What if...
08-01-09, 10:45 PM
#1
post-ironic
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 802
Bikes: CAAD 12, Lemond Maillot Jaune
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
What if...
I pumped my 853 steel frame full of hydrogen, and I mean a crap load of hydrogen. I mean enough to put the Hindenburg to shame. Then I managed to seal it all in there. Then mayhap the tubes as well. What kind of weight savings are we looking at here?
08-01-09, 10:51 PM
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oz
Posts: 981
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
Do you mean Helium? I don't think bike frames are air (Helium/Hydrogen) tight and the cost would be prohibitive I would think if somehow you did manage to make it air tight. Buy a lighter bike or train harder/more would be a more practical solution.
08-01-09, 10:54 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 517
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
sorry for the downer
08-01-09, 11:00 PM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Orange Park, Florida
Posts: 846
Bikes: jamis xenith comp '08, trek 750 hybrid (w/drops) c.1995, centurian fixie, kona cindercone mtb c.2000
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
puff, puff pass
08-01-09, 11:02 PM
#8
post-ironic
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 802
Bikes: CAAD 12, Lemond Maillot Jaune
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Well I sort of figure that at a certain point compressing the hydrogen would only add weight? After all the oxygen is pushed out?
08-01-09, 11:08 PM
#10
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 28,387
Bikes: Specialized Tarmac SL2, Specialized Tarmac SL, Giant TCR Composite, Specialized StumpJumper Expert HT
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
More gass compressed into the same space will make it weigh more [compared to less hydrogen], not less. Fail.
08-01-09, 11:11 PM
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 723
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
given the volume in all the pipings is much less than what 1 mol of gas would take up at atmospheric pressure, the amount of weight savings you'd realistically be looking at is fractions of grams.
even if you assume there to be 22.4 liters of volume, then you would be saving maybe something close to 27 grams... think about this now, how thin is your frame, now think about 22 liters of milk. this is assuming that both gases are entirely ideal, and that you're replacing equimolar quantities.
just figured i'd give you an actual response instead of denouncing this idea as stupid (which it really is)
even if you assume there to be 22.4 liters of volume, then you would be saving maybe something close to 27 grams... think about this now, how thin is your frame, now think about 22 liters of milk. this is assuming that both gases are entirely ideal, and that you're replacing equimolar quantities.
just figured i'd give you an actual response instead of denouncing this idea as stupid (which it really is)
08-01-09, 11:12 PM
#12
post-ironic
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 802
Bikes: CAAD 12, Lemond Maillot Jaune
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Or if you took a CF or Aluminum frame with more surface area, could there be a difference, albeit slight? Or just took all the air out of it altogether?
08-01-09, 11:12 PM
#13
Refrigerator Raider Hater
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Barre, VT
Posts: 808
Bikes: 2008 Sequoia
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
If you really want to save weight, make it a vacuum inside the tubes. Nothing weighs less than nothing.
08-01-09, 11:14 PM
#14
Refrigerator Raider Hater
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Barre, VT
Posts: 808
Bikes: 2008 Sequoia
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
What you ate for breakfast would have a larger effect on weight than what (if any) gas is in your frame tubes.
08-01-09, 11:15 PM
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 723
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
in all seriousness (man that's hard to type), i'd have to wonder if a carbon fiber frame with weaving running parallel to the frame could sustain that type of pressure difference.
08-01-09, 11:19 PM
#17
Uber Goober
Be sure to fill your tires with helium while you're at it.
__________________
"be careful this rando stuff is addictive and dan's the 'pusher'."
"be careful this rando stuff is addictive and dan's the 'pusher'."
08-02-09, 12:04 AM
#19
Refrigerator Raider Hater
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Barre, VT
Posts: 808
Bikes: 2008 Sequoia
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
08-02-09, 12:19 AM
#21
moth -----> flame
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 5,916
Bikes: 11 CAAD 10-4, 07 Specialized Roubaix Comp, 98 Peugeot Horizon
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times
in
2 Posts
Ya know the human brain weighs 3lbs, right there. Just sayin'
__________________
BF, in a nutshell
BF, in a nutshell
08-02-09, 12:24 AM
#22
Out fishing with Annie on his lap, a cigar in one hand and a ginger ale in the other, watching the sunset.
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: South Florida
Posts: 16,056
Bikes: Techna Wheelchair and a Sun EZ 3 Recumbent Trike
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 22 Times
in
17 Posts
__________________
. “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche
"We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant
. “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche
"We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant
08-02-09, 06:15 AM
#24
Senior Member
08-02-09, 06:18 AM
#25
ka maté ka maté ka ora
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: wessex
Posts: 4,423
Bikes: breezer venturi - red novo bosberg - red, pedal force cg1 - red, neuvation f-100 - da, devinci phantom - xt, miele piste - miche/campy, bianchi reparto corse sbx, concorde squadra tsx - da, miele team issue sl - ultegra
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 25 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
3 Posts