btw I'm not saying I buy it anymore, but he did say it.

edit: We are talking about a guy who won 3 tours, and I think one of them was after he took a shotgun blast to the chest. I mean it sounds unbelievable but so does what he accomplished.

Well said...pro riders are in another strastosphere as is the case when comparing an amateur in almost any sport to that of a pro. What is perhaps even more surprising is how badly pros suck at alternative athletic endeavors...many times talent is very specific to a particular sport...sometimes even specialties within a sport...long distance swimming and running versus short race sprints etc. The greatest basketball player of all time with unfathomable hand to eye coordination and power has a hard time breaking 80 at golf even though he plays every day....now that is surprising but true.

apples. oranges.

basketball is a sport. golf is a game.

On this subject.....How much difference does drafting make? Has anyone ever come up with actual numbers?? I know when I ride alone I'm at least a mile and a half an hour slower than when I ride with my regular group (4-5 ).

Basketball is also a game. Alligator wrestling is a sport.

23~28 MPH in packs depending on the course.
27~31 solo TT depending on length and course
33+ team TT.

At least that's what I've gathered in ~ half a year.
I just do Triathlons and the fastest bike average speed I've seen so far was 26.6 on a 70.3. I'm sure there are other people out there going much faster. I'm currently between 23 and 24 MPH for 40Ks.

Muff diving. Now that's a sport.

No; that's a money pit.

[QUOTE=Kragg;6716498]On this subject.....How much difference does drafting make? Has anyone ever come up with actual numbers?? QUOTE]

How about 152 mph?

https://www.canosoarus.com/08LSRbicycle/LSR%20Bike01.htm

You are no good at either so unqualified to speculate.
I love the golf isn't a sport analogy. Kind of like a big league pitcher
who can throw a baseball 95 mph who is fat and can't run the 40 under
5 seconds.
Its no coincidence that Tiger Woods is the best athlete on the PGA tour who pound for pound was the strongest "athlete" ever to attend Stanford.

that's never stopped you from chiming in about cycling, George.

bully for you.

is this your walter mitty moment, or are you trying to change the topic?

these guys did alright at golf as well.

Better stick to cycling botto as you are clueless about sport. Nichlaus and Daly were both excellent athletes in high school. Daly could throw a baseball and football farther than anybody in his school...and neighboring schools for that matter and Nichlaus was an excellent basketball and tennis player. Guys that hit a golf ball like a girl (you) and can only hit it dead right shouldn't speculate on guys that can drive the ball with a draw over 300 yards.
Enjoy your little fantasy.

It all depends upon the speed of the group, how many are involved in the group/pack, wherte you are in the group, how tight the group is, whether it's rotating paceline, etc.

But if you are with a group of good riders in a tight paceline, you certainly withh go a good bit faster than 1.5 mph of your solo pace

yeah, but they're both a bunch of lard butts now. They'd probably get dropped by a little girl going up stairs. Maybe they should start walking their clubs around a little more...

Is a sumo wrestler an athlete? Is a 400 lb lineman an athlete?
Is a discus thrower an athlete? Is John Elway who can barely walk an athlete?
Is Mark Spitz an athlete? Is John Daly a better athlete than Mark Spitz because he can throw a football 40 yards farther?

wtf? that's pretty random.

Sumo wrestlers are fat but have amazing strength and endurance. In spite of their weight most Dr's agree they are quite healthy because of the rigors of their sport. Wrestling is exhausting in a matter of seconds. It depends on which lineman we're talking about. Not sure what to make of the Elway thing. He can't walk to well NOW because of the beating he took on the field during his career. He's probably not such a great athlete currently because of it I guess. Comparing Daly to Spitz...oh yeah...and throwing a football - uhm... The statement is kind of wacky enough that a coherent mature response is a bit difficult. I'm not trying to insult you with that - just really, I'm not sure what to do with it so I'm going to leave it alone. I mean asking me if a swimmer or a golfer is a better athlete because one can throw the football better?

Look, golf is a very hard game. It takes prodigious skill. I've tried it and I understand. I've got a friend who is supposed to be insanely good at it and I respect his ability there (I've never seen him play but have heard from friends its pretty impressive) However, golf is not anywhere near that physically demanding. Nichlaus and Daly are in horrible athletic shape in those pics. Correction - they're not in athletic shape at all. Daly probably would be out of breath walking across the bar to order his next drink. My buddy that I mentioned earlier was I believe around 300 pounds when he was playing golf. I met him through cycling. He's down to about 210 (I think). Anyway, you can ask him if you want. He's on this board (Cbip).

It was pretty much the definition of a straw man argument, wasn't it?

I've seen more of those here than scarecrows in my entire life.

I don't have a dog in this fight, but at least spell his name correctly. It's Nicklaus.

Doh - lol. I wasn't sure how to spell it either so I copied and pasted directly from compaq4life's post.

I'm not trying to insult you either but my point is the definition of athlete escapes you.

OK...you can spell. What kind of grip does Nichlaus play with and why?

Isn't that really the point of debate who is an athlete and who is better because of particular attributes? If somebody doesn't believe that hitting a golf ball 300 yards into a 30 yard wide fairway isn't an athletic feat that few on the planet can do so repeatedly then they don't understand why Tiger Woods is a billionaire and why Lance couldn't afford the garage on one of his homes.

I've been an athlete since I was 13. Nicklaus and Daly obviously have lost the faith.

Rosy and her 5 sisters?