I have a post floating around about Shimano groupos.

Time for SRAM.

SRAM Apex seems to be their lowest level groupo, Apparently built for entry level racing.

My impression of SRAM is that they primarily make groupos for racing, whereas Shimano, while still making groupos for racing, also make groupos for every day riders, (2200, sora..??). Im not quite sure, but any help and discussion about their groupos vs. Shimanos would be helpful.

The MSRP for Apex is like $700, and thats their lowest level groupo. Sora was like only$200 on ribble.

SRAM vs. Shimano.

Again. Im a commuter ....might ask about Campy soon =p

Im new to looking into road cycling, so please bear with me.

Apex is price comparable to 105, both are the lowest end 10 speed groupsets offered by SRAM/Shimano. 2200 is 8 speed, Sora and Tiagra are 9 speed. SRAM doesn't have anything to compare to them. 2200 and Sora have annoying thumb levers, and you don't have to be a racer to dislike them.

Personally, I'd want Tiagra at a minimum, but if price is a problem the cheaper groupsets seem to function fine.

It's pretty hard to find a road groupset that is complete junk. They all work. Some work better, or are more comfortable to use, but any of them are better than the walmart bike grip shifters.

my 2 cents: personal preference, but here's some parameters that you can use:

i find SRAM to be more "clicky" and mechanical feeling, which i kind of prefer. not that 105 isnt' precise, i just prefer SRAM.
i do not like the Shimano shifting method. I don't like shifting the brake lever, and i don't like how the whole top of the brake opens up when you pull the brake back. SRAM, brakes are just brakes.
i do not like the Shimano 105 hood shape, i prefer SRAM's.

you should check out these things and see how you feel.

You should check out Shimano's current offerings. For their comparable groups, 105 and up, Shimano has a redesigned lever. I still don't think it's as nice as SRAM's. But the hood shape is different, the shifter no longer moves with the brake.

Anyway, the other thing Apex offers, for a commuter, is wide gear ratios without using a triple. That means cranks closer together, better front shifting (even SRAM's double shifts better than Shimano's triple up front). Apex offers the option of a medium cage rear der, and an 11-32 cassette. Pair that with a compact double (34/50) and you have some nice low gears.

Another nice thing about SRAM levers, versus shimano, for a commuter in my opinion: Easier to operate with gloves. That big shift paddle is much easier to hit with some fat gloves, and there's no getting hung up on the brake and shift paddle at once (which on my shimano levers locks the whole thing out). Of course, that only matters if it actually gets cold where you live.

It's completely up to preference. I prefer SRAM over Shimano but that's mostly because I have big hands and when in the drops, I find SRAM to shift far easier. I do prefer the hoods of 6700 over Red but the feel of the levers and paddles on the Red stuff a lot more. I also like the light *chunk* I hear with every shift on Red whereas the 6700 shifts were like butter.

Apex is really good from what I've seen (a short test ride) and I personally would choose it over 105 (or Ultegra for that matter) because I like the feel of the design. Both are very capable systems and will serve their purposes well.

It does get cold in the particular part of the bay I live.....we get pretty stupid micro climates. If anyone who lives in the bay area realizes, you could literally drive one city over and have it change from blazing heat to windy with fog rolling in from the mountians......-.-

But yeeeah. Im thinking to myself while researching for this particular build......dam. Lets keep this an American bike. American frame, american groupo lol. etc. American wheels.....a bike built in the USA!

Thanks for the input. I am still floating around Shimano for now since thats the first thread that I had posted and thus I have more information about for now. But ill continue to keep my eyes and ears open and weigh the information given to me by you more experienced people.

Good luck with that.

Does an american groupo even exist?

hAHA.....is SRAM not American?

I guess the company is. I'd thought they were based in Europe somewhere, but wiki says Chicago.

The parts, at least, are not made in the US.

That, plus the ergonomics, are why I'm seriously considering Apex for my daily rider ("I can't say "daily driver" because that would be a car ).

Id like to add about APEX,
that the 34x32 gear is amazing!! i had the oportunity of using it on the steepest hills ive ever done, and it was the only way to conquer such hills! i was hyperventilating, never have i gone up such nasty hills!! when i went down the hills i used the 50x11 and the bike had such strong torque down the hills! i got scared and used the brakes...so im yet to discover top speed on my bike....


The shifting is pretty good, cant really compare much, but it does what it does. The shifter paddle feels very solid if thats of any interest to you guys. Im pretty new to modern groups but my impression is very very very positive...it does intimidate a lot better than the tiagra and 105.

i made a thread about apex on specialized elite 2011: https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...s-of-SRAM-APEX

I don't think SRAM is made in America. Designed in the US, sure, but I think it's made in $2 labor land. The company is centered/taxed here though (AFAIK) so you are keeping more of your money here.

yep!

I have heard an attempt to compare SRAM Force to DA, which I find laughable. I have SRAM Force, because it came on an aluminum backup/beater I got. I like it well enough for that purpose but much prefer even older Dura-Ace or current Ultegra. The SRAM takes SO much force to shift in the one direction to both shift and pre-load the spring for the shift in the opposite direction. Also, that shift/preload action has poor tactile feedback in terms of letting you know if you pushed far enough to shift or just enough to negate the shift in the other direction. Try it and you will see what I mean. This applies to both front/rear left/right shifters. Different is NOT always better. The construction and precision of SRAM seems solid; I wish they would apply the same level of construction to a conventional style indexing more like Shimano.

it's not fair to compare msrp to an e-tailers price. granted, you won't find Apex for $200 but you can find Rival for 600 shipped, so I'm sure Apex will be less than that, and definitely less than 700.

How about, say, 7800 vs. Red?

Di2, FTW.

What year force is it? From your description, it sounds like it might be the original stuff. They fixed the things you're talking about in the 2009 rev, I believe.

If it fell into my hands I would take Red and sell it for cash, since it would fetch more on the open market. But if I were given one and told I had to use it on one of my bikes I would still choose 7800. Red has the same action and takes just as much effort to operate. It's especially bad when you are sweating alot and shifting is more critical...you know, like in a race. My fingers have slipped before.

It's 2010, came with the 2010 Cervelo S1.

i don't understand why everyone says sram requires so much effort to shift. i always shift mine with my pinky, or while holding the hoods, I'll kind of twist my hand and operate the paddle with the second knuckle of my index finger near the top of it (where I have the least amount of leverage) and i've never found the shifts difficult.

It is a bit harder to shift but it's not like you have to put any real force into it. Like I said, I adore Red's action because I can grip around the paddle and pull it toward the bars and flick my wrist for an upshift. I don't even have to be gripping it firmly - a light twist will shift. To me, the fact that Red has no play is far more valuable than a tiny bit more effort.

If anything, I had issues with Ultegra slipping because I had to throw the damn shifter an inch before it clicked and it only moved on the one axis. so long as you're pushing inward, SRAM will shift.


My question is, who that thinks Red is hard to shift has ridden a Red bike? I know they feel a lot stiffer just sitting there as opposed to being ridden.

That's why I wear full-finger gloves (and lightweight models are hard to find in shops)..

Not everyone has the money to spend $2700 (MSRP) on a "beater bike"...