im in the market for a new frame, and the guy at my lbs convinced me that this years aluminum ride much better than they ever have. Problem is that ive been riding steel for a long time and i love it. Problem is that i cant afford a 1500 dollar quality steel frame. Everything i can find seems to be aluminum unless its a fixie/single speed and theres no will ill be buying one of those.

he was saying how specialized "hydroformed" frames absorb a decent amount of shock blah blah blah and im wondering, how much better would an expensive aluminum frame (WITHOUT carbon rear triangle) compare to a cheap aluminum frame???

some options that im looking at:

https://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product...1_10000_200450

https://www.performancebike.com/bikes..._400001_400332

I bought a Nashbar aluminum touring frame and put a carbon fiber cyclocross fork on it. With 700x35 touring tires, it's almost as comfortable as my carbon fiber Cervelo RS. Mount 700x23 or 700x25 tires and I suspect the Nashbar's ride would be unacceptably harsh. My guess is that any other $99 aluminum frame would probably be similar.

Sound like you might be better off buying a cheap (~$400) steel frame from Soma, Surly, etc.

OP what's your budget? YOu can get into custom aluminum around $600 or so..

what im looking for is 300 for a new frame/fork. if i really should save up for more i will though.
what im looking for is a short wheel based frame that can turn fast and is extremely responsive. I never do long rides, its all in city with a lot of steep hills, so i dont think a harsh ride would matter except the fact that roads where i live are horrible, and ive only ridden old steel bikes on my roads, so they havent been that bad....

haha, my favorite thing about that Performance bike is that big notifier: "DECALS APPLIED OVER CLEARCOAT"

Yep, so you can take them off and put HUFFY stickers on instead.

OP, you can get the nashbar frame for 80 and the fork for the same. IT's almost a no brainer to at least try this. One thing to note, all those nashbar frames have much shorter top tubes than most road bikes. I am considering getting one but will probably get the touring frame because it's got a longer top tube.

I noticed nashbar now has an integrated headset road frame now too.

What happend to the Scattante SRL Comp frame and fork? Its not on Performances website anymore. Its the same as the team frame (https://www.performancebike.com/bikes...4#ReviewHeader), but without the carbon stays. Its a good solid frame that you can usually buy for $200 or less (with coupon). I have one...its decent looking and performs very well...probably about the best AL road frameset you can buy for $200.

Specialized Allez frameset goes for 550 MSRP.

Personally, I'd consider stretching the budget to it. It's exactly what you described. Road/Race geometry, bred frameset. Same short wheelbase, quick steering geometry that the Tarmac the pro's ride in the Tour and many use in Crits.
Comes with fork and seatpost, which aren't on those nashbar/performance frames.
Very high quality Al frame, it and the CAAD9/10 are probably among the best there is.

Still far south of the $1500 steel frameset you mentioned.

I've build up a nashbar road frame ( the older verison with the one inch headtube), dont expect too much from a 100 frame. the ride is good but over all I like my used dale 2.8 more.
the welding on the nashbar is a little ruff and the downtube shifter bosses is attached by a screw across the downtube.

I would spend a little more and a used dale instead.