dadof3boys

I'm looking to pick up a new road bike for my wife soon and have a sizing question about women's frames vs. unisex or men's frames. She has ridden several bikes (Fuji Roubaix, Marin Portifino, GT Series 4, Specialized Dolce). The bike that fit her best was the Specialized Dolce (51cm). I have also looked at BD bikes and am strongly considering going with BD simply because of finances (we have a friend that can assemble it). We've also been watching Craigslist & eBay for a couple weeks and have found nothing in our range with her size.

The main bike on BD that I am considering is the Motobecane Mirage Pro. I was comparing the geometry of the 51cm Dolce and the Mirage Pro and I'm having a hard time figuring out which size to buy. The geometry for the Dolce are:

Seat-Tube Length, B-B Center to Top 445mm
Top-Tube Length, Horizontal 515mm
B-B Drop 73mm
Chain-Stay Length 415mm
Seat-Tube Angle 75.5°
Head-Tube Angle 71.5°
Fork Rake 51mm
Wheelbase 989mm
Stand-Over Height 731mm

And the geometry for the Mirage Pro 48cm 50cm

Seat-Tube Length, B-B Center to Top 480mm 500mm
Top-Tube Length, Horizontal 515mm 525mm
B-B Drop 69mm 60mm
Chain-Stay Length 410mm 410mm
Seat-Tube Angle 75° 75°
Head-Tube Angle 72.5° 72.5°
Fork Rake 45mm 45mm
Wheelbase 964mm 989mm
Stand-Over Height 735mm 740mm

In looking at the geometries, I see that Specialized must size their bikes based on top tube length rather than seat tube right? So given these numbers, would the 48cm or 50cm be better for her if the 51cm Dolce fit best?

I also notice that the Mirage Pro looks to have a more aggressive frame with the more level top tube, so would that drastically change her position? This is her first road bike so she'll mainly be riding for fitness and recreation, but working her way up to long rides.

We need to keep our budget right at the $500 mark and as much as we (she) loved the Dolce, it was just too costly.

Here's the links to the two bikes:
Mirage Pro
Specialized Dolce Sport Triple

My other question has to do with the standard double crank on the Mirage Pro. My wife has never ridden road, and has hardly ever ridden her hybrid in the last 3 years so would a standard double be too much for her? Should we be looking at bikes with triples or compacts? Her riding is generally going to be flat but we will be riding periodically in mild hills.

EDIT: I should also say that my wife is 5'5"

dadof3boys

Anyone have any advice???

old and new

Starting off with some generalities; women fit differently than men on bikes. They bend higher up on their bodies. Given the same height, they still require a smaller frame, shorter reach to be more accurate. They don't fancy too-big o'bike either. They also have smaller hands and short arms. Having read you and the specs. on the BD model, I would say that you ought to at least consider one size smaller than that model's chart indicates as per her height. Those charts are OK BUT it seems that it's male specific. You ought to consider the female spec. models or at least consult the specs.
The Specialized is a beaute, spending more is an issue with you, I understand. If the lady can reconcile buying the BD bike, all the better. No, I won't go on about the virtues of an LBS bought bike vs. the BD one, I've learned my lesson with that. There's still a post goin' on about that. It seems that proponents of such are those who ride the heck out of them. Besides, you're covered with your skilled friend and problems tend to be small ones with them if they exist at all. Very minor.
I will lean heavy on the fit. I've failed more than prevailed in fitting the women in my life with bikes, learning exp. for sure. One sister rides like a guy; she hates drops but likes reach. Most others are sensitive to overly high standover and reach.
Just catching her ht. here. You need to cross exanmine her. My gut says 48 but the chart lists 50. Observing the reach though, the standover difs. are significant and could be the tie-breaker while the reach is minor. She's SO border line.
The triple's no big deal unless hills and/or long rides sre anticipated, that too is a tough call. If it DOES only come with a 25t cassete in back, you'll need to change it in any case. Will she at least consider that yellow Willow, the 48 ? It's a triple. Plenty of Top Tube and the one size larger that they're out of is a high standover, makes the dec. clearer.

JoelS

TT is the important measurement when sizing a frame. The rest of the geometry is important as well, but TT length is the biggie.

So looking at that, the BD size with the same TT length as the Spec is the 48.

If she's 5'5", I'd be going even a size smaller than that. My wife is about that height and her bike has a 47cm TT. And then a short stem. She's a bit upright, but quite comfortable. Comfortable = happy.

I think a compact crankset would make the most sense too, assuming you can find one in your price range.

coffeecake

Do you know your wife's inseam? Most women tend to have longer legs and a shorter upper body compared to men, but this doesn't apply to all women (cf. my 6' friend with a 30" inseam.) If she's got a short upper body you'll want to go with the shorter top tube as standover won't be a problem. If her inseam is shorter you'll want to watch the standover height.

