Remember when a four hundred billion deficit sounded like a lot? And we needed to spend $800 billion to make sure unemployment stayed under 8%? Doing a helluva job there...LMAO

BTW...SRAM has run four Tours and won two. Shimano's been in business since 1921 and won nine.

I'd forgotten about the two SRAM lawsuits against Shimano. The first one, in 1990 was on unfair business practices and was settled out of court for an undisclosed amount. The second, six years later was for selling product below cost and SRAM was awarded $9 million which directly funded R&D making SRAM a more powerful competitor. Companies that do things like that, selling product below cost, are generally ones that are totally on top of their business and not feeling any heat from competitors...LOL.

Remember, if not for Shimano's f up on 10 speed product release, SRAM would never have entered the road product arena.

You can look up the ductile strength of the three metals if you like.

My point is that you folks are not pros and if you never read this you'd not know the difference. With all due repsect.

Look, I talk to people about bikes all the time and they bring "the pros do this and that" all the time. I was one once, and we are/were all primadonnas. Personally, I just shut up and rode what they gave me. Probably why I stuck with the team.

I run a Red FD and have never had a problem. Most of stuff I read out here is relating to things people have read in some magazine and it became fact (but not really) and they buy something else. Good for those of us in the bike industry.

My experience with shifting issues here with customers has been maladjusted FD's or they don't know how to shift SRAM fd's.

Remember what? Explain this comment. Are you harkening back to D.A. 7800?

I don't really care, if you like Sram, that's fine. I think Sram coming in and shaking the high end component tree is the best thing to happen to cycling since Pcad himself.

No, it was actually the Ultegra release fiasco that brought SRAM to the market. Cannondale had frames all over the place an no components. It was good for customers because ULtegra spec'd bikes started showing up mixed with DA components just to get bikes out the door. That, and Centaur bikes.

7800 was the last Shimano groupset I had.

Well Sram brings competition to the market and that rocks.

Lucky. 7800 was the LAST good mechanical group Shimano made IMHO. Also the best mechanical group ever made....also IMHO.

I have Ultegra 6700 and D.A. 7800 on two current bikes, and I've owned D.A. 7900 (mechanical) and currently have Di2 (D.A. 7920) on another. Di2 is the best. 7800 shifts the best of any mechanical group I've ridden, 6700 is pretty friggin close and it has modern hidden cables. Very impressed with 6700.

the mets do suck

Please elaborate. Cite your sources.

I have all three (Red, Force, Rival) and can verify that they all do, in fact, blow. Otherwise, SRAM is good stuff.

That Super Six EVO is pretty light schwag.

Giants fan here, di 2 is for lazy old men that have no movement in their hands and wrists and my red fd works just as good as my force fd, its all about adjustment

I agree with kimco that that new Evo rocks.

Sram can make the best componentry on the planet in every other way, but a flawed FD is utterly fatal for a groupset. Which you would only fully understand if you rocked Shimano Di2 which has the world's first First Perfect Front Derailleur that Trims Itself Automatically.

Pcad knows, because Pcad rocks the Di2. The rest of you are pretenders to the BF Holy See of Velo Wisdom, and you will all rot in hell for that, particularly if you are also a conservative Republican and/or a Steelers fan.

That's like saying the 2011 Houston Astros are as good as the 2011 NY Mets. No offense to the Mets, who have arguably played more over their heads than any other team in MLB this year what with half their starting stars on the DL and all that ownership turmoil.

That particular section in hell has cable TV, but it only gets old Bill Maher show re-runs.

your guys are only 12 games out, and paly better away than home,and why are we talking about b/ball on a bike forum

I rode 7900, and it sucked so bad I never looked back. 7900 was so bad that the pro Shimano teams were taking if off their bikes and going back to 7800. And at the end of the day all Shimano really wanted to do was hide the cables. That and providing a job to an old East German to design the giant shifters.

