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thinking of switching to campy...

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thinking of switching to campy...

Old 01-21-08, 02:25 PM
  #76  
qw1a
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
It's an absurd argument to say that everyone "in the know" likes Campy.
I did not say "everyone", I said "people", as in "some" rather that "all". Amrican racing communitys preference for shimano is skewed by the fact that almost all of the bikes here come prebuilt with shimano. If you look all over the world, you might have a different picture. For instance, a quick look at bikes of the pros supports my conclusion. European riders like campy more, for whatever reason.

Argument that campy is behind shimano in terms of technology is equally absurd. The fact that campy arrived at lever-integrated shifters after shimano is perfectly compensated by the fact that campy arrived at the 10-speed stop first.

Price wise, if I was starting from nothing to arrive at 10sp divetrain, campy is clearly cheaper.
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Old 01-21-08, 02:28 PM
  #77  
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Originally Posted by RockyMtnMerlin View Post
+2. I have ridden Record for the past five years and Dura Ace for several years before that. My experieince is that they are both great gruppos.
Wise words!
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Old 01-21-08, 02:40 PM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by Coyote2 View Post
If you're going to reference a former Fed Chairman, at least get it right: VOLCKER, as in Paul Volcker.

And your policy recommendation? It may help the US$ appreciate a bit, but it would cause a helluva recession...If we're going into a recession now, 16% interest rates would get us into a genuine mess. And if you really have $60k in Shimano stock, that won't help you a bit.
Yes, I was talking about the former head of the fed and forgive my spelling - I am posting from a blackberry. It's not my job to set monetary policy, my job is to make money for my firm and myself. So far BB demonstrated himself as a complete and predictable wuss, making it fairly easy to make money in this environment.

I would hope, however, that someone at the helm will let the fire burn for a while rather than keep creating bubble after bubble by overaccomodating.

As for shimano stock - I thought it was a great buy a month ago and think its an even better buy today, after 6 percent fall in spx. Despite that, I would like to try campy
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Old 01-21-08, 02:49 PM
  #79  
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[QUOTE=qw1a;6023149]Yes, I was talking about the former head of the fed and forgive my spelling - I am posting from a blackberry. It's not my job to set monetary policy, my job is to make money for my firm and myself. So far BB demonstrated himself as a complete and predictable wuss, making it fairly easy to make money in this environment.

You're a trained economist? What are your credentials?

I would hope, however, that someone at the helm will let the fire burn for a while rather than keep creating bubble after bubble by overaccomodating.

A 16% interest rate would not "let the fire burn;" it would snuff it out.
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Old 01-21-08, 02:52 PM
  #80  
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Test ride bikes with the different groups and go with the one that feels best. I did and I like the shifter ergonomics of SRAM and Campy over Shimano.

In the end I went with Campy Veloce with SRAM Rival a close second (anything better was beyond my budget). I could have bought an Ultegra equipped bike for what the Veloce equipped bike cost as road bikes with shimano groups are always on clearance this time of year.

Performance wise they all do the same task well. I just liked the way the Campy shifters felt and worked. But I must say that I was temped by SRAM.
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Old 01-21-08, 03:05 PM
  #81  
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Originally Posted by boss4774 View Post
dude, switching to campy is like going from a PC to MAC.

1) better performace
2) rarely do you need the tech support
3) it costs a lot more, but you get what you pay for
4) It lasts forever
There, all fixed!
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Old 01-21-08, 03:07 PM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by prendrefeu View Post
Originally Posted by rousseau
Erm...it's been a while since I darkened the door of a world religions class, but I'd rather suspect that the Italians would be the Catholic ones, and the Japanese would tend to be Buddhist. I think your application of the ecclesiastical here is a bit confused.
As is yours. There is a saying in Japan - Shinto until 60, Buddhist after 60. The reasoning is that Shinto (the traditional religion of Japan) does not believe in reincarnation.
Japan is a Buddhist country. Buddhism, Shintoism, Confucianism and Taoism are all present to varying degrees, and yes, Shintoism is native to Japan (and was domininant between the 16th and 19th centuries), but Buddhism is now the main religion by far, and there is nothing inaccurate in my saying that "Japanese would tend to be Buddhist" at all.

