be a collectors item yet is still a fine bike. Just take a gander at the made in China labels on the entry level Trek bikes.

The old Italian Masi's were great because they were carefully hand made. Once you start mass producing, bikes from different countries become a lot more similar. Taiwanese factory workers are generally treated just as well as Italian factory workers.

I've ridden the Italian version there, loaned to me by friend. I enjoyed it immensely.

https://www.bicitreregioni.com/gallery.html

search for Masi history. Interesting story. There was a Masi Italy, Masi California, Its current configuration and some stuff in between.

Currently I ride a CA Masi that was made in italy, painted in the US, forgot to put a serial number on it, all Columbus steel (including the fork) and it is a sweet ride.

Current masi's seem to be good value and seems like you get good components for the price, but I haven't ridden one.

The Masi brand manager is a sometimes poster on this board, maybe he will drop in.

I don't think that Masi is made (or even based) in Italy any longer. The frames are Taiwanese, but that isn't really a bad thing. I have not had a chance to ride one, but I am sure that they are decent AL frames. I am not crazy about the paint jobs, but the orange and blue fixed gear they are offering is cool.

I have a Masi(Taiwan) and a Basso(Italy) and they are both very nice rides.
The Basso gets more attention from other riders but when I want to get the most out of my ride, I take the Masi. i guess it would be the same if I had a vintage Masi.

They have been non-italy since the early 70's. When a Californian convinced Masi to move here. So many of the coveted mid-70's Masis would seem to have been made in the US. I'm not certain when frames were outsourced to Asia, but I don't doubt it is the case. You might find this to be an interesting read.

I was seriously considering buying one. New, from an LBS!! One of the few all steel bikes that can still be obtained.
[edit] DOH! There is no 2007 model in Steel listed, I was referring to the 2006 Speciale

So, to the OP: None of the above.

The 1970s California Masi's were still designed by Masi himself and hand built by expert frame builders. There is a big difference between those and the mass produced Masi's of today.

There is nothing wrong with the Masi of today, much as there is nothing wrong with the Motobecane of today. These Taiwanese made products are decent value bikes and spec'd out OK. They are definitely not the Italy/France manufactured items of the old brands, but things change. The old Masi made or supervised by Faleiro/Alberto, even when moved to California was special. You can probably still find them, some repainted, but very well kept/riding steel frames.

I am not sure how you overlook the fact that the 2000 to 2004 Gran Crit. Masi frames were Italian made? This brings up another question. You say C-Dales are US made but have components made in Asia. So if you buy a nice Italian frame with Shimano components is it still an Italian bike or not?

I think if you have an Italian frame and don't put Campy on it than you have other issues

It's simple: I am unbound in my abilities to overlook, forget and generalize.

As far as your last question is concerned: If I bought a nice Italian frame with Shimano, I'd put the group on my Trek and buy a new Centaur group. Definately...

Well, when the various "brand-stealing" charges come out when Bikes Direct gets mentioned I usually take a pass even though I own a vintage Motobecane.

The Masi situation irritates me though (yes, I know BD has nothing to do with it). After moving production to Cal the Masi patriarch, after numerous legal contortions, lost the right to use his name in the US. As a result we have the situation where, arguably, the most hallowed name in frame building is applied to generic bikes.

I don't doubt these are fine bikes and if the price is good are superb deals but not that name!

Hey all, sorry for the delay in coming to the party here- it's been a nutty week and I had all kinds of trouble trying to log in here for some reason. The forums were too busy and other stuff... oh well.

So, yes, I have said all along that Masi of today is not the Masi of 20-30-40 years ago. Faliero's been dead for awhile, so that's one big issue; sorry, all my seances wouldn't bring him back from the dead. Though I still burn a candle at the shrine I built.

Though some will argue that Masi is the biggest defamation of a brand name (obviously I disagree), we are no different than Bianchi, Peugeot, Motobecane, Cinelli, Basso, Raleigh, etc. I know some of the listed brands here don't inspire much passion to some folks, but for others they are the world of cycling. It's like any other brand that changes hands either through family lineage or share holders.

Here's my longstanding point; if the brand does what it feasibly can to uphold the traditions that made the brand the icon it is, then it is doing good not evil. I firmly believe, as I have said before here and elsewhere, that the bikes ride very, very well and we do all that we can to produce bikes worthy of the name. No, I don't personally braze the frames together while sipping a nice Italian espresso. I don't hand file lugs and lay tubes into a mitering jig. However, we do spend an agonizing amount of time sweating the details. In a perfect world, where I can prove the benefit to the people who pay my salary, we would still be producing frames right here in this building. We did make that small run of frames with Russ Denny and Ted Kirkbride. I intend to keep doing things like that and some other cool things as I get the brand back on its feet. One day, who knows, maybe you'll be able to order a custom built Masi again. No, Faliero and Alberto won't be building it, but it'll be everything those great builders would approve of. Let us not forget that many Italian family brands are now built in the orient. Anybody ever heard of that brand Colnago?

As for the Italian made frames we did from 2002-2004; the frames were built in Italy and then sent to Taiwan for paint and building. The frames are great quality and I will personally confirm that they ride as nice as anything from any other recognized builder in Italy or elsewhere. As far as production bikes go, they are extremely sweet. 25 years of doing this, I promise you they ride great.

Parting comment and then I'm out of here before the fire bombs start flying at me; quality is 100% independent of geography. I remember building Italian built frames for customers in the 80's and 90's that were not straight, had bad paint, threads that were all gummed up, etc from well known makers. Geography is irrelevant, but... ride what makes you happy.

Amen......

Well put. So I see now my 2002 frame was painted in Taiwan! Holy cow, I have been blaming the Italians for crummy paint for several years.

That paint issue predates my employment here, so I can't say I know anything about that. Normally the Taiwanese paint is phenomenal. The people we work with have a facility that looks like a hospital operating room- you could eat off the floors.

Tim, any word on when we'll see anything on the new 07 carbon Volumetrica's ? Two of our Cat-1 shop guys raced the Dura Ace spec last year (06) and LOVED them. I'm gunning for one this year. Any info?

It's such a sweet frame... man. The new model is even better than last year with a monocoque front and lugged rear... damned nice frame.

Anyway, we are looking at some time in February. Maybe sooner, but I am bracing myself for later. Carbon production is just painfully slow for small guys like me.

you're still giving huge discounts to north county residents, right? right?