CameronC

I would save the money up and buy the Dolce.

teterider

Okay, this can be tough. I could write a book on my thoughts and opinions but will have to keep this shorter. If your wife rides a 51cm Dolce, she is likely average/low height probably around 5'4-5'6. At this height (and most heights) I can say I think women really like sloping top tube frames for the stand over clearance and ease of swinging the leg over.

I caution buying a bike because it fits your budget. Yes the Motobecane is $500 and puts up some specs for that price, but will it offer you value?. I can't stress true value enough. Will she like it so much that she won't be wondering if something else would ride better in a year or two. Perhaps you wait and keep open searches for used Dolce's or something similar fitting like the Trek Pilot (or many of the other nice womens bikes) However, "mens" frames could fit her just fine if you know what to look for. You likely want a seat tube in the 73.5-74.5 range but if her height is in her legs then down to 73 would likely be good. You also want a stable trail - something around 58-62 mm. The Dolce has a very slack head tube, and coupled with a typical 43 or 45mm rake fork this would be very slow steering. Thats why they use a 51mm. This can get more intricate but can't go into now.

Another thought - the motobecane is fairly anti-girl looking. Don't under-estimate this. Perhaps it is meaningless to her, but usually they want something a little more feminine looking or colored. If she says it doesn't matter, be sure (you guys know what I mean).

My wife had a triple with a 12-25. I hate triples and I could see she did too. So much gearing overlap its just stupid. I moved her to a 50-34 compact crank with a 13-29 cassette (and mid-cage RD). Almost the identical gearing range with much less hassle and more usable gears - and she loves it, I mean loves it over the triple. But to get this I built her bike up piece by piece because you won't find it anywhere on a womans bike which all seem to have triples. The Motobecane is standard 53-39 with 12-25 or 28, and you have no choice its just what they send. She is new to road bikes as you say then this gearing it totally utterly wrong and you know you'll end up with 12-25. In months you will be buying parts to alter the gearing, throwing value out the window.

There are also close deals to be had. I'm just throwing this link out as an example.
https://www.rei.com/product/782216

For a little over $100 more you get a womens bike, with a womens saddle, compact handlebars, and compact frame.
The Jamis Ventura Sport Femme is $615 at full retail and actually uses a compact crank and not a triple, again with a frame, color, and parts for a woman.
-oops I see she rode the Marin. Well then you are already comparing.

I'm out of time.

mauisher

Be careful with advice on this topic here. I'm a 5'5" woman and ride correctly on a 52cm frame with a 53 cm top tube. Most of the earlier posters would say this frame is too large for me. Many of the generalities about women, such as having longer legs for a given height than men are not always true (see The Female Cyclist by Gale Bernhardt published by Velopress, if you want more detail about the physical differences). The problem, I think, with fitting shorter people lies with smaller frame geometries....many bike brands are quite different with varying frame angles which affect which top tube length is appropriate for your wife's height. A lot of small frames have a very steep seat angle, which affects the seat to pedal position....this really affects the reach and dictates which top tube length is best. My advice to you is go to a shop with a reputable bike fitter for advice. A good first pass guess may also be found using the bike fit calculator at www.competitivecyclist.com. Good luck!

woodduck

This is the best bit of advice. Don't just go to a shop that fits up folks, but track down a fitter.

I wanted my wife to ride with me and enjoy it. I spent the $$ with the fitting and she got a bike she loves to ride, even if it just a basic level bike. (honestly it's a good frame, with lot's of hand me down older good parts and the correct sized bars, stem, cranks and saddle etc.)

oldbobcat

What the BikesDirect geometry chart isn't telling you is the head tube length. Besides the shortened top tube, what makes the Dolce so comfortable, especially for beginners, is the extended head tube.

Specialized does indeed size its bikes by their true seat tube length.

To get the correct top tube length you'd have to get the 48 cm Motobecane. Then, to approximate the fit of the 51 Dolce, you'd need to raise the saddle 3 centimeters. purchase a riser stem to raise the handlebar at least 5 centimeters, purchase a WSD handlebar (narrower, shorter reach, ergonomic bend), and purchase a WSD saddle (the Dolce's Lithia Gel saddle alone is a major selling feature). Raising and replacing the handlebar will require longer brake and shift cables and housings, and re-wrapping the handlebar, likely with new tape.

There is a reason Dolces are so popular. Bite the bullet, enjoy free assembly, fitting, and adjustments, and buy the bike that fits right out of the box.

old and new

I like your take oldbobcat. The other members' ain't bad either.

dadof3boys

Wow, great advice here. My wife and I just got back from checking out a couple more bikes. She had a very basic fitting (competitivecyclist type with inseam, torso, arm length, etc.) from a mechanic friend of ours and it determined that her best saddle to bar distance would be around 61cm. This is exactly what the 51cm Dolce was (100mm stem on it) so that makes sense.

She rode another women's bikes (Cannondale) and really liked the feel of the women's specific frame again. She's now looking the Mercier Elle on BD for $100 more than the Mirage Pro. It has roughly the same geometry as the Dolce.

Thanks all for the advice. It's definitely helped narrow things down!

old and new