And yes, the Japanese (East Asians in general, in fact) aren't theologically dogmatic the way we are, and will pray at different shrines depending on their moods, but my point still stands, and yours doesn't, never mind the notion of "sisters" lighting candles for a Shimanoesque saint.

Go Campy!
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Old 01-21-08, 03:19 PM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
There are over 25 million Macs in the USA alone. Stay arrogant, it's helping Apple. Big time.

And of course retain your charming ignorance. it becomes you.


P.S. If you hadn't noticed, Apple Inc is now larger than most of those 'multi-billion dollar global companies'.
*cough*ipod*cough*

Sorry something in my *cough*iphone*cough* throat.
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Old 01-21-08, 03:26 PM
  #84  
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Originally Posted by qw1a View Post
I did not say "everyone", I said "people", as in "some" rather that "all". Amrican racing communitys preference for shimano is skewed by the fact that almost all of the bikes here come prebuilt with shimano. If you look all over the world, you might have a different picture. For instance, a quick look at bikes of the pros supports my conclusion. European riders like campy more, for whatever reason.
what a crock.

guess what sparky. the reason why those pro are riding campagnolo (and shimano and sram for that matter) is that campagnolo, shimano, and sram sponsor them.

duh.

Originally Posted by qw1a View Post
Argument that campy is behind shimano in terms of technology is equally absurd. The fact that campy arrived at lever-integrated shifters after shimano is perfectly compensated by the fact that campy arrived at the 10-speed stop first.

Price wise, if I was starting from nothing to arrive at 10sp divetrain, campy is clearly cheaper.
Do you actually think that 10spd is as revolutionary as STI technology?
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Old 01-21-08, 04:05 PM
  #85  
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Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
What do 25 year old components have to do with this discussion outside of one of you predictably busting my balls for riding that stuff at one time?

P.S. Suntour Superbe stuff was superb. Are you starting to see a pattern here? Three little words: Made in Japan. And the most astonishing aspect of that is that when I was a kid in the 60's, that was associated with low quality. Things change. Now made in Taiwan is starting to lose its negative connotations. Maybe that's because half of the highest quality brand names in the world outsource their manufacturing there.

actually more than half I honestly think. On the most recent Ride Magazine...even Orbea has finally put an alternate facility in Taiwan.
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Old 01-21-08, 04:07 PM
  #86  
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[QUOTE=Coyote2;6023232]
Originally Posted by qw1a View Post
You're a trained economist? What are your credentials?

I would hope, however, that someone at the helm will let the fire burn for a while rather than keep creating bubble after bubble by overaccomodating.

A 16% interest rate would not "let the fire burn;" it would snuff it out.
To the first question - no formal economics training (phd in physics), but 10 years of risk-taking experience in top financial firms. As for bb being an inexperienced wuss - compare him to king or trichet.

As for o/n rate and fire - this country is going to see stagflation soon, just like the 70s.

On topic - going with sram red.
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Old 01-21-08, 04:19 PM
  #87  
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Originally Posted by BHBiker View Post
actually more than half I honestly think. On the most recent Ride Magazine...even Orbea has finally put an alternate facility in Taiwan.
i will correct myself, the factory of Orbea outside Spain is at Kunshan, China.
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Old 01-21-08, 04:22 PM
  #88  
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qwa's quote:
[QUOTE=qw1a;6023732]
Originally Posted by Coyote2 View Post
To the first question - no formal economics training (phd in physics), but 10 years of risk-taking experience in top financial firms. As for bb being an inexperienced wuss - compare him to king or trichet.

As for o/n rate and fire - this country is going to see stagflation soon, just like the 70s.

On topic - going with sram red.
That's the problem with social sciences vs physical sciences: I have decades of experience with gravity, velocity, and force but still don't presume to have a great understanding of physics -- but plenty of people presume that their experience in the economy (we all take part in it, after all) gives them an understanding of economics. I'm sure you understand your own little niche, but even that understanding probably is rather skewed by your own self-interest.
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Old 01-21-08, 05:45 PM
  #89  
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Originally Posted by qw1a View Post
I did not say "everyone", I said "people", as in "some" rather that "all". Amrican racing communitys preference for shimano is skewed by the fact that almost all of the bikes here come prebuilt with shimano. If you look all over the world, you might have a different picture. For instance, a quick look at bikes of the pros supports my conclusion. European riders like campy more, for whatever reason.