I've ridden Di2, it's nice and (probably like you) can get it for a song being in the business. But I didn't find it enough better than what I had. I have a longer attention span that Pcad. ;)

I am also capable of operating and adjusting a front derailleur, something that appears to be lacking out here.

Just something else to laugh at. Like an eight hundred billion stimulus for those "shovel ready jobs"...I get my shovel out every time Barry hits my tv screen. He still have not sent me a stimulus check for my shovel work, however.

Republicans have plenty of such implements, they do have a lot of shlit to shovel.

So does my cat.

Unless you have ridden Di2 at length (i.e. 30-50+ miles) I don't think you can appreciate how cool it really is. Around the block doesn't do it.

I can understand your bitterness. Especially living in the worst rated state in the nation. Considering California, that's no mean feat.

Over here in my state, AKA flyover country we have a budget surplus, low taxes, and low unemployment as we pick off companies from places like Illinois and Michigan.

Will you be the last New Yorker turning off the light? ;)

As someone mentioned above there are two versions of the sram red fd. One has the Ti cage(matte gray) and the other is a tuned force/rival fd with a steel cage and Ti hardware. This came with my group and I have zero issues with the shifting.

No, I think that will be someone at least 100 miles north of here. Actually A. Cuomo has been kicking ass and taking names in Albany in a very low key way, and he's a Democrat. Remember the name, he'll beat M. Romney in the 2016 elections after President Obama finishes his second term. By then you'll be living in a heavily fortified compound in rural northern Idaho with Soloist Assassin.

No. I'll be buying Rosetta Stone to work on my Mandarin. Either that or move to Canada to live with my wife's relatives. Since they are undoing their nationalized health care, their currency is kicking ours in the ass, and they voted out all the liberals (now a minority party at best) it makes sense. Basically becoming what we used to be.

I'd go back to Europe, but we are becoming what they are now. Or Greece.

Pcadette probably needs to take Mandarin or some Chinese dialect in college so she'll be able to communicate with the powers that be.

Word has it there's a new government program to pass out Di2 free because it's not fair that some people cannot afford it. We have to be fair, you know. So free Di2, but you have to be in the 51% of Americans that pay no federal income tax, and Shimano can start to recover their market share.

Oh, and everyone now gets a trophy in USAC sanctioned races.
;)

Mandarin? Dang. I just got the Rosetta Stone for Spanish. I thought THAT was the future! Oh, wait, I'm in SoCal. It is the NOW!

How long till this thread on a derailer gets moved to P&R?

Well played....

Hey, it's Pcad's fault. He can't help it. I just play defense. He knows I'm right so that's all he's got.

And it's "derailleur"...;) Also note in my next to the last paragraph in post #54 I used Di2 twice to keep it on topic. ;)

Indeed. I keep going back to a conversation I had with a Garmin pro when it came out....great story about why we were calling. His brother told me he was dating another racer's sister, and I had thought that sister was a married woman.....so being a concerned brother he called his bro under the guise of asking how he liked 7900.

Roughly "So Rob says he saw you guys were riding the new DA at Missouri. What did you think?"
"The old stuff was so much better. This stuff sucks."

Fast forward and I find myself fixing that exact rig and thinking to myself, "this stuff sucks".

Bored and cant let this go. A material's stiffness is rated by it's Young's Modulus; higher = stiffer.

Esteel: ~200 Gpa.
Etitanium alloys: ~115 Gpa.

That being said, a part's stiffness depends on more than just the material it's made out of.

And what the hell is 'ductile strength'? Are you talking about yield strength, because that has nothing to do with stiffness.

This I can get behind.

I think you're an incredibly arrogant idiot, but I give you a pass because you seem to know something about bicycle crap.

I agree with this, ive noticed that as my cables have stretched, especially in a lower gear on my cassette, itll take longer to shift to my largest front chainring, sometimes ridiculously so, than on the smaller cogs on my cassette. or maybe ive just convinced myself of that. GL and hope its not the equipment!