cuda2k

Starting to shop for new wheels for an upcoming project in the spring. Original thought about going with the popular XR-300/270 rims, but this is a steel frame, and while modern steel, wanted to keep some element of classic style to the build. So I then stumbled upon the HED Belgium C2 & Velocity A23 rims.

Researching the two, I am leaning to the HED rim with its welded seam and machined sidewalls which should provide the best braking performance and feel (in addition to being supposedly the better finished rim also). One thing I can absolutely not stand pulsing when braking, I have an old set of Campy Omega 19 rims, and while perhaps an extreme of what pulsing is, I nearly hate getting on that bike and really need to get around to trying to take a sanding block to the seam one of these days.

Which brings us back around to the Velocity rim, which I have heard report of similar sort of behavior from it's sleeved/pinned/what ever seam that it has. The wheel builder I have been speaking to doesn't work with the HED rim and has recommended the Velocity in its place, but before I do so I want to be sure I'll be happy with the wheelset once it is complete.

Thanks in advance.

ruindd

I built up a set for my dad, but haven't ridden them much. So far so good, no problems.

lazerzxr

Im looking at building up a set of velocity fusion 700c wheels but dont have any experience of the A23. I'm also interested in other experience with velocity rims.

also from the web site the A23 has a machined rim. By the look of the cross section it must be a welded rim since there are no channels to install pins?

cuda2k

The A23 is probably sleeved if not pinned. I doubt it is welded based on what I had read, but you are right that the sidewall is machined.

canam73

I have A23 rimmed wheels. They do have machined sidewalls and are sleeved. But the joints on both of mine are just as smooth as a set of welded Mavics that I have and do not cause any noticeable brake pulse.

Fwiw I use my A23s on a modern looking aluminum bike. But I do have a retro looking Waterford (panel paint scheme) that I use Velocity Razor rims on and it looks great.

cyclezen

have 700+ mi on my HED Kermesse C2s, I luv them. 24/24

just put 150 mi on my new A23's this past wkend. Built by a local builder of much skill and some renown - these are also very fine, 20/24.
both ridden on a tarmac
They feel differnet from the HEDs, but not better or worse. I like them alot. I aired them to 90 front and 97-98 rear for the riding - John builds a verys stiff wheel. I think I'm gonna air them down a bit more to 85/95.I'm not expecting any lose in performance, the tires I have are no where near being spongy at that pressure, in fact they are very light and have a very lively feel at those pressures - 90 on the front feels like 105 on a normal rim.
I'm 165 lbs...

I think the A23 (or HED) would be a great fit and take a lot of the 'bite' out of a long ride on a steel fork. Gonna give them a try on my Titan for a 75+ ride in the next week or so...
It comes down to the wheel builder and decent tires.

Honestly don;t know how the rim join is finished, and really don;t care much - both the HEDs and A23s have good reputations - good enough for me.

valleycyclist

Another 23mm wide rim that looks nice on classic-looking bikes is the Velocity Synergy.

halfspeed

Once it's machined, what difference does it make whether the joint is welded, pinned or crazy glued?

cuda2k

canam & cyclezen - thanks for the feedback. Exactly the sort of information I was looking for. If these wheels were for any of my other bikes, I probably wouldn't care as much, but these are being build for my "dream bike", a Kirk Frameworks custom that should be completed some time late March. My 30th b-day present to myself, that should be arriving just around my 31st b-day.

halfspeed - some sleeved/pinned join rims can have a bump at the joint, even if they were machined. Don't know exactly what causes it, perhaps there is some torque induced on the seam from the spokes once the wheel is built. I know my old Omega 19's with the non-machined sidewall probably isn't a fair comparison to the effect with a machined sidewall, but again, this is going on my new Kirk so I'd like to eliminate any possible disappointments in performance and feel if I can.

WhyFi

My front is an A23 - I haven't noticed any pulsing under heavy braking. I echo the sentiment that it feels lively and readily flickable, but I wouldn't assume to attribute it to whether it's because of the weight or the wider profile.

Grasschopper

Given this statement I would say spend a little more and get the HEDs.

Gummee

I've got lots of wheels. They all pretty much feel the same.

Run em if it makes you happy.

Tire pressure makes more difference than rim width.

M

cuda2k

That's going to require either twisting PSIMET's arm, buying the rims myself and having them shipped to Rob, or going with a different builder.

I've already taken up a fair bit of Robs time with emails regarding the wheel build (changed my mind mid-way from the XR-300 to the wider options), so out of respect for him I'd like to spend my money there. ProWheelBuilder.com will do the HED/White Industries build at an attractive price, but recent reviews haven't been completely positive and I like interacting directly with a wheel builder. Brain (RidgebackWheels) who did the Ambrioso/Campy wheels I have on my Serotta has his hands full with his day job and a young addition to his family. And Eric at Ergottwheels.com, and WheelBuilder.com both also will do the build at the upper reaches of what my budget for the wheels would be.

Tunnelrat81

I found a much better price on the HED C2 rims at fairwheelbikes.com when I was shopping. I ended up buying them from another online store that was willing to price-match for me, but only because I was buying spokes there too and wanted to order them both together. If you're just buying rims, order them at the best price and have them shipped straight to Rob, problem solved.

Or, just go with the A23's. I trust that they are great rims too, and they are certainly lighter, and will look more traditional (barely). The next wheelset that I build is going to be for my wife, and I'll be using the A23s on White Industries hubs, with CX-ray spokes. I'll be ordering the parts from Psimet this time.

The HED's do look better, but I I doubt they function any better than the A23s do. If anything they might be a slightly stronger rim because of the added weight and depth, but if built well, this shouldn't make much of a difference.

-Jeremy

canam73

One more note on the A23s: mine weighed in at around 445 a piece, a bit more than listed. I personally don't care, but if someone is choosing them over HED because of weight be aware that you may not get as much savings as you think.

mazdaspeed

I've heard rave reviews about the A23, plus they come in silver. I'm sure the HED's are great rims too but with a competent builder I doubt the difference is noticeable. Also if psimet is recommending the A23 for you I'm sure it's great. No need to hand wring and go overboard IMO

cyclezen

Dream bike and all, either rim will give you the service you'll want. As for durability, besides the wheel builder's contribution, I think there are enough riders who have put some longterm miles on A23 rims (like valleycyclist) to say that they are not easy to trash.
If it's a cosmetic thing, well then that's a choice to make
as for performance and ride, the rubber, tire and tube, you put on will make the real difference.
ultimately, if you have more than one bike, you may find that you like the wide rim enough to dump the narrow rim wheelsets and get some more wide rim sets... hence another opportunity to decide on HED.
if , however, the wide rim doesn;t do it for you, then maybe you won;t feel so bad about not having spent more on the HED C2s.

Barrettscv 

+1

I have 3000 miles on a set of A23 rims with zero issues. Braking is excellent. I now have a two sets of these rims, one on my steel frame CX bike another on my Carbon-fiber road bike. Great performance with both sets.