Argument that campy is behind shimano in terms of technology is equally absurd. The fact that campy arrived at lever-integrated shifters after shimano is perfectly compensated by the fact that campy arrived at the 10-speed stop first.

Price wise, if I was starting from nothing to arrive at 10sp divetrain, campy is clearly cheaper.
Not trying to say Shimano is better than Campy. I am saying its stupid to prefer Campy because "people in the know" prefer campy. Obviously there are a decent number of people who know something about riding a bike that ride Dura Ace equipped bikes. So at least some people "in the know " prefer Shimano.
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Old 01-21-08, 06:01 PM
  #90  
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I just don't like the idea of shifting with my thumb cuz I usually use my thumb to stabilize my hands on the hoods.
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Old 01-21-08, 06:34 PM
  #91  
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
Obviously there are a decent number of people who know something about riding a bike that ride Dura Ace equipped bikes. So at least some people "in the know" prefer Shimano.
Oh, I don't believe that for a second. People who "prefer" Shimano are obviously deluded, are certainly ignorant, and, worst of all, get Catholics and Buddhists mixed up.

Go Campy!
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Old 01-21-08, 06:52 PM
  #92  
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Originally Posted by Geoff326 View Post
I just don't like the idea of shifting with my thumb cuz I usually use my thumb to stabilize my hands on the hoods.
I wont buy into the argument per say (primarily because I don't have experience with Shimano) however you really shouldn't be using your thumb to stabilize weight over your hoods/bars IMO. You should be very light on your bars at all times (except sprinting) IMO. Even when it is advantageous to bring your centre of gravity forward you should never shift it so far that you feel the weight transferred through your hands to your hoods/bars requires the reassuring stabilization of your thumb.

So I guess my contention is that your perceived requirement for 'thumb stabilization' shouldn't preclude you from considering Campagnolo primarily because I believe it is a redundant need on a bicycle were you to be utilising it in the correct manner.

But I don't really have a clue what I am on about so yeah ignore me.
 
Old 01-21-08, 08:20 PM
  #93  
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Originally Posted by patentcad View Post
There are over 25 million Macs in the USA alone. Stay arrogant, it's helping Apple. Big time.

And of course retain your charming ignorance. it becomes you.

P.S. If you hadn't noticed, Apple Inc is now larger than most of those 'multi-billion dollar global companies'.

Comparing the wrong sets of numbers doesn't help your case. So much for less than charming ignorance.
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Old 01-21-08, 09:15 PM
  #94  
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Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
Oh, I don't believe that for a second. People who "prefer" Shimano are obviously deluded, are certainly ignorant, and, worst of all, get Catholics and Buddhists mixed up.

Go Campy!
You just killed another kitten!
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Old 01-21-08, 09:42 PM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by Coyote2 View Post
I'm sure you understand your own little niche, but even that understanding probably is rather skewed by your own self-interest.
I do read the academic literature and keep abreast both the theory and current practice - after all, decisions of policy makers are based on them. As a trader, my understanding of economic policy vs an economist is similar to understanding of bicycle design of a pro racer vs shimano engeneer - I know how to ride it and I could easily tell what's wrong with it, but I would not be a policy maker. I'm pretty sure that at this stage my understanding of general economics (both micro and macro) is equivalent to that of a second-year econ phd sudent.

On topic - while my Mrs was supporting the economy, I stopped by the "fancy" store and played with sram-equipped bike. The whole double-action shifting idea is very, very neat and I can keep my wheels and casettes!
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Old 01-21-08, 09:49 PM
  #96  
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Tomorrow I take my first ride on the my Centaur equipped bike. Will be the first time riding a good geared bike, well... ever. I've been riding track on the streets for 3 years, and a ****ty hybrid for 2 before that. But these arguments are great, almost like a right/left wing polarized battle to the death.
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